Summer is closing and it's not many weeks until the first track day

So I thought I should try a little "trick" for keeping the oil temp down ; I've seen that many race cars have thermal bandage wrapped around the bottom of the header to shield it from the oil pan. That seems like a good idea knowing how hot the exhaust gets and that its only a couple of cm from the oil pan.

I got the Toda header, and knowing that the Toda header will crack with thermal bandage wrapped around it in the engine bay (https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=624707), I wonder if it also will crack with thermal bandage wrapped around it near the oil pan? Will the temperature be low enough "down there" to keep the header from cracking?

Shielding the oil pan also means that the O2 censor will be wrapped (only one O2 censor on Euro Rs). Is that a good idea regarding heat?

 

Instead of wrapping the header, you can also apply sticky thermal shield on the bottom of the oil pan.....

 

Wont that keep the heat from escaping from the oil pan as well as protect it from the heat from the header? Kinda "neutralize" the heat shielding effect.....

Besides I have some thermal bandage lying around I want to use.

 

The header is hotter than the oil pan, so it will keep the heat away from the oil pan. I've seen this on the an ITR on a Best Motoring video.
If you want to remove the heat from the oil, you need an oil cooler. Or cool down the water that enters the stock oil cooler before it enters the cooler.

I have also seen people putting heat sinks on the oil pan (at the sides).

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by DutchITR1689 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">The header is hotter than the oil pan, so it will keep the heat away from the oil pan.

If you want to remove the heat from the oil, you need an oil cooler.</TD></TR></TABLE>

I still think it'll be more efficient to wrap the header. It'll also only be an additional mean besides my oil cooler to keep heat down. But thats off topic in this thread anyway......

So does anyone know, or can at least take an educated guess, if the header can take it without cracking?

 

Do you already have an oil cooler?

I would do that first. . .they are CHEAP. . .
And if your worried about the oil being too cold in the winter, install a thermostat. . .Jeff Evans did it on his car, no problems. ..

 

Yes I have an oil cooler, but stick to the topic ;
Will the header (Toda) crack if wrapped with thermal bandage near the oil pan (knowing that the header will crack when wrapped in the engine bay)??

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by m R g S r &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Do you already have an oil cooler?

I would do that first. . .they are CHEAP. . .
And if your worried about the oil being too cold in the winter, install a thermostat. . .Jeff Evans did it on his car, no problems. .. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Same here. Works WONDERS. 'Hot enough' in the winter (180F-200F), and cool on the track (consistently less than 260F).

Thicker oils (15w50 vs 10w30) run hotter for me, strangely enough. I guess a thinner oil bypasses the thermostat, and when the thermostat opens it gets more volume through the oil cooler.

On the same note-- definitely wrap your header, or put stuff on the pan, if you're worried about it. Not sure if the header will crack/corrode or not, but that's why I didn't wrap my downpipe.

What are your oil temps? Less than 260F and I wouldn't sweat it.

-Chris

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Chris F &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">On the same note-- definitely wrap your header, or put stuff on the pan, if you're worried about it. Not sure if the header will crack/corrode or not, but that's why I didn't wrap my downpipe.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

heh, great

So basically the header is just as hot near the oil pan as it is where it's bolted to the engine.....? Meaning it'll crack......

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Pompiuses &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

heh, great

So basically the header is just as hot near the oil pan as it is where it's bolted to the engine.....? Meaning it'll crack......
</TD></TR></TABLE>

Yeah, sorry I didn't really answer your question, and I'm going to continue not answering your question.

On a turbo, EGT's after the turbo can be 250F cooler than EGT before the turbo. I suppose this is a function of both exhaust conducting heat into the turbo, as well as the Pv=nRT, pressure goes down, temp goes down some too.

So, at MOST, you're going to get 250F of cooling, probably less. Likely not enough to make a difference for cracking/etc. But, since you're not welded to a manifold or block, there might be less stress right there. *shrug* If you care about the header, safe bet is don't wrap it. That part of your header will see enough water, and getting water underneath the wrap might make the situation worse.

What's your Oil temp, anyway?

 

Instead of wrapping the header you could get it coated.

http://www.jet-hot.com/pages/whyjethot.htm

You shouldn't have any cracking issues that way.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by The Kernel &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Instead of wrapping the header you could get it coated.

http://www.jet-hot.com/pages/whyjethot.htm

You shouldn't have any cracking issues that way. </TD></TR></TABLE>

In my part of this planet that's not an option.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Chris F &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

So, at MOST, you're going to get 250F of cooling, probably less. Likely not enough to make a difference for cracking/etc. But, since you're not welded to a manifold or block, there might be less stress right there. *shrug* If you care about the header, safe bet is don't wrap it. That part of your header will see enough water, and getting water underneath the wrap might make the situation worse.

What's your Oil temp, anyway?</TD></TR></TABLE>

I havent installed an oil temp gauge (yet).

If there's no stress on the metal, like no bends on it or anything where I wrap it, does it really matter how hot it is then?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Pompiuses &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
If there's no stress on the metal, like no bends on it or anything where I wrap it, does it really matter how hot it is then? </TD></TR></TABLE>

Temperature differences can snap it. for instance, when you wrap it, there's no air cooling that part of the header. It could snap from internal stress of being heated unevenly. Or some crap. I'm not a metallurgist.

 

I would consider welding some simple eyelets on the outside of the header... that way you can construct a simple heat shield out of aluminum that will fit between the header and the oil pan and bolt to the header.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Black R &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I would consider welding some simple eyelets on the outside of the header... that way you can construct a simple heat shield out of aluminum that will fit between the header and the oil pan and bolt to the header. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Take it a step further and use some of that heat resistant film to cover the heat shield. I've done this a couple of times on turbo cars and it worked quite well.