Specifically on stock upper control arms in the front, about how much camber does it naturally have when lowered (not slammed)? I ask because currently I have adjustable upper arms but want to go back to OEM arms and still keep close to -2* in front.

 

I don't have the actual numbers but when I lowered mine about an inch and a half and kept the stock control arms it was pretty noticeable, I would say more-so than the -2* you're hoping for. I told myself I have to install the camber kit the next weekend.

 

I just got my alignment and I'm lowered a decent amount, I've got probably 3" from my front jack points to the ground. My camber in the front is almost -3*, the rear is almost -4*

 

Yeah I'm not going slammed but I need about -2* for autoX. As long as I can lower it and get it close I'm good. Thanks

 

Lowered around 2" should do it.

I'm at -2.75" and have -2.5* camber on my EG. EG & EK front geometry is very similar (unlike the rear). The EK pictured above is a lot lower than my car.

 

-2 up front probably takes like a 2-2.5" drop in a 96-00. Hopefully you have a suspension that can handle that much drop.

You'll probably need to dial some of the rear camber out to curb some understeer.

 

I have progress cs2s with 350/550 front/rear rates.

 

You should be fine with those rates, depending on what tires you use for autocross.

 

I would think adjusting your caster would be the most noticeable change for auto x.

 

^how come?

Toe is the most dramatic change in feel and balance. Camber is a close 2nd.

 

I have heard that adding caster does make for a dramatically different "feel".... But each time it results in slower lap times. For whatever reason, Honda went with 1* caster on these cars for a reason.

 

Caster affects the rate of how the geometry moves up and down when the wheel is turned. Toe is the degree of the tires being parallel to one another.
Toe affects initial steering feel (darty, controlled, etc), but dramatically affects tire wear because essentially the degree of toe is gauged toward the direction you're traveling; thus skidding tires while you're moving.
Caster does not affect handling until the wheel is turned. But all these adjustments are relative to the handling issue you're trying to solve.

tl;dr: Toe other than 0 degrees = increased Michelin stock

 

More Caster reduces feedback to the steering wheel when the steering is dead straight. The car will tram-line less with more caster. That is a major difference in "feel" without any input.

 

They were +1 or -1 from the factory? That asterick doesn't explain much.

 

They are +1* (asterisk meaning degrees).

I wasn't aware of any manufacturers that use negative caster. If they do, I would be interested to learn about it.

 

Toe is staying at ZERO.

 

Caster increases steering feel. It causes a stronger centering of the wheel. The car will run straighter with lots of caster. The toe and camber will change more dramatically with more caster, as you turn the wheel.

I would assume civics and integras have such little caster due to packaging constraints and drivetrain layout.

Toe and camber are still MUCH more dramatic changes in terms of actual function. Especially for autocross.

Caster changes steering feel and increases high speed stability. But doesn't make as big of an actual impact as toe and camber.

 

Rear toe is at +.08 degrees from the factory, IIRC.

1 degree is a lot of toe.

For autocross, I'd run either 0 toe or slight rear toe out, depending on suspension/tire setup. For road courses, I'd use 0 or factory.

 

My post was referring to 1 degree of positive caster (not toe).

As for the OEM caster setting, there is room inside the wheel well to adjust caster. You can shim the lower arm forward, and swap the upper arms L&R to get +4* without altering the wheelbase. This does sacrifice a little UCA clearance, but that's nothing a BFH can't take care of. I just think Honda used +1* caster for a reason and peoples track experience might back that up.

BTW: The factory toe setting for the rear was never meant to reach zero for the streets. It's +.08 (+.08/-.04). That means anywhere from +.04 to +.16 total toe. I'm sure on the track it's a different story. Rear toe-out would certainly help loosen the rear end on relatively slow autocross corners. Just not sure I would want that during emergency braking on a wet freeway. :S

 

I'm lowered about 2.5''. Front camber is 2.0, and the rear is 2.2* with the washer trick done. it was about -1* more without it.