So I have done some research and have not found to many answers about this. I have a gsr sitting that I am gonna be building soon. The motor started having a rod knock and was pulled from the car, I bought it cheap. It has P73 pistons in it but I have not disassembled the block yet. I also acquired a B20 block and crank. I had thought about doing a B20/vtec but I decided that I just wanted to stick with the original plan of the GSR. So I have now been toying with the idea of just using the B20 crank in the GSR as I also have a set of B20 rods that I got for free at some point, not from the B20 block I have.

What kind of issues will I encounter if I go this route? I have heard issues with the oil squirters not clearing. Would the setup have any noticeable gains in hp/tq versus the GSR crank? I am trying to get as much info as possible before I start the engine build so I can decide on which route I want to take. This will be a daily driven car with a little spirited driving so I want it very reliable but want as much as I can get out of the setup I decide to go with. This will be built with mostly OEM parts minus the bolts and studs.

Here is what I have in mind.
The Plan:
B18C1 block
B20 crank
B20 rods shot peened and ARP rod bolts(just for piece of mind) with ITR pistons
ACL Main and Rod Bearings
ARP Head studs
ARP Rod Bolts
OEM seals
RMF rep header(already have)

P72 Head:
ITR Valve springs and retainers
ITR or CTR cams
stock valves(may get some aftermarket)
Skunk2 Intake Manifold(already have)
RC Injectors(310 or i may can get some 440's)
mild port and polish(port match intake, exhaust, and just some cleaning)
Hondata S300(already have)

Thats about the generic list I have in my head. I am trying to keep the costs at a minimum as far as parts go. I will not be revving this past 8500rpm. Also where can I send the rods to have them shot peened? Please provide feedback and suggestions as I will be starting to look for parts that I don't already have.

 

My recommendation:

Always go with the bigger motor if you have the choice. Stick with the b20 it will make more torque/hp.

Don't bother shot peening the rods

Don't bother with main studs just use stock bolts

The rest of the list sounds fine

 

Yeah I know the B20 will net the most power. I do not have any pistons for it nor the vtec conversion kit. Also I would have to tap the head for the oil feed. I am trying to keep it at minimal cost since I already have the pistons for the C1, the B20 crank and rods. Also I would not need the conversion kit or have to tap the head. That's why I am leaning towards the C1 block over the B20.

I will not use the main bolts. Why would it not be a good idea to shot peen the rods if I am going to have to get the ARP rod bolts installed?

 

In that case you can also skip out on the arp head studs. Stock head bolts are more than adequate for your intended use. If you are being cheap, don't skip the important things. Gather your used parts together and do a thorough inspection. Bring the pistons and block to the machine shop and have the ptw and cylinder size, out of round etc. also get a helms manual it will be very valuable

 

Im not being cheap just trying not to spend more then necessary and if I can use most of what I already have then I would like to do that. I already have the head studs, they came with the C1 block, just missing 1 of the washers. I have a helms and have the Honda service manual on my computer. I have been working on Honda's for a while but never really done any extensive motor work before so I am just weighing my options as which route I wanna take is all. Just wanting to know if using the B20 crank would be a good choice or just stick with the GSR crank.

 

You will get more torque using a LS/B20 crank than using a GSR crank. Your looking at gain of about 15-30 ft. lbs of torque by just using a LS crank. You gain even more with the 84mm stroke of a B20. I know B20s aren't recommended by those that boost due to the weak cylinder walls from being thinner. I am about to start my motor build using a GSR block with LS crank, LS Eagle Rods, and 81.5 mm Wiseco pistons. You need LS rod bearings and GSR main bearings for everything to work.

 

Thats the type of info I like hearing. Whats the issues with the oil squirters? I have heard to delete them and I have heard they are fine. I would prefer to keep them since it will be a daily so I think it would be beneficial to keep them.

 

You need to be careful who you take your advice from.

Ls/b20 crank alone will not give you 15-30 ft lbs. We are talking about a few maybe 5-8 max at the wheels.

B20 has an 84mm bore not stroke, and is fine for boost if you know how to tune and maintain the engine within reason. The issue with the sleeves is not that they are thinner.

There is no difference between gsr and ls main bearing so saying they are required is false. The ls rod bearing is required obviously due to using those rods. However the oem bearing construction is not as durable as the b16a bearing that has the same dimensions. If you are using aftermarket bearings then they are fine. In other words:

Oem bearings- use b16a
Aftermarket bearings (acl, king etc) will be the same construction for any b series

The oil squirters do rub the crank counterweight slightly so you will have to bend them a tad to clear but it's easy to do. You can easily delete them and you will not suffer oiling issues to the cylinders or wrist pin. Street use is really not super stressful on piston temps so either way you would be fine.

 

5-8 ft/lbs. is not that much of a difference so I should just stick to the C1 crank and keep it simple with the parts instead of mixing and matching stuff. If there was a 15-20ft/lb difference I would say there was a benefit of using the B20 crank. So I will probably go back to the original plan and sell the B20 block and crank.

 

No I would still use the b20 crank if I was in your shoes. Plus if the gsr crank had bearing damage and was knocking it likely may not be worth repairing and certainly should not be blindly reused.

 

if use a ls crank in a gsr can you still use the girdle?

 

 

its a much broader torque curve even though the peak numbers arent that much higher. id use the b20 crank if i were you and just delete the oil squirters. overall your build sounds like it would be an awesome street motor and fairly reliable too

 

Thee numbers you originally stated are not accurate. All else equal on his setup you will not get that much more torque.

B20 sleeves can hold up to some power but will get delicate due to a thermal problem. They are made siamesed together and you can develop cracks where the aluminum and iron meet. If you push the power and cylinder pressure way up turbocharging it they will not last forever, especially with detonation rattling away at it. I have done many 84-85mm setups with great results so I speak from experience not guesswork or hearsay.

 

I will have to disassemble the gsr block just havent had much time to mess with it at all. I am just trying to get all the parts sorted out as to what I will need to purchase when the time comes to start the build. I believe in doing as much research first and be able to have a parts list in front of me when time comes to start ordering parts for it.

 

I have heard its ok to delete the squirters on forged pistons but what about OEM pistons? This will be a daily driven motor but will occasionally see 8k rpms.

 

Would this be a good bearing set to use?
http://www.goldeneaglemfg.com/index....roducts_id=110

 

In for more info. I too want to run a ls crank in my B18c5.

 

Yes you can.

And the acl bearings on the golden eagle page are fine to use. Check your clearances and get a helms manual. I'd get one for a 97 and up integra as it will cover B18B, C and C5

 

correct me if I'm wrong but isn't main journal diameter on a b20 crank larger than gsr main journal? I only ask because I was going to put a girdle on my b20 and noticed a step/lip where the block journal met the main cap without the crank installed. i.e. align bore of the journals was required.

edit: i meant to say the GSR Main Crank Journal is bigger.

 

main journal sizes on all the b series are the same.

 

Alright cause I just saw that it was the whole set up and figured it would be easier to just order that set as one. I have a haynes manual and started reading the engine section. I also have on of these books as well.


Im in the process of moving and getting everything together in one location so I can start inspecting all the parts so I can start posting up pictures of the process. Thanks for all the input and advice so far. Any other advice you could provide will be much appreciated as I stated before I have been working on Hondas for awhile now just never had to do any in depth motor work.

 

Hey stick with the B20. Better results for the low. Change the oil pump to type R or the gsr.

 

I think all obd2 oil pumps for b series are the same but I might be mistaken haven't looked at it in a while.

Id listen to runnerdown he has solid advice.

As for me, I run a 89mm crank and ls rods in a b18c block. Plug the oil squirters and now all your bearings both mains and rods are the ls//b20/b16 type. Oem and most aftermarkets like acl etc... will do fine its really the clearences that matter. All that comes from my personal experience over years of doing this