2phast

This is an LS/Vtec, Fully built internals, 8.6 compression.
B18b1 with a lightly ported JDM B16a head.
Eagle/Wiseco/Balanced rotating assembly/Bored Type R intake/
Turbonetics T3-04E 50 trim .48 exhaust/ 38mm Tial/ Blitz BOV/
Inline Pro T4 Manifold/ 750cc Saturated injectors/ Hondata S200B

This is my first Honda Motor build. I'm hooked
I built this to enter Hillclimbs. Hopefully in the spring.

The tune was done at Knowledge Performance outside of Atlanta.
These Dyno sheets are a little blurry. Had to photo them.

With 7.7lbs of boost on 93 pump gas.
The numbers are from a Dynapack.
HP: 188.5 at 95mph at 6327rpm
Torque: 191.1ft/lb @70mph at 4717rpm
Full Boost at 3500rpm

This is a brand new build so I am going to run it for about a 1000 miles at the
7.7lbs to break it in, then it's going to 20lbs.

Tuner says that with my low compression that my HP numbers will jump alot
when I go to 20lbs.
I'm loving the Torque, you can really feel it.
I haven't seen to many Honda Dyno #s where the torque was higher than the
HP.
Ralph

b16sedan

Most people at that boost level are seeing 60 WHP more than that on stock LS (non vtec) motors on lower reading dynojets. Something sounds funky about these numbers, how much timing is in it?

AbitAvenger

i think its because of the 8.6 : 1 compression ratio, cant wait to see the dyno of it at 20lbs

2phast

I think the numbers look funny because of my low compression. 8.6CR.
The setup was built to run 20lb, this is just to break in the new internals.
With 20lbs I should see a much bigger numbers because the dynamic
compression will jump.
Pretty unusual to see a Honda with Torque numbers bigger that the Horsepower #s
I know one thing for sure, it sure is fun to play with, Nasty torque.

0xenocron

Something is severly wrong...you hit peak torque before 5000rpms and then it DRASTICALLY drops off.

8.6 compression might lower you peak HP numbers by 5-10 hp...not 60-80.

7psi on a LS/Vtec you should see 230-240 whp easy.

ccfab

agreed

Adi Radoncic

I'll join in on this "your numbers are funky thread".....


Did you guys not see this Turbonetics T3-04E 50 trim .48 exhaust
This is not a bandwagon sc61 thread..

You'll c your car jump in power once you get it to 20psi.

2phast

I have an 8.5 lb act flywheel and a lightened crank and a Type N
lightweight pulley. All balanced together, but this lightweight rotating assembly
may contribute to the torque drop because of a lack of inertia.
Ralph

wantboost

iTrader: (2)

that ctr pulley is gonna butt **** your oil pump.

and how did you get a t3 turbo on a t4 manifold...

boosted92

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Adi Raaa &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I'll join in on this "your numbers are funky thread".....


Did you guys not see this Turbonetics T3-04E 50 trim .48 exhaust
This is not a bandwagon sc61 thread..

You'll c your car jump in power once you get it to 20psi. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Yeah, and Jeff tuned a stock GSR with the exact same turbo that made 285 WHP @ 10 psi. 2 pounds less boost and 1.5 points in compression loss paired with more displacement and a ported don't equal 100 WHP less power.

speeddave

ef setups are great, numbers might be low, but hes breakin the thing in. if hes down a lot of power when he retunes it for 20psi then i'd be worried. is it a hatch or crx?

edit: his numbers do seem low for 8psi on a ls/vtec, maybe tuned too conservative?


Modified by speeddave at 8:07 PM 8/27/2005


Modified by speeddave at 8:08 PM 8/27/2005

0xenocron

Does no one notice how fucked his Torque curve is?

Look at this graph and then look at his

wantboost

iTrader: (2)

yea i noticed.. its pretty bad

abnaasefmb

what wantboost said about all though lightweight parts. i have no idea what up with the tq falling off like that. if your doing climb events your going to want a conservative tune on that, wrap the down pipe as well. Staying in boost will produce a lot of heat. Places where that will bite you in the *** are the pistons (hope you went on the big side of the specs.) and oil temp, basically the down pipe will cook the oil making you lose viscosity. Just some things to keep in mind.

2phast

It is a 90 DX Hatchback.

The timing gears are on (both intake and exhaust) "0" degrees.
I guess you would call that conservative

"Wantboost" I made Stainless sandwich adapter plate to be able to use the T4
manifold. I chose the T4 so I could mount my Turbo on the drivers side. I had
radiator issues with this 4th gen car, and I wanted Stainless to keep the manifold weight down and still have the large runners in a cast manifold.
I still have the CAD model and drawing of the adapter if anyone should need it.

I am going to give it about 2 weeks then I will take it to the local 1/8 mile and see
what it does before it goes back to the dyno.

I have looked at a bunch of dyno results for Turbo LS/vtecs.
ie:http://www.tunedbylorange.com/LSTdyno.JPG
This is very close to my setup, (same turbo size)

The drop in Torque shows up in most of them, but not as sharply as it does in mine.
This is a JDM YS1 transmission by the way.

Boostfed

Ralph you have a restriction somewhere or a problem if you are hitting peak whp at 6375rpm then dropping!!!! Check VTEC, do you have a CAT converter, may be clogged up. You have more Torque than HP because you have already hit your peak torque BUT you haven't hit your peak hp yet. You have a bottleneck in teh system somewhere sir. You power should have kept climbing to about 8krpm at least, what cams are in this motor? I realize you have a small .48 A/R turbine housing BUT still should not limit you this bad, is the boost dropping off after 6375rpm? I see you have a torque spike at 4717 rpm and also the power spikes there, did you have VTEC activated here? Check your turbo for any shaft play, are you getting oil in your charge pipes? Have you done a compression test on the motor, even the low 8.6:1 CR is not gonna affect you like this. WHo lightly ported this head? I know it is easy to screw up a Honda head

2phast

Thanks for the response Boosfed,
I got the car back yesterday morning and haven't been able to talk to the guy that tuned it. I will get to ask the questions you posed about where the vtec is set at and why the drops in torque and whp tomorrow when they open.
These are GSR cams set at 0.
I lightly ported the head see this thread for a pic.
https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=1271340

I really only cleaned up the casting marks, very little change to the chamber.
It has new valve guides, stainless valves, titanium retainers, 3 angle valve job on a serdi. It was cross milled as well.

The cat may be the problem. I have a 2 1/2" down pipe (no oil in it by the way),
2 1/2" stainless exhaust. My 1 1/2" wastegate pipe Ys in just before the cat.
The cat is a cheap SS Autochrome Hi flow but the inlets look like 2" or 2 1/4" I.D.

I'm going for a ride.
Ralph

wtfman2

His power is also down a bit due to the air fuel ratio is at 11-11.5 all the way across. This is where my base map was and I picked up about 30 hp at peak just by leaning it out to ~12.5, but he is just breaking it in so that is no big deal. The exhaust restriction should be looked into cause any improvement there will also help the turbo spool up faster. What was done to the ignition system? You may be running into spark troubles. dose it seem to break up at all or is it just falling off at the top? Try closing up the gaps on the spark plugs and if it gets better you may want to try upgrading the coil and maybe an MSD. Also try one heat range colder a plug should be used when you up the boost and make sure there is no detonation as that will also seem to drop the power on the topend.


Clinton

2phast

I just went and put about 20 miles on it.
Nothing hard yet but it was a blast.
I need to tweek my suspension a little, and the
relocated battery slid a little and arced on the aluminum box.
Flipped me out. I thought my back glass had cracked.

I sold my restored 75 Vette to build this and I was afraid I might regret
it in the end. I can now say it was worth it. This is way more fun and I could
eat my Vettes lunch with it.
Plugs and wires are NGK .030 gap if I remember correctly.
Stock ignition system. Plugs are indexed.

Ralph

abnaasefmb

http://www.mototuneusa.com/break_in_secrets.htm
go ahead and get on that thing

2phast

Heres a picture of her.

2phast

These dyno results are bullsh!t
It took me awhile to pick up on it but the torque and HP dont cross
over at 5252 rpm. I wondered why they didn't give me a chart showing
the torque and the HP on the same sheet.
The torque is about 165 @ 5252rpm, the HP is about 180 @ 5252 rpm.

These dyno results aren't worth the paper they are printed on.
Can anyone think of a good reason not to stop payment on the check????????

Advice anyone?????
Boostfed?????


Modified by 2phast at 10:56 PM 8/28/2005

scttydb411

the numbers def look low.

i tuned out an ls/vtec w/ 9.5comp at main stream performance just over a week ago in a del sol:
6psi=235whp during break-in weeks ago
19/20psi=404whp.

talk to the dyno tuner first before stopping payment. maybe they'll do a retune.

your setup really is screaming for high boost.

let me know if i can be of assistance.