FourthGenHatch

As you all have read I'm sure I was having problems. Initially this booster caused my brakes to seize up. Than I replaced the calipers then when I tried to bleed the brakes I could only get fluid out of one circuit of the brakes. So I had to drive around on 50% brakes because half my lines didn't have any fluid in them. I replaced some hardlines, I replaced the prop valve, I replaced the MC, etc... all not solving the problem. Well last week I noticed the pedal would stop like an 1'' down into it like it was hitting a rock. I loosened up the MC from the booster and magically I had my pedal travel back. So I knew I had an issue with having the wrong Booster. When at the junkyard I took the best looking parts from various Integras. This Manual one had the best looking MC so I took that and the Automatic one had a better looking booster so I took that. BAD MOVE. By doing this I failed to think about what if one was ABS and one was not. Well long story short today I replaced this ABS booster I had in my car with a Remanufactured Non-ABS one and magically I get fluid to all the wheels now. So here are pictures on how you can tell ABS from Non-ABS since I don't think it is labeled or anything...



L to R: Integra ABS Booster (10'' in diameter), Integra Non-ABS Booster (9'' in diameter), and the stock Civic Booster (8'' in diameter).

Integra ABS Booster: Notice the extra ridge around the base of it and how the push rod sticks out beyond the face of the booster about 1 CM or so.


Integra Non-ABS Booster: Notice how it is more simpler in shape than the ABS one and how the pushrod doesn't extend beyond the face of the booster.


Stock Civic Booster: Maintains a simple shape and the pushrod does not extend beyond the face. IT WAS IN YOUR CAR WHEN IT CAME FROM THE FACTORY SO THAT SHOULD BE A DEAD GIVE AWAY!


When installing the ABS booster the fat bastard wouldn't fit in the car without me banging it with a rubber mallet. The non-ABS, which is an 1'' smaller in diameter fit right in fine (after tilting the engine of course).

I replaced like $300 worth of stuff before figuring this out and no one on this board had any idea either. So basically moderators archive this post or something so that no one ever has to deal with the crap I did.


Modified by FourthGenHatch at 4:47 PM 8/13/2003

FourthGenHatch

Bump

keithv

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by FourthGenHatch &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">So basically moderators archive this post or something so that no one ever has to deal with the crap I did. </TD></TR></TABLE>

as long as no one deletes the post, it will be around forever and ever...

ShagginJet

I was under the impression that replacing the Booster was optional as part of the rear swap...?

EL Vap133

Yup, that's what I got, a brake booster and MC from a non-ABS Teg...

that_guy

"This Manual one had the best looking MC so I took that and the Automatic one had a better looking booster so I took that. BAD MOVE. By doing this I failed to think about what if one was ABS and one was not. "

So were your problems a result of mixing abs and non-abs parts, or because the abs booster and mc will not work at all?

ninjaMONKEY

actually you can use the abs booster and master cylinder together. at least i did when i swapped my rear brakes. I used a 40/40 non abs proportioning valve and a abs mc and booster

EL Vap133

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ninjaMONKEY &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">actually you can use the abs booster and master cylinder together. at least i did when i swapped my rear brakes. I used a 40/40 non abs proportioning valve and a abs mc and booster</TD></TR></TABLE>

Wow, on what car?

ninjaMONKEY

91 civic HB std/dx

FourthGenHatch

You can probably use ABS stuff together but mixing and matching just does not work. And this has nothing to do with rear disc swap, you don't have to put in Integra MC and Booster for that. But you could.

Tomorrow or something I have to put the Integra Prop back in, my brakes suck with this damn EX one.

RapeV-8

bump for better brakes

FourthGenHatch

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by igotcrx &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">bump for better brakes</TD></TR></TABLE>

Damn straight.

By the way guys today I put back in my Integra 4040 prop valve, bled the brakes one more time and GODDAM they work awesome. Sweet *** mod to do. It's like a whole new car. I'm so glad I don't have any problems anymore. My car is so fun to drive now.

slooogsr

ive really gotta do this to my hf rex......... the front disc/caliper setup is even smaller than the si and even std........ its gonna cost a shitload though cuz i would want to swap the front knuckles as well as the rear............

FourthGenHatch

Yeah I wouldn't do the Integra MC/Booster unless you have rear discs and at least DX/Si sized front brakes because the extra force is easier to lock your brakes up and in wet conditions it could be trouble.

SiR Kid

for some GREAT first hand info.

Thanks, guys.

slooogsr

gotya....... what would be the best thing to do, just do the rear disc swap and use the teg prop valve?

FourthGenHatch

Integra prop valve only has a benefit if you have rear discs, it would probably mess up your car if you had drums. My brakes sucked *** with the EX prop, but were awesome with the Integra one.

At this very moment I'm working on a How-To about this crap.

FourthGenHatch

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by FourthGenHatch &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
At this very moment I'm working on a How-To about this crap.</TD></TR></TABLE>

http://www.fourthgenhatch.com/tegmp.html

Arvid

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by FourthGenHatch &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

http://www.fourthgenhatch.com/tegmp.html</TD></TR></TABLE>

In you writeup you say that the Integra MC/booster shouldn´be used unless you have rear discs/bigger front discs.
How much bigger should the front discs be ?
I´m planning on upgrading my front discs to 10,3" (or rather 262mm VTEC brakes since I´m in europe. My car also came stock with rear discs) , would that suffice for this upgrade ?

FourthGenHatch

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Arvid &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

In you writeup you say that the Integra MC/booster shouldn´be used unless you have rear discs/bigger front discs.
How much bigger should the front discs be ?
I´m planning on upgrading my front discs to 10,3" (or rather 262mm VTEC brakes since I´m in europe. My car also came stock with rear discs) , would that suffice for this upgrade ?
</TD></TR></TABLE>

DX/Si sized front brakes are fine, I think they are 9.5'', but if you still have drums in the back it might be a little much. So I'm saying is the smaller your brakes the easier they are to lock. So its a little more evened out when you have all discs, or when you at least have big fronts. If you have an STD or HF I believe they have even smaller front brakes than the DX/Si so I wouldn't recommend this swap with those brakes, its overkill.

R6Boy69

Awesome writeup FourthGenHatch I just finished this swap. I used the ALB MC and Brake Booster from an integra, its a 1 inch MC. However it was not a direct bolt in. I had to cut off the fitting closest to the firewall and use the integra fitting cause my crx on was to small. Anyone else have to do this?

FourthGenHatch

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by crXBoy69 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Awesome writeup FourthGenHatch I just finished this swap. I used the ALB MC and Brake Booster from an integra, its a 1 inch MC. However it was not a direct bolt in. I had to cut off the fitting closest to the firewall and use the integra fitting cause my crx on was to small. Anyone else have to do this?</TD></TR></TABLE>

I know you do if you put in a 94-01 Integra MC and Booster. Perhaps we can assume all 3rd Gen Tegs were ABS?

Timmah!!

Its good to hear you go the problem worked out.

FourthGenHatch

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by azroth &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Its good to hear you go the problem worked out. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Yeah I drove the hell out of my car today. Its so great to have a car working.

Except now my keyless entry isn't working right. I will press it to lock and it locks but then opens back up. But I have a feeling the lock rod that I just left there when I put in sedan handles is binding against the door and making it want to open back up. Hopefully I will fix that in the morning.

IncreasingPower

i'm doing the M/C ,booster & proportioning valve swap.......still sourcing parts though & getting info on the swap.........NOW i know not to MIX & MATCH ABS & NON-ABS parts ( thanx to FourthGenHatch ).
SO HERE IS MY QUESTION : is there any advantage to installing an ABS booster & M/C vs. a NON-ABS booster & M/C?????
i thought someone had posted earlier that the ABS M/C was 1" inch ......which that would make it larger than the NON-ABS M/C which is 15/16" inch!!!! Is this true?????
And IF IT IS TRUE.........then, is there any problems or difficulties when installing the ABS M/C to the hardlines??? such as having to flare the lines .....or extend the lines ......or any of that CRAP????.......becuz i definitly want the bigger M/C & booster ( MORE stopping power )....becuz i am going to do a disc upgrade
ALSO.....do any of the 1990-1993 Integra's have ABS????
becuz i would not want to go to a 1994 + UP ABS M/C & booster swap because i've heard the booster doesn't fit without modifications & the M/C doesn't fit the stock lines on a 4th gen
BTW FourthGenHatch awesome write up on the Booster!!!
maybe if someone can answer my question YOU CAN ADD THAT to your "how to" AS WELL