SleepersOwn

Ok, first off. This will be somewhat lengthy ( so you might wanna get a sammach ) and will require KNOWLEDGEABLE opinions on the products provided as well as input on unbiased suggestions. I'm a NEWBIE to the audio field and would like to be understood as such. I'm learning as I go along but i'm FAR from what alot of ppl in here know/understand.

The Current:

I have a 92 camry sedan as of current i'm running two polk 6.5 comps in the front and polk 6x9's in the rear. Controlled by a Pioneer deh-4900 deck and pushed by a kicker zx350.4 amp. This all sounds fairly decent together ( although rattles are becoming more of a problem. I already ordered the fatmat xtreme speaker kit to try and combat this problem.. if it works i'll order a 50ft roll and do my trunk and doors ).


The Goals:

I'm looking for a nice 12". My music preferences range from 80-90% rap, r&b and reggae with a 10-20% choice for rock and stuff. I'm interested in decent spl ( i do love the bump ) but i don't want to sacrafice TOO much SQ to do it. I'm looking in the range of spending $300-400 ( i'll push to 450 if needed ). With the prices of online stores i frequent ( techronics, sonicelectronix etc ) i feel this is very doable for both amp and sub/box.

The Subs:

Now in my research among what i've understood i've compiled a relatively small list of subs that might work for my goals. As you'll see in the choices, I think a rms range of 300-600w will be sufficent ( i'm aware that is a fairly decent jump but bare with me ). I typed what i felt would be the most important as far as specs. I'll start with the max power i'm looking for then go down.


1. DIAMOND AUDIO D6
RMS WATT: 600
SURROUND: rubber
IMPEDANCE: 4 ohms
FREQ RESPONSE: 22-250hz
SEALED BOX VOL: .875
PORTED BOX VOL: 1.25
PRICE: $154.99 Shipped

( I heard this sub in a custom ported box being pushed by an alpine 600rms amp, this sound VERY GOOD as far as my expectations goes )

2. CERWIN VEGA VMAX 12
RMS WATT: 600
SURROUND: Ellipsoid ( i have no idea what material that is )
IMPEDANCE: 2 or 4 ohm
FREQ RESPONSE: 20-500hz
SEALED BOX VOL: .7 cu ft
PORTED BOX VOL: 1 cu ft
PRICE: $109.99

3. HIFONICS Bx12d4 ( Brutus )
RMS WATT: 600
SURROUND: RUBBER
IMPEDANCE: 4 ohms
FREQ RESPONSE: ???
SEALED BOX VOL: 1.0 cu ft
PORTED BOX VOL: 1.0 cu ft
PRICE: $ A lil over 90 shipped

4. KICKER 05CVR
RMS WATT: 400
SURROUND: RUBBER
IMPEDANCE: 2 or 4 ohm
FREQ RESPONSE: 25-500hz
SEALED BOX VOL: 1.0 cu ft
PORTED BOX VOL: 1.75-2.25 cu ft
PRICE: $75

5.PIONEER PREMIER TSW1207
RMS WATT: 400
SURROUND: Fiber Woven Radial
IMPEDANCE: 2 or 4 ohm
FREQ RESPONSE: 18-500hz
SEALED BOX VOL: .85- 1.75 ( 1.25 recommended )
PORTED BOX VOL: 1.25-2.05 ( 1.65 recommended )
PRICE: $60

6. POLK MM2124
RMS WATT: 400
SURROUND: rubber
IMPEDANCE: 4ohm
FREQ RESPONSE: 23-200hz
SEALED BOX VOL: ??
PORTED BOX VOL: ??
PRICE: $99

7. INFINITY KAPPA 124.7W
RMS WATT: 350
SURROUND: rubber
IMPEDANCE: 2-8ohms
FREQ RESPONSE: 23-400hz
SEALED BOX VOL: 1.0 cu ft
PORTED BOX VOL: 2.0 cu ft
PRICE: $ 119.99

8. MB QUART DWG 304 ( i think dwe's are the new ones ..anyway )
RMS WATT: 350
SURROUND: rubber
IMPEDANCE: 4 ohms
FREQ RESPONSE: 20-300hz
SEALED BOX VOL: ??
PORTED BOX VOL: ??
PRICE: $ 65

9. JBL GTO1202D
RMS WATT: 300
SURROUND: rubber
IMPEDANCE: 2 or 4 ohm
FREQ RESPONSE: 23-400hz
SEALED BOX VOL: 1.0
PORTED BOX VOL: 1.75
PRICE: $ 65

This concludes the sub list.

The Questions:

I'm looking for any recommendations out of this list. If you can stay within the subs provided that would be coo, however, if you have alternative that you believe will fit this application, by all means post them up. I've only been able to hear the d6's and cvr's out of that list personally. I'm not looking into Alpine type r's so please don't recommend them ( as most ppl usually do ). As far as the impedance goes...when it comes to 2 or 4 ohms ... does it really matter on the sub itself or will the amp be the determining factor.

Ok, seeing as how this is pretty long as it is now...i'll wait for a couple of recommendation posts before i post up the amp list i have. Let the advice begin !!!

oh and thanks for ANY advice given on this subject..i know it was lengthy, and if you really read all of that crap, GOD BLESS YOU !!!

fcm

OK, lets get the slamming out of the way, your car sucks.

Now for the good stuff, I will start with speaker impedance, ideally you should have a 4 ohm or higher load to the amp, with lower impedance's SQ is effected, if you can afford it an 8 ohm load is great, however, keep in mind that most amps output is halved when impedance is doubled EG; an amp that is rated at 600W RMS into 4 ohms is 1200W into 2 ohms or 300W into 8 ohms. so if you want to run a 600W continuous, [RMS] DVC 4 ohm sub, [VCs wired in series] at 8 ohms for best SQ, you will need an amp that is rated at 1200W RMS into 4 ohms, to get you 600W RMS into an 8 ohm load, see where the higher cost comes in.

To keep things simple look for a SVC 4 ohm or DVC 2 ohm sub, [you may want to look at JL Audio subs also.

For amps, look for mono block sub amps as opposed to bridgeable 2ch amps.

Of the subs you list, the DA D6 or the MB Quart would be my picks, I am no fan of the Hifonics or the JBL, the others would be a 2nd choice with the Infinity at the top of the list and the Pioneer at the bottom.

Personal "sound" preference plays a big roll in choice of any speakers.

A couple more things, your Kicker amp is 2x110W RMS into 4 ohms, 220W total, a good ratio is 3:1 3 times the high-pass wattage for the sub bass, so a 600W sub system would be good, not to say a 300W would not work.
The phrase "it's better to be over-powered then under powered" relates to the amps RMS output in relation to the subs continuous power handling, for better dynamic headroom it is better to drive a 500W sub with a 600W amp then a 600W sub with a 500W amp although both will work, the possibility of damaging the subs VC is greatly increased when under-powered, as the likelihood of driving the amp into constant clipping is greatly increased when under-powered and of coarse, you loose clean dynamic headroom.

Did I mention your car sucks 94

SleepersOwn

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by fcm &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
To keep things simple look for a SVC 4 ohm or DVC 2 ohm sub, [you may want to look at JL Audio subs also.

For amps, look for mono block sub amps as opposed to bridgeable 2ch amps.

Of the subs you list, the DA D6 or the MB Quart would be my picks, I am no fan of the Hifonics or the JBL, the others would be a 2nd choice with the Infinity at the top of the list and the Pioneer at the bottom.

</TD></TR></TABLE>

LOL @ fcm. Your one of the main people i wanted to chime in on my thread. I was actually going to put " and if one of your fawks say " this is honda-tech .. you have a toyota " i'll kill you " but lol, i said eh screw it..

Anyway, yea, i'm using the 4 channel just for my interiors. I'm definitely planning on purchasing a mono for the sub. Ok, so as far as the suggestions on sub picks, i heard a w3 and they sound great ( they were only powered 1/2 way as well ). I see them for $198 with free shipping .. the only thing is i wanted to see if i could a custom box for them.

Crykie, i would really like to write a proper reply but i'm LATE FOR WORK !!! LOL

Thanks so far !! i'll chime in when possible !

suspendedHatch

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SleepersOwn &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

LOL @ fcm. Your one of the main people i wanted to chime in on my thread. I was actually going to put " and if one of your fawks say " this is honda-tech .. you have a toyota " i'll kill you " but lol, i said eh screw it.. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Yeah that's my line. Why did you even mention you have a Toyota? If fcm hadn't already made such a huge reply, I would have deleted your thread.

What draws you to Honda Tech if you have a Toyota? I have nothing against Toyotas. My first two cars were Toyotas. And I was a regular at http://www.club4ag.com, which is a better forum than HT in general. I would never have expected to find relevant answers to my Toyota-specific questions here, or at mustangworld etc. And if your question isn't Toyota specific, well then re-read my second sentence.

SleepersOwn

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by suspendedHatch &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Yeah that's my line. Why did you even mention you have a Toyota? If fcm hadn't already made such a huge reply, I would have deleted your thread.

What draws you to Honda Tech if you have a Toyota? I have nothing against Toyotas. My first two cars were Toyotas. And I was a regular at http://www.club4ag.com, which is a better forum than HT in general. I would never have expected to find relevant answers to my Toyota-specific questions here, or at mustangworld etc. And if your question isn't Toyota specific, well then re-read my second sentence.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Well mostly cuz i've been on this site for a good while. I started learning about import/car performance in general on this site. I've always wanted an accord when i lived out in nyc but i moved out to az before i got one. When i got out here i was looking for an accord but i needed wheels too desperately and this camry was the best thing i could find at the time. Besides, my questions are only based on audio which i feel is a pretty general subject regardless of any vehicle. I would never ask any maintenance questions or real car specific questions on here..that would be kind of asinine. I would go on toyotanation.com but, their site goes a lil slower than this one ( like a day or two slower lol ).


So, as i've been thinking while at work...i think i may end up getting the mb quart sub since it's a decent sub and works with my power range ( not to mention it's pretty damn inexpensive as well ). That or either a Diamond D3...

I'm on lunch right now so i can't really put that much down. When i get off work, i'll put up the amps i have to get some input choices as well.

Until then...as far as box preference...prefab'd or custom ? ( i know the ans would be custom ) but is there anything really wrong with a prefab'd box ? If the choice of sub would be between the MB Quart or a Diamond D3 and the box was around the vol size spec'd ( i'll probably want a ported box ) would it be ok to get a prefab'd one ?

oh yea, thanks suspended hatch for not closing this thread !

fcm

Custom boxes for JL Audio subs are available from JL Audio.

If you go with a sealed box then just find one with as close to recommended volume as possible, for the sub you get, if it's a little bigger you can always add some bracing, [lacking in most prefab boxes] to drop volume, some wood sealer on the inside of box would also be a good idea.

If you want a vented box, I would go custom, unlike a sealed box where a 10% +/- in volume will not make a noticeable diff., it would on a vented box, also port volume is critical, it can make or break sub bass response.

To you and Hatch I replied because the post was not car specific, if it had been I would not have because your car sucks, not because its a Toyota or because it's a Camry but because it's a 4door, Toyota 4 doors . 94