After finally getting my new build going, I called to make a tuning apt.

Jeff @ RRev had always tuned my car in the past, but they closed shop. So I called HP Freaks in Portland. He asked me what car/program I had and I said a NA Civic with S200. He said no thanks, "We're mostly BMW now."

He recommended Track Forged in Portland, so I called them. They(TF) told me that you can no longer tune S200 because Hondata required the dealers to delete all of there program information in order to obtain the new S100 and 300 programs.

What?

He also said that I could not use my ecu that I have running my S200 for the 300. He rec. S300 and that was it.

I hung up the phone failing to believe that my old system is literally a paper weight. Sure I know it's been discontinued, it's not a great program, but completely useless? I then started looking at Neptune Demon because I've wanted that EM for a while now. Speed Factory up in WA. is the closest shop to tune this program according to Neptune's dealer list, but after a phone call to SF...he said they are no longer tuning using Neptune. Hondata only.

So wtf do I do here guys? Give into S300 only because Hondata clearly has the market flooded over here and doesn't give the shops an option to use anything else or what? I really want the Demon but I cannot afford to trailer the car hours and hours away.

Another question I have is will my engine produce more power if I did switch from S200 to 300? Being an NA motor, will I benefit that much to drop the $$$ for 300? It's an 87x81/11:5~/big flow head. Thanks fellas.

 

Your engine won't produce more power from switching to s300 from s200

 

Thats kinda what I thought. The one shop was kinda *hinting* around that though, my guess is as a selling tool.

 

Damn... It's like those shops are trying to play you the way mechanics play women

 

Im 90% sure that Hondata no longer supports S100/S200... You will be hard-pressed to find a tuner that will want to use an out-dated platform.

Imo, get Neptune.

 

Track Forged is ridiculous. This is a personal story- perhaps I shouldn't share it here, but the whiskey is sinking in and it still pisses me off that they did this.

One of my students has a turbo Honda. He decided to get the car tuned by track forged. He setup the appointment, and went to get a DYNO tune.

First, he shows up- and they tell him his injectors are bad. They were not bad, but he HAD NOT wired in a resistor box as they were low impedance DSM injectors. So instead of having him wire in a resistor box to save the ECU they instead, a 30$.... told him HE had to buy a set of ID 1000 cc injectors. From them. So they killed him on them in price too.

He then is told that their dyno is down. So they have to street tune. They make HIM DRIVE for the street tune. Extremely reckless in my opinion.

So they are planning to tune the car on 8psi of boost. Probably because they knew they had a sucker on the line at this point, they tell him he HAS to buy a Hondata 4 bar MAP sensor to get the car tuned correctly. WHY!??!?!? The OEM MAP would have been fine!

So finally, they get the tune all done. And they then have him go to English to get the numbers off the dyno. I dunno how they got the ignition maps correct without using a Dyno to see what the car was doing. Tuner didn't go with the kid to English and they didn't make any adjustments on the dyno either... it was just the kid and English's staff strapping the car down and doing pulls.

Anyways, I find it hard to recommend them to anyone because they sure took that kid for a ride. Good kid too, just starting out, trying to learn.

TJ at English does all my tuning. I feel they are very honest and fair and I have been happy with their work and support. I believe they do s200 too... although I am not sure. Also may want to check out LJ racing in Eugene, I've known Joe for quite sometime and he's done good work with NA motors. He tuned one of my cars on s200 back in the day, so I'm sure he still does it.

 

IMO absolutely a selling tool. The only advantage I see in S300 over S200 is they are still supporting S-Manager with updates, and S300 does alpha-n (TPSxRPM instead of MAPxRPM) tuning for ITB setups. I can't see how you'd make more power with a good tune on one vs. a good tune on the other. The programs are very similar. Having poked around in S200's software, jumping to S-Manager wasn't much different at all....

 

Well you basically just made up my mind then. I appreciate that whiskey talking haha, I'm well on my way myself. A good friend of mine talked with James(?) at 808 and he also laughed at what these shops have been telling me. I'll more than likely be going to Garage 808. Thanks RC

 

That is the unfortunate thing with tuners these days. They are bending over and taking it up the *** from Hondata. I find it ridiculous that they can tell a customer what to use.... A tuner that only tunes using one piece of hardware is one to walk away from. I would rather have an honest well rounded tuner that will also listen to what it is the customer wants, not just what he can sell you!

That is why I started tuning myself, only tuner around here always dictated what hardware his customers could use. I would always tell people to avoid him at all costs. Unfortunately the only other tuners are 300-400km away. A reputable Honda tuner would be more like 800-1200km.

Glad you found someone that will work with you.

 

James can be an ******* but he is a damn good tuner. Then again my last experience with him was 4 or so years ago. Good luck with the tune!

 

That is incorrect.
Basically what it boils down to is nobody wants to tune s100 and s200 systems anymore because it requires Romeditor v4 with a dongle and an s200 module with all features.
Find a hondata dealer that still tunes s100/s200 or simply switch to another system.

 

And have you ever dealt with him in person... didn't think so...
The tuner you are talking about does a good job, he does not dictate what you HAVE to use for software, there are lots he will use, just a couple that he will not use. Big difference.
It's funny Miller even looked over some of his tuning and said nothing was wrong with it... guess everyone should listen to you (hahaha yeah right) and go somewhere else.

 

Clean Rice,

I have Neptune and really like it. There is a car meet at blue lake park this Saturday, I could show you neptune and how to tune yourself.

Jeff at Rrev tuned my civic as well in 08, great guy.

Any shop that tunes crome, you could probably work with if you know the neptune software. I'm guessing you dont know how to tune yourself? thats what my problem was in 08 Jeff however was able to tell me what to due and since I knew neptune software we made it work.

Now I tune my civic myself and its great.

I personally hate any software that the end user cant tune himself. Such as chrome you have to have a romulator and a chip burner... I'm a little biased as I started out with a fantastic system such as Neptune in 08 that allows me to do everything myself and not have to deal with silly antiquated tuning methods..

Down side, not a lot of people want to spend 500+ on a tuning method when, honestly chrome, ectune or... god forbid an SAFC.


If your looking for help or want to take a look at Neptune feel free to send me a PM and I'll bring my stuff along with me to the meet up on Saturday.

--Aaron

 

Yeah I know of three people who went up there wanting a tune with the software he always used to push. Only to be told that he no linger tunes using that software and they had to pay extra for his new taste of the month.

Not to mention he has no idea what he's doing with anything that isn't point and click........Motech..... should I continue? He is fortunate that he is the only tuner in the area! For now!

But according to you and the rest of the nut swingers he is the best...... Considering there is no where else to go sure why not!.........

 

I never said he is the best there is, just the best one locally, and yes he does know whats he's doing. He may not have tuned with motec but lets be honest how many people locally runs that system, it's not like it's cheap.
Anyways I really could care less what you think, I just find it funny that a nobody with a pos build that is taking 10 years to finish has so much to say about someone they have never personally dealt with...
Your name fits you well, it's the ghost accord that has and will never be seen.

 

Play nice.

 

You are partially correct. I've never dealt with him in person. I've only ever dealt with him over the phone and that was more than enough for me to say no f#@king way was he going to touch my car!

As for my build. So what if it takes me 10 years to build it, What dose that matter? Some people have other priorities besides cars. As far as being a nobody. I'm glad you think that way. I've helped more people around here than you could ever think of helping. I'm not in this for me like some people. Go back to slowmotion and the rest of your bag licking cronies would ya!

 

you can install and run both the new hondata software and the old software together on the same laptop....i do it.

 

Neptune RTP uses a romulator as well. Only difference is that you permanently instal it inside the ECU. I have my moates ostrich (romulator) permanently installed in my ECU. I run Crome Pro and leave the tune on the ostich, works the same as the Neptune RTP. I don't use chips, although I could very easily remove the ostrich and install a chip if I wanted to tune another car.

 

Thanks for the clarification.
--Aaron

 

im a hondata delaer in CA and i still choose to tune s100/s200 for the simple reason its affordable. meaning they dont have to choose between Crome Pro and a $495 unit hondata s100 at $195 is well worth it.we tune a lot of nitrous cars. and crome does not have an option for nitrous. we try not to tune any cars on crome. but some customers just dont have the funds for a more stable system, so we choose to work with them and their budget. hopefully by the end of the year im looking into becoming a neptune dealer.which would be even more affortable for our customers for a well rounded E/M that works well.