Like the topic states, will a faulty ICM lead to a faulty coil??

after 3-4 years of messing with distributors, i kinda noticed a patern that a faulty ICM would eventually lead to a dead coil and a worthless (to most) distributor...

so if this is true (and its not a coincidence), how does it (technically) ruin the coil??

i know its a longshot, but im sure some one on here knows what im talking about...

 

I would think that if you had a faulty ICM or short something that it could send too much current and burn the coil. Maybe heat the windings too much and cause them to melt? Im not really sure though. Is this what you were talking about?

 

It causes overheating. I've seen them ooze greenish goo. It's an insulator. GM's are bad about frying the pick-up coil also known as the stator when the ignition module is bad. If I replace the ICM, I replace the coil.

 

questions like this, you would have to pm JimBlake, he's really good at electrical questions

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by CivicDXRaceCar &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I would think that if you had a faulty ICM or short something that it could send too much current and burn the coil. Maybe heat the windings too much and cause them to melt? Im not really sure though. Is this what you were talking about?</TD></TR></TABLE>

yeah thats what i was thinking about, but i wanted a deffinate answer...

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by amckee &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">It causes overheating. I've seen them ooze greenish goo. It's an insulator. GM's are bad about frying the pick-up coil also known as the stator when the ignition module is bad. If I replace the ICM, I replace the coil.</TD></TR></TABLE>

yeah this is kinda what i expected, i know GM and some ford's had very faulty ICM's...

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by PrettyLude &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">questions like this, you would have to pm JimBlake, he's really good at electrical questions</TD></TR></TABLE>

haha word thanks i sent him this link...

so from what i take it is that...

the ICM can kill the coil by overheating it, kind of how over gapped spark plugs kills coils...

 

up...

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by PrettyLude &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">JimBlake, he's really good at electrical questions</TD></TR></TABLE>Hey, wanna join my fan club?

Actually, I don't know this one for sure. I think the ignitor's job is to protect the ECU from voltage spikes created by the coil. Maybe the coil was starting to do that, which fried the ignitor before you realized the coil was on it's way out???

The ignitor charges the coil by grounding it's side of the coil's primary circuit. It fires the coil when it disconnects that circuit. I forget the primary coil resistance, but even while it's shorted to ground, that's not a lot of power. And it's how the coil is supposed to work.

 

I have seen coils and ignitors go back and forth killing each other until both were replaced together. I agree with JimBlake, that the ignitor is sort of a buffer between the coil and the ecu, and it converts the signal from the ecu into the right levels and duration for the coil.

 

i forgot to mention you can ask drdisco69 also

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by JimBlake &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Hey, wanna join my fan club?

Actually, I don't know this one for sure. I think the ignitor's job is to protect the ECU from voltage spikes created by the coil. Maybe the coil was starting to do that, which fried the ignitor before you realized the coil was on it's way out???

The ignitor charges the coil by grounding it's side of the coil's primary circuit. It fires the coil when it disconnects that circuit. I forget the primary coil resistance, but even while it's shorted to ground, that's not a lot of power. And it's how the coil is supposed to work.
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thanks for the input...

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by drdisco69 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I have seen coils and ignitors go back and forth killing each other until both were replaced together. I agree with JimBlake, that the ignitor is sort of a buffer between the coil and the ecu, and it converts the signal from the ecu into the right levels and duration for the coil.</TD></TR></TABLE>

^^^^^

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by PrettyLude &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i forgot to mention you can ask drdisco69 also</TD></TR></TABLE>

so i guess, its not clear to me as i thought it was...

from what u guys said, it seems like the ICM is dependent on the coil, and not vise versa...

either way i know that im right that one would kill the other, but i didnt know it would go both ways...

up for some more insight....

 

also...

im going to try to email a few people for Honda that might know the answer, so il post what they say in the thread, but it looks like im the only one interested in this LOL

 

I very rarely see both go bad at the same time. I very rarely replace one and the have the other go bad shortly after. I very rarely replace both if only one is bad.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Chiovnidca &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I very rarely see both go bad at the same time. I very rarely replace one and the have the other go bad shortly after. I very rarely replace both if only one is bad. </TD></TR></TABLE>

right...

but what i have noticed, is when a Distro starts eating coils like crazy (one every few months or about a year or less), if u replace the ICM, u wont have to replace the coil again...

reason why i though they were linked...

 

sorry to bring this back up, i do have a question tho. if i replace the whole dizzy, it would work out fine since im replacing the coil and the ignitor at the same time. because i have a new dizzy sitting at home, before i read this thread.

also does grounding have anything to do with the coil and ignitor going bad, seems to me that the only ground i have is from the batt to the chasis. i think i need one on my head/block.

 

Yeah, the coil & ignitor are grounded thru their mounting in the distributor. Look for a big ground wire alongside one of your engine mounts, IIRC on my '95 Teg it was the tranny mount sorta under the air cleaner. There was ALSO a much smaller ground wire from the front of the valve cover to the beam above the radiator.

If your grounds are bad, I think that would not be good for your ignitor & coil. But maybe you'd have other problems as well?

 

yeah i have, the left headlight/parking lights do not work as well.

 

There is no stator winding in a coil .. It has a PRIMARY & SECONDARY winging Any of this winding can or maybe affected by many problems such as vibrations ,heat etc. When an ICM goes bad it require the output of the secondary winding of the coil to produce a very high voltage which is more than the required voltage to create a spark. In other words it overwork the coil. As a result the windings become overheated and looses their ability to isolate from each other thus the end product is a dead ciol.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by turbocrx1.6l &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">There is no stator winding in a coil .. It has a PRIMARY & SECONDARY winging Any of this winding can or maybe affected by many problems such as vibrations ,heat etc. When an ICM goes bad it require the output of the secondary winding of the coil to produce a very high voltage which is more than the required voltage to create a spark. In other words it overwork the coil. As a result the windings become overheated and looses their ability to isolate from each other thus the end product is a dead ciol.</TD></TR></TABLE>

yeah i kinda figured they were related

 

Bringing this back to life cuz I got a problem. What if you replace the cap, rotor, and coil, and you keep burning out the ICM after 1 start? Whats the issue now? Also all grounds check out fine.