This is a long drawn out story, but basically I only made 110hp when I dyno'd my car on the weekend. I've been having a lot of trouble with my last 3 setups not making as much power as they should. The only things that have remained the same has been my DB1 shell, my chipped P72 (hondata s100), Skunk2 intake, skunk2 springs & retainers, AEM fuel rail + Adj FPR, ITR 4-1 header, 2 1/4" exhaust and the wiring.

Setup#1:
Hardly faster than stock LS. More bottom end, but no top end. Could hear VTEC engagement, but no extra power. The street tune looked like there wasn't any air comming in with the VTEC lobes (went very rich), and couldn't clean it up. Sleeves cracked after 4,000KM (N/A!).
B20VTEC
11.5:1 CR (compression tested to 210psi)
ITR intake
60mm TB
520cc injectors
rebuild PR3 head
Crane stage 3 cams, cams at 0 degrees
stock ignition

Setup #2
Rebuilt a USDM B18C5 in my garage over the summer and put it in over the fall. Compeletely different motor, sensors, head, etc. from the previous setup. Dyno'd this one and only made 100whp. Had close to a 30hp drop on my VTEC engagement. Same problem, no air. Tried playing with the cam gears but couldn't clean it up.
Stock compression (10.6:1 ?)
CTR head w/new intake valves (lapped them before putting it all together)
310cc injectors
CTR tb
Crane stage 3 cams (same as before)

Setup #3
Same as previous setup, but I put in Skunk stage 2 cams and had someone else tune the car. We made 110HP, but it looked like the numbers for VTEC and the low cams were the same. Spent some time trying to see if VTEC was engaging properly, but weren't certain. It was hard to hear an audible crossover on the dyno. I could hear it at 5,000 (set from the previous tune) after I left the dyno and drove it home.

I'm lost as to what the problem is. After I left, I was informed that a stock B18C1 powered civic made 140whp on the same dyno on the next run. I'm going to try another chipped P72 tomorrow and put my chip in it for troubleshooting, but I'd like to see if anyone has another ideas to try out.

Sorry for the long post and thanks in advance for the help!

 

please dont tell me u didnt try a different dyno tuner

 

i would have to say that your ecu is either in limp mode or the map on your chip is very messed up. i dont have a hondata system so i dont know what you can do about changing maps, but you need to change the maps and have the injectors scaled to where they need to be. if you dont want to do that, i would suggest putting the stock injectors back in and putting your fuel pressure back to stock and run a stock type-r map in your ecu. this may require you to download a stock type-r map and copy and paste all the cells into your hondata setup. i wish i could explain more than that.. but i dont really know how the hondata system works so i cant help you more.

i wouldnt suggest driving the car much either, untill you get this issue sorted out. if you want you can pm me and i may be able to help more with questions.

 

Thanks for the responses!

KingOfQB: I used a different tuner for last weekends tune. I thought I'd try someone else in town that everyone else had been having great results with. He's a good tuner, but no mechanic. All he could tell me was that my low cam numbers and high cam numbers looked almost identical and that my maps looked good. It was his suggestion that I get my ECU looked at.

sanimalp: My maps are already adjusted for my injectors and fuel pressure. I don't have the stock injectors or fuel rail to put back in either. We started off with a stock ITR map then tuned from there. I don't know enough about Hondata or tuning in general to be of much more help than that. The car itself is running fine though. Just not making much power.

I've IM'd you.

 

110WHP from a B18C5, Makes me want to cry
good luck with getting that thing fixed

 

post your dyno's with A/F's

 

Trust me, I almost cried as well.

I'm my deppresion after the expensive dyno session, I forgot to get the dyno sheets. I just sent a PM to the guy that runs the dyno to see if I can still get them. I'll post them up as soon as I can.

 

310cc and 520cc injectors while using a chipped ECU? It's no wonder it's running rich.

 

like everyone else said its your injectors and i don't think your compression is high enough to gain power out of stage 3 cams. a buddy has a type r swap all stock except for the crower stage 3 cams and he made less power than when it was stock.

 

possibly a clogged cat or exhaust? try running open header and see what happens.?????

 

change cams and injectors and youll gain a LOT back.

 

With around 10.6-10.8 static compression and the Crane stage 3 cams, your dynamic (running) compression will probably be like 7.5:1. The cams are hurting more than helping with that compression.

 

You guys realize that I'm running Skunk2 stage 2 cams now, right? The last tune was using them. Is 280cc-310cc enough of a jump to cause this much of an issue?

I don't actually have the OEM injectors or cams to put in the head, only B16 cams. I was actually trying to find ITR or CTR cams when I found the Skunks for a good price. The Crane stage 3's were just left over from my 11.5:1 B20 so I used them until I could find something better suited to the engine.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by crixzc &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">possibly a clogged cat or exhaust? try running open header and see what happens.?????
</TD></TR></TABLE>

I second this, coz It was the problem on one of my friend's b16a with d16y8 stock exhaust system.

 

I don't run a cat anymore. The ehaust system is pretty much brand new....about 10,000KM on it. It's a 2 1/4" custom setup.

 

things i would check

VTEC SOLENIOD (a buddy had a bad one could hear click but would not engage)

TUNING IS a big deal, even slight diff can make a world of diff in the motor running/programming (put stock back in, even on bigger injectors should run better then what you got)

good luck
d

 

are you running the correct resistance injectors (i.e. saturated vs. peak and hold)?

and did you check for proper voltage at every injector? I wonder if you are losing an injector somewhere and are running on 3 cylinders. i only say that because the last swap I did, everything seemed okay, but the car felt like it was down 60 hp. turns out I had a broken fuel injector wire, and was running on 3 cylinders. And it didn't throw a CE light either, it was just really sluggish (felt like a stock civic DX). I had poly motor mounts so I really didn't feel much additional vibration that would tip me off that I was only firing on 3 cylinders.

once I found it and fixed the broken wire, it was a night and day difference.

 

dude, come on you need WWWAAAAYYYYY more compression to push those cams. remember, that cam is meant to start making power around 8k. So, get some ctr cams or at most stage 2 cams. I saw blox stage 2's put 184 whp in a gsr, and same motor we swapped spoon cams, made 132 whp. BIG CAMS ARE FOR RACECARS!!!

 

Yeah you are definately over-camming the car. I had the same problem with my Gsr I had Skunk Stage 2's and made 166 and changed them out for some Type R cams and ended up making 185 on stock compression. Bigger isn't always better. Good luck

 

putting s2s2 cams in an itr motor will NOT make it lose 50 +whp.

Theres something else wrong here.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by suckawillis &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">dude, come on you need WWWAAAAYYYYY more compression to push those cams. remember, that cam is meant to start making power around 8k. So, get some ctr cams or at most stage 2 cams. I saw blox stage 2's put 184 whp in a gsr, and same motor we swapped spoon cams, made 132 whp. BIG CAMS ARE FOR RACECARS!!!</TD></TR></TABLE>

U know the blox cams are bigger than spoons right?

 

did u rebuild the head with springs and retainers???? if u did, i hope u remembered to put back the oil oriface's / pins that go in the head. they are located towards the cam gear side of the head right under the cam caps. if u didnt put those back on then u will have problems when vtec engages.

also what was the a/f when u tuned the car

 

i didnt really read the thread, but id ditch that hondata and try running a crom or uberdata to see if mybe the chip was messed up, i remember i had my spoon chip and it took a dump and the car had like no power and kept going in and out of limp mode, changed out the chip to a crom and thing like woke right up and ripped

 

Sorry for the delay on getting the dyno sheet up. I finally met up with one of the guys from the shop and this was all that he could find on the computer from my runs (ignore the date...it's from a couple of weeks ago):

 

From what you describe it almost sounds like the pins aren't engaging the VTEC rockers. like you hit vtec, the solenoid opens, oil flows to the rockers but there are no pins being pushed in to lock the three rockers together.

Who built your head?