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Old 03-22-2004, 07:38 AM   #1
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Default Distributor Vs. Distributorless...

So my car hasn't ran in going on 6 weeks now, and I've come to this conclusion...

My standalone (Haltech) isn't producing an RPM signal at the crank trigger, to let the distributorless ignition know when to fire. I replaced the crank sensor, and that's when the trouble started. I've had it at a very knowledable shop for quite some time troubleshooting it, but to no avail....

My question is: Could I solve my problem by throwing the distributorless set-up in the trash, along with the piece of **** crank sensor, and replacing it with a distributor again? Where are the benefits of either set-up? This is a daily driver, and while the distributorless is a neat thing, it's becoming a PITA to deal with.

I want to know what the 400-500 hp fellas are using for ignition set-ups? I know Cheezefrog and ForseFed both are running distributors, with MSD add-ons...

Thanks in advance for the input...
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Old 03-22-2004, 08:32 AM   #2
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Default Re: Distributor Vs. Distributorless... (mildly interesting)

up for answers
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Old 03-22-2004, 09:04 AM   #3
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Default Re: Distributor Vs. Distributorless... (mildly interesting)

I don't know if this will help but I am planning on running distributorless system on my AEM.
The way it works on that is that the AEM sends the signal to the CDI (msd dis or whatever) to fire. The crank sensor in the distributor is where the data come from that the ECU is processing. I thought the tach sensor was in distributor , becuase i took one apart this weekend and saw two different sensors in there after I took out the coil and ICU.

edit: do you have no honda distributor on there at all ?
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Old 03-22-2004, 09:18 AM   #4
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yeah, there is no distributor at all...just a plug that fills the hole in the head. It gets its signal from the magnets on the crank pulley, like a Motronic does. It's a shitty set-up, even when it works right. I'm almost positive I'll be bolting the dizzy back on soon, unless someone else can figure it out for me...
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Old 03-22-2004, 09:21 AM   #5
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Default Re: (mildly interesting)

How far is the crank trigger pick up from the wheel?
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Old 03-22-2004, 12:08 PM   #6
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just a few mm above it, the one that I took off looked like it had made contact w/ the wheel a few times...
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Old 03-22-2004, 02:36 PM   #7
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Default Re: (mildly interesting)

It might be too far away, that's all Click the image to open in full size.
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Old 03-22-2004, 02:38 PM   #8
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I think it's close, but that's a possibility I guess...what should the air gap be?
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Old 03-22-2004, 02:46 PM   #9
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Default Re: (mildly interesting)

You'd have to check the specs... but I have no idea! Almost close enough to touch, but how far exactly?
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Old 03-22-2004, 02:53 PM   #10
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I hate my car. and it hates me back.
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Old 03-22-2004, 03:01 PM   #11
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Default Re: (mildly interesting)

http://www.sdsefi.com/techhall3.htm
According to this article, there should be 1.5-2.5mm spacing between the magnet and the Hall sensor.
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Old 03-22-2004, 03:06 PM   #12
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Default Re: (Stan D)

Honestly, I've worked on both and I like them both. I don't like having to replace caps and rotors in honda distributors. However, one could argue that they don't like replacing coil packs that fail (on some cars).

My dsm has a distributorless ignition that has prooved reliable. The hondas that i've worked on have distributor ignitions that are also reliable as long as you replace the cap and rotor with a set of spark plugs.

I'd switch back to stock since the Haltech isn't working out for you.
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Old 03-22-2004, 03:23 PM   #13
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oh I'm staying with the Haltech, I'm just dumping that turd of a distributorless set-up...
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Old 03-22-2004, 03:33 PM   #14
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Default Re: (mildly interesting)

I'm running distributorless with my haltech with no issues. Are you getting an RPM reading when you are cranking the car in the haltech software? Did the car ever run or did it just stop?
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Old 03-22-2004, 03:37 PM   #15
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Default Re: (mildly interesting)

im not sure about the haltec, but you should be able to use the crank/cam triggers in the stock distributor if the haltech one isnt working

again, im not a haltec expert, but if you arent getting a crank trigger sensor then you wont get proper injection from the fuel injectors. they are timed off the same sensor.

i wouldnt go dumping the distributor less setup just yet... see if you can find a stock distributor, setup the hatech to read off the stock crank/cam sensor
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Old 03-22-2004, 03:51 PM   #16
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Default Re: (Jared)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jared
I'm running distributorless with my haltech with no issues. Are you getting an RPM reading when you are cranking the car in the haltech software? Did the car ever run or did it just stop?
no RPM reading when cranking the car...and it drove into the shop, I pulled the bracket and unplugged the old sensor, bolted on the new sensor and plugged it back in. Bolted the bracket back on, and nothing has happened in the 6 weeks following...and J, that might be an idea, but on the dyno it was losing spark around 6300 RPM, and I can't help but think putting a distributor back on it might solve that problem...
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Old 03-22-2004, 03:54 PM   #17
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Default Re: (mildly interesting)

I'm running distributorless ignition, but I'm still using the distributor's sensors to time everything.
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Old 03-22-2004, 03:55 PM   #18
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Default Re: (mildly interesting)

losing spark at high rpms sounds like the gain is wrong on the sensor, and let me get this straight, you drove it in the shop, swapped sensors, and now it doesnt run? why not sway the sensors back? have you tried adjusting the sensor air gap?
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Old 03-22-2004, 03:58 PM   #19
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I put the old sensor back on, and still nothing...air gap is like 1.5 mm...don't you feel like if it has been this much of a problem, It must be easier to put the distributor back on? I've seen quite a few 400-450+ hp cars running stock ignition. I would be interested to know how you wired your factory distributor to the Haltech to run your coils though...
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Old 03-22-2004, 04:09 PM   #20
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the factory distributor isnt just a distributor.. there is a 24 tooth crank sensor and a 1 tooth cam sensor in there. thats what is used to time everything. the 2 sensors sync right at TDC on #4 cylinder.

he isnt using the distributor part of the factory stuff to do anything with the ignition, just using the needed sensors inside the thing.
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Old 03-22-2004, 04:20 PM   #21
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cool, I found a diagram about how to wire the Haltech to the factory dizzy, maybe I'll go that route...
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Old 03-22-2004, 05:01 PM   #22
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Quote:
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cool, I found a diagram about how to wire the Haltech to the factory dizzy, maybe I'll go that route...
use the single tooth wheel for home and the 24 tooth wheel for the trigger, gain anywhere from 0 to 3 depending on your setup. good luck.
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