Brake Problems fixed...again
Thread Starter
Honda-Tech Member
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 2,707
Likes: 0
From: Tempe, AZ, USA
Brake Problems fixed...again
Per my previous post:
https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=842779
Took my car back in to Basch and had them check the brakes out and do an alignment for me. so now the car drives straight and the brakes work.
Basch believes the issues with the brakes are due to a valve (or valves?) in the ABS unit sticking. They proceeded to exercise the ABS system thoroughly (sp?) and this seems to have fixed the problem for the most part. So for people with the following symptoms:
- Brakes are bled repeatedly, but still feel mushy.
- Re-bleeding results in no air being found in system.
- Master cylinder and system are checked for leaks.
- Investigation in to faulty master cylinder yields no real results (I tried replacing my MC first and too bad I did because my old one was fine; putting in a new OEM Acura one did not help at all!)
If you have all these symptoms, before taking it somewhere or replacing parts, try exercising your ABS system. I am not sure how much Basch "exercised" the system, but I would think doing it a few times a day over the course of a week should yield results. If not then I would proceed to look at other possible causes.
I am not sure if this will eventually lead me to replacing the ABS; hopefully not. I think most R's at my mileage and above do track the car so I could see why they may not have experienced similar problems as the ABS is probably used a decent amount. I am somewhat interested to see if other people who rarely track their car and have higher mileage have had this problem.
Hopefully this post will help some others who mentioned they had this problem.
https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=842779
Took my car back in to Basch and had them check the brakes out and do an alignment for me. so now the car drives straight and the brakes work.
Basch believes the issues with the brakes are due to a valve (or valves?) in the ABS unit sticking. They proceeded to exercise the ABS system thoroughly (sp?) and this seems to have fixed the problem for the most part. So for people with the following symptoms:
- Brakes are bled repeatedly, but still feel mushy.
- Re-bleeding results in no air being found in system.
- Master cylinder and system are checked for leaks.
- Investigation in to faulty master cylinder yields no real results (I tried replacing my MC first and too bad I did because my old one was fine; putting in a new OEM Acura one did not help at all!)
If you have all these symptoms, before taking it somewhere or replacing parts, try exercising your ABS system. I am not sure how much Basch "exercised" the system, but I would think doing it a few times a day over the course of a week should yield results. If not then I would proceed to look at other possible causes.
I am not sure if this will eventually lead me to replacing the ABS; hopefully not. I think most R's at my mileage and above do track the car so I could see why they may not have experienced similar problems as the ABS is probably used a decent amount. I am somewhat interested to see if other people who rarely track their car and have higher mileage have had this problem.
Hopefully this post will help some others who mentioned they had this problem.
Honda-Tech Member
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 8,136
Likes: 2
From: kuidaore
Re: Brake Problems fixed...again (onyx00)
Same stuff here.
I spoke to Mark Basch and had Larry Bastanza help me with mine.
You can either excercise the valves/ABS by driving all over and repeatedly using ABS, I use desolate dirt farm roads.
Or you can use a 12V pulse with a wire/clip to the ABS relay socket (don't know the technical stuff just saw how to do it.)
Then We bled with a one way check valve on a standard bleeder bottle and the 2 guy method with the pumper using a 2x4 block just to be safe.
I Only had this issue After bleeding my car for the First time from OEM stock fluid to ATE superblue but, the Aftermarket fluid has nothing to do with this since it is a closed system.
I do track the car but not as much as many here may. I became aware of my brake issue after the Expo last year and after unsuccessful rebleeds drove it at several other track events and at each one ran into the same issue and ultimately lost my brakes altogether. I too replaced a perfectly good Master Cylinder as well as bled the system more than 5 times without fully solving the issue.
Correlating activating ABS with track driving or frequent track use is kind of a misconception. If you are braking well, you won't be activating ABS all of the time and all over the place and especially with R compound tires.
During my brake issue, I actually lost ABS altogether so even stomping on the pedal and trying to activate it wouldn't help or even happen for that matter.
After We did the play with the ABS and rebleed thing, the pedal was back to normal and the car again stops on a dime after over a year of crapola problems. I also went a few steps further and chose a higher temp fluid as a precaution, removed my dust shields and added SS lines. Since the brakes are in correct working order now I can attest that I do feel the difference of the SS lines.
I know of only a handful of members/owners that have experienced similar to exactly the same issues as you and I have.
Best of luck to all
And Yes, if you've had the same issues please speak up, if the ABS is ultimately at fault then Acura/Honda should be contacted.
I spoke to Mark Basch and had Larry Bastanza help me with mine.
You can either excercise the valves/ABS by driving all over and repeatedly using ABS, I use desolate dirt farm roads.
Or you can use a 12V pulse with a wire/clip to the ABS relay socket (don't know the technical stuff just saw how to do it.)
Then We bled with a one way check valve on a standard bleeder bottle and the 2 guy method with the pumper using a 2x4 block just to be safe.
I Only had this issue After bleeding my car for the First time from OEM stock fluid to ATE superblue but, the Aftermarket fluid has nothing to do with this since it is a closed system.
I do track the car but not as much as many here may. I became aware of my brake issue after the Expo last year and after unsuccessful rebleeds drove it at several other track events and at each one ran into the same issue and ultimately lost my brakes altogether. I too replaced a perfectly good Master Cylinder as well as bled the system more than 5 times without fully solving the issue.
Correlating activating ABS with track driving or frequent track use is kind of a misconception. If you are braking well, you won't be activating ABS all of the time and all over the place and especially with R compound tires.
During my brake issue, I actually lost ABS altogether so even stomping on the pedal and trying to activate it wouldn't help or even happen for that matter.
After We did the play with the ABS and rebleed thing, the pedal was back to normal and the car again stops on a dime after over a year of crapola problems. I also went a few steps further and chose a higher temp fluid as a precaution, removed my dust shields and added SS lines. Since the brakes are in correct working order now I can attest that I do feel the difference of the SS lines.
I know of only a handful of members/owners that have experienced similar to exactly the same issues as you and I have.
Best of luck to all
And Yes, if you've had the same issues please speak up, if the ABS is ultimately at fault then Acura/Honda should be contacted.
Honda-Tech Member
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 2,759
Likes: 0
From: Murphy, Tx, USA
Re: Brake Problems fixed...again (onyx00)
As per my previous conversations with Anton, my brakes will be going to Jack La-lane soon to get some "exercise". It seems that our ABS systems have this problem and need to be serviced this way.
I shoot brides
Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 7,904
Likes: 7
From: Catalina Island
Re: Brake Problems fixed...again (1GreyTeg)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 1GreyTeg »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I know of only a handful of members/owners that have experienced similar to exactly the same issues as you and I have.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
i've been dealing w/ this exact problem since Expo1
mebe now I can finally get it corrected!
*crosses fingers the ABS cycling will help*
</TD></TR></TABLE>
i've been dealing w/ this exact problem since Expo1
mebe now I can finally get it corrected!
*crosses fingers the ABS cycling will help*
Member
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 1,941
Likes: 0
From: hong kong
Re: (Wai)
I'm glad someone found out how to solve this brake problem.....
anyway, during the past 3 years of the ownership of my R, I never have any brake problem......Is it because I use the abs ALL the time? I mean I like to let the abs kick-in and feel its work so I always play with it....may be it help to excerise it enough.
anyway, during the past 3 years of the ownership of my R, I never have any brake problem......Is it because I use the abs ALL the time? I mean I like to let the abs kick-in and feel its work so I always play with it....may be it help to excerise it enough.
Trending Topics
Honda-Tech Member
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 8,136
Likes: 2
From: kuidaore
Re: (Wai)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Wai »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Question for you guys, after you get the ABS to kick in repeatedly to "exercise" the unit, did the pedal feel come back right away or did you have to rebleed before seeing the result?</TD></TR></TABLE>
The pedal wouldn't rise and no it didn't firm up any it just allowed ABS to activate again which for me I had lost altogether and was at the point of double pumping the brake pedal to get enough force to stop the car.
Only after the ABS activation and a full flush/rebleed did the pedal come back to the original height and not sink to the floor when the ignition was on/booster did it's thing and pressure was applied.
The pedal wouldn't rise and no it didn't firm up any it just allowed ABS to activate again which for me I had lost altogether and was at the point of double pumping the brake pedal to get enough force to stop the car.
Only after the ABS activation and a full flush/rebleed did the pedal come back to the original height and not sink to the floor when the ignition was on/booster did it's thing and pressure was applied.
Honda-Tech Member
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 465
Likes: 0
From: Formerly WI, now back in NorCal and everywhere else
Re: (1GreyTeg)
I've had this same problem for years and I hope this is finally the solution. The brake pedal feel problem would always be a little un-nerving during the last session or two of a track day and bleeding, etc. never seemed to help. But thinking more about this solution kind of makes sense. After my car spent a year in Florida and three in NorCal, where I hardly used the ABS, the ABS got lots of use here in my R's first Wisconsin winter. Hopefully now just a brake bleed will do the trick. I hope its that simple. Everyone keep everyone else posted on the results.
Honda-Tech Member
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 6,630
Likes: 1
From: Charleston, SC, USA
Re: (1GreyTeg)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 1GreyTeg »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
The pedal wouldn't rise and no it didn't firm up any it just allowed ABS to activate again which for me I had lost altogether and was at the point of double pumping the brake pedal to get enough force to stop the car.
Only after the ABS activation and a full flush/rebleed did the pedal come back to the original height and not sink to the floor when the ignition was on/booster did it's thing and pressure was applied. </TD></TR></TABLE>
so yours wouldn't work at all on the road, but the electrical pulse method activated it?
The pedal wouldn't rise and no it didn't firm up any it just allowed ABS to activate again which for me I had lost altogether and was at the point of double pumping the brake pedal to get enough force to stop the car.
Only after the ABS activation and a full flush/rebleed did the pedal come back to the original height and not sink to the floor when the ignition was on/booster did it's thing and pressure was applied. </TD></TR></TABLE>
so yours wouldn't work at all on the road, but the electrical pulse method activated it?
Honda-Tech Member
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 8,136
Likes: 2
From: kuidaore
Re: (mstewar)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by mstewar »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
so yours wouldn't work at all on the road, but the electrical pulse method activated it?</TD></TR></TABLE>
Yes, My ABS would Not work on a regular asphalt surface, that is correct.
You can either do the first method; activate the ABS solonoids individually at the connector with a 12v pulse where you will hear first the working sound of the solonoid then a higher pitched sound at which point it has been activated and is done, go to the next one, and when done with all 4 do a full bleed flush.
I did the second method of taking the car to a slippery surface, in my case on the road to my parents house is part dirt and went down the hill activating the ABS all the way multiple times. I then took a dirt road and just jammed the pedal as many as 100 times from varying speeds usually from 40 up to 60 mph to zero and including ABS every time. Then I tried the ABS on asphalt and voila it worked again. Went to Larry Bastanzas and did the bleed/flush and the brakes were back to as good as I remember them.
Funny note, I had my brother as a passenger when I did the ABS dirt road thing but I didn't tell him really what we were going to do, I just said we weere going for a ride. And about midway through he begged me to stop or he said he was gonna throw up right in the car.
so yours wouldn't work at all on the road, but the electrical pulse method activated it?</TD></TR></TABLE>
Yes, My ABS would Not work on a regular asphalt surface, that is correct.
You can either do the first method; activate the ABS solonoids individually at the connector with a 12v pulse where you will hear first the working sound of the solonoid then a higher pitched sound at which point it has been activated and is done, go to the next one, and when done with all 4 do a full bleed flush.
I did the second method of taking the car to a slippery surface, in my case on the road to my parents house is part dirt and went down the hill activating the ABS all the way multiple times. I then took a dirt road and just jammed the pedal as many as 100 times from varying speeds usually from 40 up to 60 mph to zero and including ABS every time. Then I tried the ABS on asphalt and voila it worked again. Went to Larry Bastanzas and did the bleed/flush and the brakes were back to as good as I remember them.
Funny note, I had my brother as a passenger when I did the ABS dirt road thing but I didn't tell him really what we were going to do, I just said we weere going for a ride. And about midway through he begged me to stop or he said he was gonna throw up right in the car.
Honda-Tech Member
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 6,630
Likes: 1
From: Charleston, SC, USA
Re: (1GreyTeg)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 1GreyTeg »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Yes, My ABS would Not work on a regular asphalt surface, that is correct.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
ah, but it would engage on a slippery surface.. got it..
I think I'm going to have to do this soon, if I actually want to use the ABS, which I might not..
Yes, My ABS would Not work on a regular asphalt surface, that is correct.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
ah, but it would engage on a slippery surface.. got it..
I think I'm going to have to do this soon, if I actually want to use the ABS, which I might not..
New User
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 402
Likes: 0
From: TX, USA
Re: Brake Problems fixed...again (onyx00)
I have been having a similar problem with my new R. 98. This past weekend I had the brakes bleed thinking that that was the problem and they still feel mushy and not up to par. When you say that they excersised your abs, are we talking over an hours time of stopping and starting or a weeks time constant abs engage? I thought that it might be my master cylinder as well but am glad to see that in this case, it probably is not. Has anyone talked to a service person from acura to get an offical word on this and a "why"?
Honda-Tech Member
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 8,136
Likes: 2
From: kuidaore
Re: Brake Problems fixed...again (R-Adrenaline)
First, follow the Helms manuals procedures for trouble shooting this problem.
Do Not do a Master cylinder yet. (Trust me, coming from someone who has and didn't solve the issue. Got a nice new MC on my shelf though).
Then if all is supposedly fine with your brake system and you still have the mushy/sinking pedal syndrome, Then try the activating ABS by either method and then follow with a good full bleed and flush.
Then go for a spin and see how it feels again. If still mushy try a rebleed.
I went through and had someone with connections to Acura service go through the bulletins and recalls and there Was Nothing like this or related to this listed.
I no longer have a warrenty and in general do not trust Any of the local dealership service departments.
I'd rather have good friends and associated mechanics with good reps do the work and help me. Plus if I just sent this to the Dealer; 1) nothing can guarentee it's safety and, 2) I would never learn anything first hand, and 3) goes back to 1, I just don't trust any of the local dealer shops or service at all.
Best of luck and glad to see hear others are out there and now discussing this.
BIG QUESTION TO ALL!
When did you all realize this issue explain fully?
And Did you bleed the system?
IF so did you follow the Helm's manual procedures?
Mine all happened soon after it's first bleed from OEM fluid at around 20,000 miles, and took roughly a year, several track days, much unsuccessful bleeding and much head scratching to get this far.
Thanks again to Andie Lin, Mark Basch and Larry Bastanza.
Do Not do a Master cylinder yet. (Trust me, coming from someone who has and didn't solve the issue. Got a nice new MC on my shelf though).
Then if all is supposedly fine with your brake system and you still have the mushy/sinking pedal syndrome, Then try the activating ABS by either method and then follow with a good full bleed and flush.
Then go for a spin and see how it feels again. If still mushy try a rebleed.
I went through and had someone with connections to Acura service go through the bulletins and recalls and there Was Nothing like this or related to this listed.
I no longer have a warrenty and in general do not trust Any of the local dealership service departments.
I'd rather have good friends and associated mechanics with good reps do the work and help me. Plus if I just sent this to the Dealer; 1) nothing can guarentee it's safety and, 2) I would never learn anything first hand, and 3) goes back to 1, I just don't trust any of the local dealer shops or service at all.
Best of luck and glad to see hear others are out there and now discussing this.
BIG QUESTION TO ALL!
When did you all realize this issue explain fully?
And Did you bleed the system?
IF so did you follow the Helm's manual procedures?
Mine all happened soon after it's first bleed from OEM fluid at around 20,000 miles, and took roughly a year, several track days, much unsuccessful bleeding and much head scratching to get this far.
Thanks again to Andie Lin, Mark Basch and Larry Bastanza.
Honda-Tech Member
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 6,630
Likes: 1
From: Charleston, SC, USA
Re: Brake Problems fixed...again (1GreyTeg)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 1GreyTeg »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">BIG QUESTION TO ALL[
When did you all realize this issue explain fully?
And Did you bleed the system?
IF so did you follow the Helm's manual procedures? </TD></TR></TABLE>
Well, mine was a rebuild, so a bit different situation.. but, first bleed on the brakes resulted in a mushy pedal. Rebled, and the brake feels fine. Booster, MC, etc all appear to be in good condition. I tried to engage the ABS mutliple times on pavement with no success(country roads and on the track). I haven't gone much further than this, since my car is having its cage installed. And I'm not sure I'm too worried about it(the ABS working), but I probably will at some point want to make it so that it CAN work should I engage it..
When did you all realize this issue explain fully?
And Did you bleed the system?
IF so did you follow the Helm's manual procedures? </TD></TR></TABLE>
Well, mine was a rebuild, so a bit different situation.. but, first bleed on the brakes resulted in a mushy pedal. Rebled, and the brake feels fine. Booster, MC, etc all appear to be in good condition. I tried to engage the ABS mutliple times on pavement with no success(country roads and on the track). I haven't gone much further than this, since my car is having its cage installed. And I'm not sure I'm too worried about it(the ABS working), but I probably will at some point want to make it so that it CAN work should I engage it..
I shoot brides
Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 7,904
Likes: 7
From: Catalina Island
Re: Brake Problems fixed...again (1GreyTeg)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 1GreyTeg »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">BIG QUESTION TO ALL[
When did you all realize this issue explain fully?
And Did you bleed the system?
IF so did you follow the Helm's manual procedures?</TD></TR></TABLE>
problem came up 1 week before Expo1 after a bleeding
bled the darn thing so many times, friends were buying me cases of brake fluid as bday and xmas gifts - lol.
I've followed the helms and any other suggestions people had.
Here's the really weird part. I was so sick of going thru this, I got stoptech brakes. That cleared the problem instantly - super firm pedal like stock or better. Then I sold them and went to NSX. Soft pedal came back.
Tried ABS cycling->bleed -> ABS cycling -> bleed yesterday. Didn't help sqwat
I'm out of things to do besides changing MC
When did you all realize this issue explain fully?
And Did you bleed the system?
IF so did you follow the Helm's manual procedures?</TD></TR></TABLE>
problem came up 1 week before Expo1 after a bleeding
bled the darn thing so many times, friends were buying me cases of brake fluid as bday and xmas gifts - lol.
I've followed the helms and any other suggestions people had.
Here's the really weird part. I was so sick of going thru this, I got stoptech brakes. That cleared the problem instantly - super firm pedal like stock or better. Then I sold them and went to NSX. Soft pedal came back.
Tried ABS cycling->bleed -> ABS cycling -> bleed yesterday. Didn't help sqwat
I'm out of things to do besides changing MC
Honda-Tech Member
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 8,136
Likes: 2
From: kuidaore
Re: Brake Problems fixed...again (yoshi234)
Here's a pic of the R with No Active ABS:
And how we got the idea that something was amiss with the ABS was that in order for the car to even stop and create clouds of smoke like that we disconnected the ABS unit and ran the second half of that autocross with no ABS but, as soon as we disconnected the ABS the pedal rose a bit, definitely got firmer And the car would actually stop albeit in a cloud of smoke like an F14 landiing on a carrier
As soon as the X was over we reconnected the ABS and back to mushier pedal and less stopping ability. So, as soon as I got home, I started searching all over and calling the Pros. BTW, for the day of the pic above my buddy rodney (a pro driver) codrove with me, for awhile he didn't believe what I kept explaining to him. After his first run he exclaimed "geez your brakes Suck! they used to be awesome, now they just plain suck."
So I decided to investigate the ABS.
From what I understand from some expereinced NSX mechanics llike Mark Basch is that the NSX and particularly the earlier ones have the Exact same issues and require attention and service.
And how we got the idea that something was amiss with the ABS was that in order for the car to even stop and create clouds of smoke like that we disconnected the ABS unit and ran the second half of that autocross with no ABS but, as soon as we disconnected the ABS the pedal rose a bit, definitely got firmer And the car would actually stop albeit in a cloud of smoke like an F14 landiing on a carrier
As soon as the X was over we reconnected the ABS and back to mushier pedal and less stopping ability. So, as soon as I got home, I started searching all over and calling the Pros. BTW, for the day of the pic above my buddy rodney (a pro driver) codrove with me, for awhile he didn't believe what I kept explaining to him. After his first run he exclaimed "geez your brakes Suck! they used to be awesome, now they just plain suck."
So I decided to investigate the ABS.
From what I understand from some expereinced NSX mechanics llike Mark Basch is that the NSX and particularly the earlier ones have the Exact same issues and require attention and service.
Honda-Tech Member
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 8,136
Likes: 2
From: kuidaore
Re: Brake Problems fixed...again (yoshi234)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by yoshi234 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
problem came up 1 week before Expo1 after a bleeding
bled the darn thing so many times, friends were buying me cases of brake fluid as bday and xmas gifts - lol.
I've followed the helms and any other suggestions people had.
Here's the really weird part. I was so sick of going thru this, I got stoptech brakes. That cleared the problem instantly - super firm pedal like stock or better. Then I sold them and went to NSX. Soft pedal came back.
Tried ABS cycling->bleed -> ABS cycling -> bleed yesterday. Didn't help sqwat
I'm out of things to do besides changing MC
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Did you or do you still have stock lines?
And the Stoptech kit neccesitates a 16" wheel or bigger and different offset or something like that right?
Then maybe a MC change could be in order.
Have you checked the booster yet?
problem came up 1 week before Expo1 after a bleeding
bled the darn thing so many times, friends were buying me cases of brake fluid as bday and xmas gifts - lol.
I've followed the helms and any other suggestions people had.
Here's the really weird part. I was so sick of going thru this, I got stoptech brakes. That cleared the problem instantly - super firm pedal like stock or better. Then I sold them and went to NSX. Soft pedal came back.
Tried ABS cycling->bleed -> ABS cycling -> bleed yesterday. Didn't help sqwat
I'm out of things to do besides changing MC
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Did you or do you still have stock lines?
And the Stoptech kit neccesitates a 16" wheel or bigger and different offset or something like that right?
Then maybe a MC change could be in order.
Have you checked the booster yet?
Trial User
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 1,090
Likes: 0
From: Denial, USA
Re: Brake Problems fixed...again (1GreyTeg)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 1GreyTeg »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
And how we got the idea that something was amiss with the ABS was that in order for the car to even stop and create clouds of smoke like that we disconnected the ABS unit and ran the second half of that autocross with no ABS but, as soon as we disconnected the ABS the pedal rose a bit, definitely got firmer And the car would actually stop albeit in a cloud of smoke like an F14 landiing on a carrier
As soon as the X was over we reconnected the ABS and back to mushier pedal and less stopping ability. So, as soon as I got home, I started searching all over and calling the Pros. BTW, for the day of the pic above my buddy rodney (a pro driver) codrove with me, for awhile he didn't believe what I kept explaining to him. After his first run he exclaimed "geez your brakes Suck! they used to be awesome, now they just plain suck."</TD></TR></TABLE>
What is the easiest way to disconnect the ABS?? Just pull the fuse? I may be in the same boat.
And how we got the idea that something was amiss with the ABS was that in order for the car to even stop and create clouds of smoke like that we disconnected the ABS unit and ran the second half of that autocross with no ABS but, as soon as we disconnected the ABS the pedal rose a bit, definitely got firmer And the car would actually stop albeit in a cloud of smoke like an F14 landiing on a carrier
As soon as the X was over we reconnected the ABS and back to mushier pedal and less stopping ability. So, as soon as I got home, I started searching all over and calling the Pros. BTW, for the day of the pic above my buddy rodney (a pro driver) codrove with me, for awhile he didn't believe what I kept explaining to him. After his first run he exclaimed "geez your brakes Suck! they used to be awesome, now they just plain suck."</TD></TR></TABLE>
What is the easiest way to disconnect the ABS?? Just pull the fuse? I may be in the same boat.
New User
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 402
Likes: 0
From: TX, USA
Re: Brake Problems fixed...again (1GreyTeg)
Originally Posted by
[B
[B
BIG QUESTION TO ALL![/B]
When did you all realize this issue explain fully?
And Did you bleed the system?
IF so did you follow the Helm's manual procedures?
When did you all realize this issue explain fully?
And Did you bleed the system?
IF so did you follow the Helm's manual procedures?
I shoot brides
Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 7,904
Likes: 7
From: Catalina Island
Re: Brake Problems fixed...again (1GreyTeg)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 1GreyTeg »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Did you or do you still have stock lines?
And the Stoptech kit neccesitates a 16" wheel or bigger and different offset or something like that right?
Then maybe a MC change could be in order.
Have you checked the booster yet?</TD></TR></TABLE>
stock lines, several different SS lines - no diff.
17" wheels w/ the stoptech. The wheels were used even before stoptech was installed.
MC is in stock but not changed yet. When the brakes are pumped w/ car off, it gets to the point of rock hardness on 2nd or 3rd pump. Pedal doesn't go down at all after this. So my thinking was that the MC is still okay *shrugs*
Booster has not been checked. How are they checked?
Did you or do you still have stock lines?
And the Stoptech kit neccesitates a 16" wheel or bigger and different offset or something like that right?
Then maybe a MC change could be in order.
Have you checked the booster yet?</TD></TR></TABLE>
stock lines, several different SS lines - no diff.
17" wheels w/ the stoptech. The wheels were used even before stoptech was installed.
MC is in stock but not changed yet. When the brakes are pumped w/ car off, it gets to the point of rock hardness on 2nd or 3rd pump. Pedal doesn't go down at all after this. So my thinking was that the MC is still okay *shrugs*
Booster has not been checked. How are they checked?
Honda-Tech Member
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 1,392
Likes: 0
From: USA/Germany
I dont know whether it's my spoon calipers or just the ABS. But I notice a lot of ABS engaging time to time. I have brand-new pads (Cobalt GT-sports, brembo blanks, motul brake fluid, stainless lines as well. The previous setup I had was, spoon rotors, and AEM pads, which worked horrible. I took the R to a track day like that and after 2 laps my pedal was completely to the floor. What I can't understand is, I wasn't really slamming on the pedal all that much for the ABS to kick in. I'd get to a brake zone, and as soon as I'd modulate the brake pedal I would get pulsing in the pedal. I was also told that by lowering the car to much causes the ABS to lock up more.
Honda-Tech Member
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 8,136
Likes: 2
From: kuidaore
Re: Brake Problems fixed...again (yoshi234)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by yoshi234 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
MC is in stock but not changed yet. When the brakes are pumped w/ car off, it gets to the point of rock hardness on 2nd or 3rd pump. Pedal doesn't go down at all after this. So my thinking was that the MC is still okay *shrugs*</TD></TR></TABLE>
Yeah, according to the helms if when the ignition is off and you pump the brake pedal a few times and it ibecomes rock hard and doesn't sink your MC is fine.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by yoshi234 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Booster has not been checked. How are they checked?</TD></TR></TABLE>
To check the booster according to the helm's make sure there isn't any fluid leaking, remove the vacuum line and check for vacuum.
There may be more to troubleshooting both the booster and mc but I don't have the manual in front of me and I strongly suggest reading and troubleshotting from it Before trying any other fixeruppers.
MC is in stock but not changed yet. When the brakes are pumped w/ car off, it gets to the point of rock hardness on 2nd or 3rd pump. Pedal doesn't go down at all after this. So my thinking was that the MC is still okay *shrugs*</TD></TR></TABLE>
Yeah, according to the helms if when the ignition is off and you pump the brake pedal a few times and it ibecomes rock hard and doesn't sink your MC is fine.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by yoshi234 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Booster has not been checked. How are they checked?</TD></TR></TABLE>
To check the booster according to the helm's make sure there isn't any fluid leaking, remove the vacuum line and check for vacuum.
There may be more to troubleshooting both the booster and mc but I don't have the manual in front of me and I strongly suggest reading and troubleshotting from it Before trying any other fixeruppers.
I shoot brides
Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 7,904
Likes: 7
From: Catalina Island
Re: Brake Problems fixed...again (1GreyTeg)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 1GreyTeg »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I strongly suggest reading and troubleshotting from it Before trying any other fixeruppers.</TD></TR></TABLE>
i've pretty much resorted to just living w/ this condition (although I hate it). Nobody can figure it out so I might have a friend take it down the AHM and have the guys at techline look at it.
i've pretty much resorted to just living w/ this condition (although I hate it). Nobody can figure it out so I might have a friend take it down the AHM and have the guys at techline look at it.
Honda-Tech Member
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 8,136
Likes: 2
From: kuidaore
Re: Brake Problems fixed...again (yoshi234)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by yoshi234 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
i've pretty much resorted to just living w/ this condition (although I hate it). Nobody can figure it out so I might have a friend take it down the AHM and have the guys at techline look at it.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Talk to Trey as well, he and another member had some of the ABS componants replaced under warrenty when Acura couldn't find the exact problem. Problem with that is it starts to get expensive without a warrenty. I think the Accumulator was one of the common reported issues besides the solonoids.
i've pretty much resorted to just living w/ this condition (although I hate it). Nobody can figure it out so I might have a friend take it down the AHM and have the guys at techline look at it.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Talk to Trey as well, he and another member had some of the ABS componants replaced under warrenty when Acura couldn't find the exact problem. Problem with that is it starts to get expensive without a warrenty. I think the Accumulator was one of the common reported issues besides the solonoids.