i have never looked at one, so don't make it sound like i am stupid. i was just wondering what years the awd civics came out and if one of those tranny's would bolt up to my 1.5 crx dx motor. i was thinking about doing that awd conversion that everyone says is a waste of time, but it is a project car and that is something i want to do the research on. i am also planning on doing the multi-port conversion and the mini-me swap for vtec on this engine. will the awd tranny be able to handle the change in hp? i will be building the engine up with lots of other mods too. i need a new tranny anyway, so i figured this would be the time to do the research on this. any help would be great guys. thanks in advance.

 

AWD Civic?

Am I missing something here?

When did we ever have an AWD Civic?

I'm not flaming you or anything, but, I'm very familiar with Honda cars, and I've never heard of an AWD Civic.

Unless you're trying to put a CR-V tranny into your car.

 

I think the awd's were from 88-91. There were even a few rare ones that came with 6-speed. They were all wagons.

 

was that the civic that looks like a dune buggy? It resembled a short subaru on crack if i remember correctly.

 

The third generation Civic Wagon (1985-1987) had the carbureted 1.5 like the other Civic/CRXs, but with one difference. The 4WD block only bolts up to the 4WD tranny. But the D16A1 (and probably ZC) from the 1st gen Integra will bolt up to the 4WD tranny. The rear floor pan and suspension is completely different on the 4WD Wagons. The gas tank is also different to make room for the driveshaft. And it uses a cable shifter for the same reason.

The fourth gen Wagon ('88-'91) had the 108hp CRX Si engine. I think any D series engine will bolt up to its transmission. I'm not too familiar with the 4th gens, but most of the differences probably apply to both gens.

Just drop a stock ZC into a 4WD Wagon. Easy and probably about the transmission's power handling limit.

 

Gas Fumes has it right....I have a 91 6 speed wagon, and any D series bolts to the transmission, it's an Si trans with an extra part for the 4WD and the granny low gear. Mine has a D16Y8 from a 99 Civic, and it fits fine, just like a swap into any other th gen. Other differences in the car are: Cable shifter and weird transmission, three piece axles, Different rear suspension with driveshaft with viscous coupling center diff. The gas tank is different for the driveshaft as well.

The 4WD system is a bit weak, nobody has ever tested the power handeling capabilities of the trans, but I wouldn't go over 150 crank hp without having a spare transmission and viscous coupler.

The system can be put in a civic hatch if you use all of the componants from the wagon, but it's not easy and not a direct bolt it...but it has been done.

 

now for the next question - are the 88-91 awd civic wagons made in the us? do any of the us models have that si motor in them? i didn't think any of the us models had a 6 speed tranny until the s2000 came out.

 

Yes, 1988-1991 4WD was sold in US: http://carpoint.msn.com/Vip/Specific...Wagon/1991.asp

Yes, 1988-1991 4WD had a 6sp. Not an evenly spaced 6sp mind you, but it had a super-low gear for getting yourself out of trouble. http://carpoint.msn.com/Vip/Engines/...Wagon/1990.asp

 

CRXplus,

Keep in mind these are 4WD not AWD....the difference is that the 4WD is always all four with power. AWD distributes power while the 4WD always has the same amount of power going to all the wheels.

 

Sorry spade, close....when it's dry and everyhting is fine with traction, the car is FWD. Only whel there is slippage betweent he front and rear is the rear driveshaft engaged.

All 88-91 4WD wagons had the D16A6, the SOHC MPFI CRX Si motor. The 6 speed was standard (1-5 are stock Si gears, and the 6th gear is "Super Low" for towing, pulling, mudding, rock crawling...it's a granny low gear!
A 4 spd auto was optional. All of this was available in the US, but not that many were made.

 

130hp DOHC ZC, automatic only.

realtime came in the 92-95 4-door. technicly the CR-V is using the Civic AWD (which everyone already knew lol)



[Modified by 95CivicSi, 12:53 PM 1/22/2002]

 

sorry, i thought the civics were awd. thank you for those two links showing the info on the car. so if the civic is 4wd, then is it always 4wd or is it like a subaru and you have to engage the 4wd? and is there a low and hi 4wd? just to make sure i am understanding this correctly, the first five gears are just like a crx/civic si and then the 6th gear is like an overdrive? you only use that gear when towing? or for highway travel too?

does anyone know where i can get one of these wagons? either junked with a good tranny and setup or drivable?

 

The '85 4WD Wagon had a button to engage the rear wheels. After that, they all had a full time system with a viscous coupling.

The extra gear is sort of a pre-first gear that multiplies the torque much more than the normal five gears. Not really needed on pavement at all. Good for climbing really steep hills or going through mud.

 

Almost forgot about HORTA:
http://www.tiac.net/users/daveread/horta/index.htm

 

Just to clear up a couple things.
Since the mid ninteys, every Subaru comes with AWD, A.K.A. Full-time 4WD (there are slight differences, but they are essentially the same thing. Before then there was a mix of the two, trending towards 4WD in the older vehicles. the only Subaru's that you can turn off the rear wheels are the automatics wich have a fuse that can be pulled (or added) for towing purposes.

AWD and 4WD are very distantly related, same idea but very different realization of that idea.
AWD = center differential "Transfers power from the wheels that slip to the wheels that grip"
4WD = transfer case. you can (generally) turn the rear wheels on and off (or in rare cases, the front wheels) but the transfer case acts as a closed differential, it always tries to power all four wheels, wether they have traction or not. drive a 4wd truck (jeep, blazer, etc) in 4wd for a while, it tends to get all bound up in the corners due to the non-forgiving nature of the differential.
Both systems have their merits and their shortcomings.

This is an over-generalization, and is not 100% accurate 100% of the time, I'm sure there are people who have a better understanding of all this than I.

As far as AWD/4WD hondas, back when honda was part of the SCCA ProRally circuit (before they realized that, for the most part, american honda fans didnt care how they did in rallying) Honda brought over a couple AWD turbo integras, and did damn well if i remember correctly.

 

i was refering to the subaru 4wd, which has it's only lever to activate the 4wd - like in the 80's models. i knew there was a difference in awd and 4wd, that is why i am trying to just make sure the 88-91 models are 4wd or awd. do the 88-91 models have actual 4wd with the differential to make all 4 wheels turn at the same time, like subaru's 4wd low, or is it more like the newer subarus that have the awd system, like the old 4wd hi. that is what i need to know.

again, thanks for all the info guys.

 

You learn something new everyday.

 

No kidding.

 

It's an AWD system. It doesn't actually have a center diff, but the viscous coupling acts sort of like a diff. I drove a '91 4WD Wagon in a parking lot, and I couldn't feel the 4WD at all. It's a great and simple system. I want one.

 

Mr. CRXPlus - Already Working On It !!

Hope To Have It Done By This Summer For Autocrossing.

 

would be able to put that awd system on a 92-95 civic ?

 

No. NO place for all the rear drive stuff to attach.
In Japan they did make a 4WD B16 Civic though (92-95), so if you got that stuff you probably could, but what a PITA.