I have a 95 integra, had ABS and I changed to it manual brakes with 4030 prop valve. I changed all lines to 3/16 braided stainless steel. Have 1" booster m/c combo.

After changing and bleeding the **** out of them, the brakes are Incredibly hard to press and do not stop well at all.

I have heard the brake pedal becomes more difficult, but this seems way too hard for the little braking I'm getting.

Anybody have ideas as to why the brakes would be that hard to press and not get the desired braking? Or how I could get desired braking that I would feel comfortable with?

 

You went with manual brakes? As in - deleting the brake booster? Thats why the pedal is hard to push and the brakes don't work as well. Manual brakes require a longer brake pedal (lever), and/or more output pressure (smaller piston) from the master cylinder.

Or did you just delete the ABS and type manual brakes on accident?

 

Yea sorry... Deleted ABS, went to prop valve, still have booster. Typed wrong by accident

 

I would start with a basic booster function test. Start the car with the brakes applied and see if the pedal sinks. It should sink an inch or so. Let off and idle for 5 seconds, turn off.

Press the brakes 3-5 times, and the pedal should harden up within 2-3 cycles of the brake pedal. If it is hard on all presses, you have a booster check valve problem at least, torn or leaking booster at worst. (IE bad gasket surface on the booster to master, etc.)

Then, put the car up on all fours, and use an assistant to determine if there are any wheels that are not applying as the pedal is pressed. Note those wheels. I would then remove the wheels and force bleed by using your assistant to press the brakes while you crack each bleed screw. Note the volume of fluid at each wheel.

At this point you will need to consider the master size, and wheel end cylinder size. If your master is too big, and your pistons are too small, excessive force may be required. You also might want to check the circuits at the proportioning valve and ensure they are connected correctly. If you had a fluid flow problem, start with the brake circuits, and then a possible blockage within the valve or the lines. This is a good way to start. Let us know what you find.

PS: Don't remove the ABS system from a car. ABS does work very well for any streetable vehicle, and I suggest you heed that advise: It's not going to leave any new car anytime soon.

 

Abs actually increases stopping distance, but you'll be wanting abs if you want to actually control the direction of your skid.

 

ABS allows steering, no better safety than dodging the object your about to hit.

 

99% or the time and for 99.99% of people ABS is going to stop you faster if it is on. And if someone is such a master of car control that they can threshold brake in a panic situation, they can do it just as well in a car equipped with ABS as one without.

 

This.

It's also great for learning to threshold brake, since you can feel the modulation through the pedal you know you're trying to brake too hard and need to back off some.

 

You may want a smaller bmc. Iirc stock is 7/8 type R is 1" you should go 7/8 or less to get your pedal back. If you delete the booster you should go even smaller. I want to also delete abs and the booster in my race car.

How did you do your brakes? X or parallel?

Also... What did you do with all those lines from the abs unit?

 

I think abs works fine for normal driving and adverse weather driving.... On a track however, the abs caused more problems for me. Trail braking has to be perfect. Without any form of active handling, correcting an oversteer with this abs system we share is a lost cause. The abs seems to allow more whip. I also don't enjoy a hard pedal when trail braking and side stepping throttle brake and have a lock up when the booster kicks in.... But that's a booster issue not abs.

 

99.99% of us do not race their cars on a track, and as such, for the sake of others that may read this following a search link, it is important that this opinion be voiced. Some foolish individual may end up removing the ABS system for no real reason, other than to bun cash, and simply say "Yeah, I got an ABS delete".

If you intend to remove the ABS system on any vehicle without stating your intention for doing so, expect this reply.

 

The op asked why his brakes were hard after upgrading a bmc, deleting abs and retaining his booster. This isn't an abs delete debate thread that I am aware of.... But I think I kinda get what you may have intended to imply and will include a link to a very informative article on car bibles that is a very good read. It should help the op engineer a safe understanding of what his problem is and how to correct it.

 

Car Bibles : The Brake Bible

 

As slowcivic said, the discussion was sparked by Hite's comment about ABS increasing stopping distances. This misinformation needs to be stamped out because kids reading these forums will go delete ABS thinking their cars will be able to brake better. Some will get in accidents that they would have avoided with ABS, and some may even die as a result.

As for the OP, only he/she can know whether his/her motivation for deleting ABS is valid. Hopefully the OP followed slowcivic's advice and solved the problem.