<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by johnyrb &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I PERSONALY ... JUST PUSH THE CLUTCH IN AS IM RACING AND SHIFT AS FAST AS I CAN AND I DONT HAVE ANY JERKING PROBLEMS. YOU JUST HAVE TO DO IT FAST. I DONT HAVE A TAC SO I PLAY IT BY EAR AND IT WORKS FOR ME. I HAVE NEVER HEARD OF DOING IT THE WAY YOU JUST EXPLAINED. THAT JUST SOUNDS LIKE IT WOULD TAKE TO LONG TO SHIFT. AND HERE IS ANOTHER FOURM SITE http://WWW.SUPERHONDA.COM . </TD></TR></TABLE>

AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH H!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Modified by CardDealer at 9:35 AM 11/16/2006

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by dillywong &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">hmm.. i heel toe when i downshift. i dont really like the whole double clutching thing.</TD></TR></TABLE>


<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by schlit &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Any other sort of rev matching while you're holding the clutch is not doing anything but burning up your throwout bearing.</TD></TR></TABLE>
so heel toe or any other method of rev matching is bad for the throwout bearing?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by dillywong &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">hmm.. i heel toe when i downshift. i dont really like the whole double clutching thing.</TD></TR></TABLE>

i'm also geussing you go 150 miles around corners you retard

No need to lie hear

 

this double clutching thing you speak of is unnecessary. All those wasted motions are for Vin Diesel and Paul "I like the tuna here" Walker.
If you want to downshift smoother do what is called "Rev Matching". Its better for your drivetrain than just downshifting. All it takes is a light tap of the gas between Clutch In, Clutch out.
There is no need for all that clutching shanannigans

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by G2 Speed &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i'm also geussing you go 150 miles around corners you retard

No need to lie hear</TD></TR></TABLE>

haha. no way man.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by leeminho86 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Actually double clutching has been covered numerous times on honda-tech and even though it was developed for older cars, I was told by numerous people it is still beneficial for the health of your synchros rather going from fifth to third and having the life of your tranny be shortened, not to mention when you down shift a lot of people riding with you don't appreciate it when the car jerks every gear, it was a simple question of whether I was doing it right and if it was completely necessary. So your analogy of F&F might be what you see in your mind but I have put my time, sweat, and blood into building my motor from the ground up and will continue to research and ask questions regardless of what you think and relate to in movies. We all weren't born with the answers unlike you my friend. </TD></TR></TABLE>

learn how to drive stick right and it wouldnt jerk in every gear. i can shift to wear you cant even feel it and i'm a GIRL

 

When you downshift? There's no way in hell you can get it smoothly unless you're riding the clutch and breaking at the same time...in that case you are a girl and don't know how to drive mmmk? I'm talking about downshifting, especcially when you downshift to pass someone, rather then jumping from 5th to third "smoothly as you do" and putting that amount of wear and tear on your tranny.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by johnyrb &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I PERSONALY ... JUST PUSH THE CLUTCH IN AS IM RACING AND SHIFT AS FAST AS I CAN AND I DONT HAVE ANY JERKING PROBLEMS. YOU JUST HAVE TO DO IT FAST. I DONT HAVE A TAC SO I PLAY IT BY EAR AND IT WORKS FOR ME. I HAVE NEVER HEARD OF DOING IT THE WAY YOU JUST EXPLAINED. THAT JUST SOUNDS LIKE IT WOULD TAKE TO LONG TO SHIFT. AND HERE IS ANOTHER FOURM SITE http://WWW.SUPERHONDA.COM . </TD></TR></TABLE>

dont like your synchros much do ya....

 

Modified by CardDealer at 9:37 AM 11/16/2006

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by schlit &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Yep, that's when I double clutch. Just drove through the rockies and decided to spare my syncros. It feels like I'm not killing the car as much.

BTW You should be able to shift the gears without the car jerking. It just takes practice to get the timing right. You're either letting the clutch out too early or late or without feathering. I've got an SI where the RPM's change act like a motorcycle. It'll jerk like crazy if the timing isnt right.</TD></TR></TABLE>

someone has already said something about my comment. i was refering to upshifting. i had never heard about dc'ing on a downshift. when i downshift i just take my foot off the gas and when it gets down to a certian speed i downshift. but now that i know about dc'ing on a downshift i think im going to try it to see how it works for me.

 

**** i quoted the wrong person my bad. but none the less for those who have quoted me there you go.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by dillywong &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">hmm.. i heel toe when i downshift. i dont really like the whole double clutching thing.</TD></TR></TABLE>

They're different things for different purposes.

When you downshift to pass, the ideal is to double clutch like Schlit said. He's the only one that described it properly. It does reduce wear on your synchros (as they're not being used! revmatching with the clutch in doesn't help the synchros at all), and when you're good it's just as fast as just jerking it into gear because 1) the engine is at the right speed 2) the tranny is at the right speed relative to the car's speed so the gear just slides in, there's no pressure to even hold it back, as it's ready. Another good reason to learn it is, if your clutch is almost dead, you can still shift gears.

Heel and toe is rev matching (or if you're really coordinated, double clutching) the engine while braking, so you can downshift into gear while braking.

 

After reading this thread, I have realized how many people can't drive manual

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by modifyORdie &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> i can shift to wear you cant even feel it and i'm a GIRL</TD></TR></TABLE>

SO TAKE THAT!!

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Chem Geek &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Heel and toe is rev matching (or if you're really coordinated, double clutching) the engine while braking, so you can downshift into gear while braking. </TD></TR></TABLE>


Good LORD there's a good amount of people in here who have no business what so ever commenting on this subject.......

First of all, to the kid who keeps saying that muscle cars didn't have synchros, have you owned a muscle car? Ever driven one? Newsflash, almost every passenger car post-like 1950 has had synchronizers, maybe even earlier. CIP, my '61 Bel Air, complete with a straight 6 and a three on the tree had a synchronized 2nd and 3rd gear. 1961. Nineteen sixty one. As did my old '70 Dodge Dart, 340 4-speed, and my dad's old '70 SS 396/375HP 4-speed Nova. Coincidence? No.

As to the statement above me, that is completely incorrect. You have two feet, you can in fact downshift while braking. Heel toe is meant for downshifting while entering a corner (remember, brake in, accelerate out!) at speed, so as to not upset the car. Downshifting while cornering, depending on the car (most importantly FWD or RWD), WILL cause the car to understeer/oversteer, due to rear/front wheels compensating for the motor's lack of RPM in relation to wheel speed. Heel-toe effectively combats this, keeping braking, downshifting, and engine speed all in synch, in one fluid motion. Remember kids, ther is more to life than driving in a straight line.

/tutorial

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by G2 Speed &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">After reading this thread, I have realized how many people can't drive manual </TD></TR></TABLE>

i'm one of em but ill be the first to admit it. Time to try to find online tutorials or something telling me how to drive correctly since i do care about my car. things i know im doing wrong right now.

riding the clutch too much going into 1st.
upshifting.. (i just shift at about 3-4k normally or when it sounds right)
downshifting .. ( i have a feeling im not double clutching right)
and probably everything else. damn i am teh suck at driving but im ready and willing to learn.

 

I can shift the gears smoothly going up and down with no problem, it's my car and I drive it everyday...I'd hope it'd be the same for everyone, I have a stage 3 clutch that grabs incredibly hard with a lightened flywheel, if you don't know how to drive it then it will let you know. I just mean there's no way to downshift skipping a few gears and do it smoothly, whether you're coming to a quick stop, cornering, or trying to race someone, I don't really care what people do with their cars I was just wondering what was best for the transmission. I've watched so many auto-x clips where it shows each racer dc'ing or h-t'ing...figured it had to be good for something and was just wondering if I was doing it correctly. If you read my first post I did mention the way I was taught was the "correct" way everyone is talking about...putting the clutch in and popping it in nuetral, putting the clutch back in and matching revs then throwing it in gear, and you can tell if you're doing it right because it will throw itself right into gear...as so I was told and have experienced and practiced.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SOHC4life 96 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">^^^ CAPS LOCK!!!!!!!^^^^^^ Turn it off. And he is talking about downshifting, not up shifting.

Good tip.

To answer your question plain and simple, you can do that whole process with just one clutch movement. Clutch in, blip the throttle, clutch out.

I wouldn't make it a habbit unless you are on the freeway and want to downshift to pass. It saves the clutch from wearing out faster but also wastes gas. There was a time when I made this a habbit coming to a stop, passing on the freeway, going into a turn. I then realized I was wasting gas and with prices these days, that's not a good idea.</TD></TR></TABLE>

 

Modified by CardDealer at 9:38 AM 11/16/2006

 

Modified by CardDealer at 9:35 AM 11/16/2006

 

Ohhh you rev it in nuetral I gotcha. Didn't know that thanks...well I thought I was doing it correctly I must have over read the way you said...but I was just asking if it's okay to do it in one clutch movement rather two because it seemed the same to me. And I've recieved numerous conflicting answers...saying it's okay to just push the clutch in once and rev match...and then doing it that way doesn't do anything but waste gas...so I don't know I'll be sure to do it the explained "correctly" way from now on though. Thanks

 

Modified by CardDealer at 9:38 AM 11/16/2006

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Speed Kills &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">


Good LORD there's a good amount of people in here who have no business what so ever commenting on this subject.......

First of all, to the kid who keeps saying that muscle cars didn't have synchros, have you owned a muscle car? Ever driven one? Newsflash, almost every passenger car post-like 1950 has had synchronizers, maybe even earlier. CIP, my '61 Bel Air, complete with a straight 6 and a three on the tree had a synchronized 2nd and 3rd gear. 1961. Nineteen sixty one. As did my old '70 Dodge Dart, 340 4-speed, and my dad's old '70 SS 396/375HP 4-speed Nova. Coincidence? No.

As to the statement above me, that is completely incorrect. You have two feet, you can in fact downshift while braking. Heel toe is meant for downshifting while entering a corner (remember, brake in, accelerate out!) at speed, so as to not upset the car. Downshifting while cornering, depending on the car (most importantly FWD or RWD), WILL cause the car to understeer/oversteer, due to rear/front wheels compensating for the motor's lack of RPM in relation to wheel speed. Heel-toe effectively combats this, keeping braking, downshifting, and engine speed all in synch, in one fluid motion. Remember kids, ther is more to life than driving in a straight line.

/tutorial</TD></TR></TABLE>

Damn, I thought I was going to have to chime in with this. I just looked in one of my engineering books that was printed in 1939 and it says, "gear-syncronizing devices were pioneered by General Motors". This was listed under syncro-mesh in the index. It didn't say what year it was invented but I don't doubt if it were the early 1900's, they weren't stupid back then they just didn't have the technology to make this stuff in mass production. Almost all cars after WWII had syncros on all gears except first and reverse.

Double clutching is a waste of time unless you think your transmission is on its last legs or you are driving a huge truck. Using your right foot to operate the brake and the gas at the same time is the way to do it but it takes some practice. I can't do this on my Honda but on my old Mazda RX7 I didn't push in the clutch at all when I downshifted because it was so easy to match shaft speeds. Road racers don't use the clutch to shift either up or down! The only reason you need a clutch is to get you started from a dead stop.

 

Man I'd be so scared to shift without using the clutch lol

thanks for the clarification on dc'ing though I understand it now. It's not something I make a habit of since it's not completely necessary, i just downshift normally when coming to stops...but it's definetely good to know and even better to know how to do it correctly