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01 possibly in limp mode, ideas?

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Old 02-15-2015, 03:31 PM
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Default 01 possibly in limp mode, ideas?

It's a 2001 2.3L ULEV Accord. The cat has been bad for a while, lots of rattling.

Cliff notes of events:
I was trying to replace my cat.
I had my car up on ramps with the battery on, playing music.
I removed the secondary o2 sensor.
I beat the hell out of my old cats rusted bolts, even cut one with a sawzall, and failed to remove anything.
I put the o2 sensor back in.
My battery had been running the radio for about 3 hours.

Error codes:
Once I started the car my CEL was on and D4 was blinking. I checked the codes and got:
70)
P0700, P0715, P0720, P0725, P0730, P0740, P0753, P0758, P0763, P0780 A/T Concerns
P1660 A/T FI Signal A Circuit Failure

20)
P1297 Electrical Load Detector Circuit Low Input
P1298 Electrical Load Detector Circuit High Input

41)
P0135 Front HO2S Heater Circuit Fault (Sensor 1)
P1166 Primary HO2S (No. 1) Heater System Electrical
P1167 Primary HO2S (No. 1) Heater System

and 65)
P0141 Secondary HO2S Heater Circuit Fault (Sensor 2)

I was unable to find the meaning of the TCM code from the D4 light, I'm pretty sure it blinked 16.

Original symptoms:
The physical symptoms that I've seen are that the transmission clunks when going over, and especially when going into, reverse. It feels like hitting a speed bump too fast. The power is also severely limited, I can't get past 2500 RPM. Highest speed I've taken it to was 40, not sure how much higher it would go.

Logic would seem to dictate that I fried my secondary o2 sensor somehow, but I've never heard of that causing these kinds of problems. Any help?

Symptoms update:
I decided to try to drive down the road to pick up a new o2 sensor. I got to about 55 mph, but the interior and exterior lights became progressively dimmer and the speedometer started waving around like a loon. I turned around to head back home, but the power was significantly less, I made it to maybe 10 mph before pulling over. My car is now dead in someones yard. I jumped it which did start the engine, so I'm guessing that means the dizzy is fine, but it quickly lost power and died again. So alternator?

Possibly useful info:
I think it would be a pretty odd coincidence if removing the o2 sensor had nothing to do with this. Maybe I damaged the wire on the sensor, shorted it, and caused damage somewhere else? It may be worth noting that I have noticed I'm missing 1 or 2 ground wires on the engine. The alternator also always seemed to be weak (head lights would dim when raising a window).

I can't change the title but I think this should now be "01 limped and died"....

Last edited by Kanga; 02-15-2015 at 05:15 PM.
Old 02-15-2015, 05:26 PM
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Default Re: 01 possibly in limp mode, ideas?

Originally Posted by Kanga
I was trying to replace my cat.
I had my car up on ramps with the battery on, playing music.
I removed the secondary o2 sensor.
I beat the hell out of my old cats rusted bolts, even cut one with a sawzall, and failed to remove anything.
I put the o2 sensor back in.
It's not a good idea to have the car ON or battery connected when doing electrical work on the car. Something that would normally be harmless may cause a short when the car is left ON. Or simply when the car is ON and you disconnect a sensor or component it will cause the CEL/D4 lamps to trip. Or worse you short out a powered on connector.
Originally Posted by Dieskyver
Once I started the car my CEL was on and D4 was blinking. I checked the codes and got:
70)
P0700, P0715, P0720, P0725, P0730, P0740, P0753, P0758, P0763, P0780 A/T Concerns
P1660 A/T FI Signal A Circuit Failure
Code 70 from the CEL lamp is a junk code. You need to retrieve transmission code(s) from the D4 lamp, better would be an OBDII code reader to attain the actual p07**/P17** codes.

No such code as P1660. MuthaFodder list is nice, but it has several errors.
Originally Posted by Dieskyver
20)
P1297 Electrical Load Detector Circuit Low Input
P1298 Electrical Load Detector Circuit High Input
Combined with the above code 70, I'm leaning towards you either pulled or cut a wire or connector somewhere and there is now an open in the system.
Originally Posted by Dieskyver
41)
P0135 Front HO2S Heater Circuit Fault (Sensor 1)
P1166 Primary HO2S (No. 1) Heater System Electrical
P1167 Primary HO2S (No. 1) Heater System
If the car was ON and you disconnected the sensor this code could be triggered.
Originally Posted by Dieskyver
and 65)
P0141 Secondary HO2S Heater Circuit Fault (Sensor 2)
Same as above.

Originally Posted by Dieskyver
I was unable to find the meaning of the TCM code from the D4 light, I'm pretty sure it blinked 16.
Second page of the code page has the TCU DTCs in OBDI and OBDII format.

Originally Posted by Dieskyver
The physical symptoms that I've seen are that the transmission clunks when going over, and especially when going into, reverse. It feels like hitting a speed bump too fast. The power is also severely limited, I can't get past 2500 RPM. Highest speed I've taken it to was 40, not sure how much higher it would go.
With that many codes set the car is most likely in limp mode.

Originally Posted by Dieskyver
Logic would seem to dictate that I fried my secondary o2 sensor somehow, but I've never heard of that causing these kinds of problems. Any help?
You did a bit more than that.

Originally Posted by Dieskyver
Symptoms update:
I decided to try to drive down the road to pick up a new o2 sensor. I got to about 55 mph, but the interior and exterior lights became progressively dimmer and the speedometer started waving around like a loon. I turned around to head back home, but the power was significantly less, I made it to maybe 10 mph before pulling over. My car is now dead in someones yard. I jumped it which did start the engine, so I'm guessing that means the dizzy is fine, but it quickly lost power and died again. So alternator?
If the ELD is burned out, the battery will not be charged by the alternator.
ELD controls alternator on/off time. It is most likely not charging. And you were only running off the battery.

Originally Posted by Dieskyver
I think it would be a pretty odd coincidence if removing the o2 sensor had nothing to do with this. Maybe a damaged the wire on the sensor, shorted it, and caused damage somewhere else?
Yeop.

Originally Posted by Dieskyver
It may be worth noting that I have noticed I'm missing 1 or 2 ground wires on the engine. The alternator also always seemed to be weak (head lights would dim when raising a window).
Hard to know, don't know the history of the car nor what has been damaged/disconnected.

Originally Posted by Dieskyver
I can't change the title but I think this should now be "01 limped and died"....
I have a more appropriate title in mind, but I'm not going to kick you while you are down.
Old 02-15-2015, 05:37 PM
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Default Re: 01 possibly in limp mode, ideas?

Originally Posted by MAD_MIKE
If the ELD is burned out, the battery will not be charged by the alternator.
ELD controls alternator on/off time. It is most likely not charging. And you were only running off the battery.
So is replacing the ELD my biggest problem here or would there be more damage? Along with the o2 sensor that I most likely damaged.

Originally Posted by MAD_MIKE
I have a more appropriate title in mind, but I'm not going to kick you while you are down.
"Idiot beats his car into limp mode, then lets it die" lol better?

Also, the D4 code is:
16. A/T Clutch Pressure Control Solenoid Valve A
Old 02-15-2015, 05:46 PM
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Default Re: 01 possibly in limp mode, ideas?

Originally Posted by Kanga
So is replacing the ELD my biggest problem here or would there be more damage? Along with the o2 sensor that I most likely damaged.
Pull your battery and have it fully charged. Check your fuses and look for any damaged wires.
The ELD is controlled by the ECM.
It is possible that you simply shorted out a circuit somewhere and blew a fuse.
Check your underhood fuse and relay boxes, as well as the two fuse panels in the passenger compartment, one in each foot well.

Originally Posted by Kanga
"Idiot beats his car into limp mode, then lets it die" lol better?
Mine is more 'colorful'.
Old 02-15-2015, 05:57 PM
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Default Re: 01 possibly in limp mode, ideas?

The funky socket that I used to get the o2 sensor off easily could have dug into the wires and shorted them. So it sounds like this is likely a simple electrical problem, e.g. something an idiot like me could handle without having the car towed to a mechanic?

Would there be any harm in charging the battery while connected, so I can then drive from the persons yard back to my house, and look over the fuses? It's only like a mile away. Or would I be potentially causing more serious damage?

Thank you for helping me.
Old 02-15-2015, 09:45 PM
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Default Re: 01 possibly in limp mode, ideas?

If there is a short in the system it may take longer to charge the battery, slow drain.
Disconnect the battery terminals and just charge it that way, you might find something when moving the cables.
Old 02-16-2015, 07:49 AM
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Default Re: 01 possibly in limp mode, ideas?

I charged the battery up and confirmed that the alternator wasn't giving juice by disconnecting the battery while the engine was running. I then drove it home, disconnected the battery, and started looking at fuses. I pulled the ELD, along with the two fuses next to it that hold it down. Everything looked fine. I checked the cabin fuses and my cruise control fuse was blown, though I think that's been blown for over a year now. Anyway, I replaced it.

Reconnected the battery to drive up on some ramps and replace the o2 sensor, but when I started it everything was back to normal. Does that make any sense? Did the ECM maybe just need to be cleared?
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