My roommate has a 04 sti, and with a wideband, a laptop and some software he was able to road tune all of his timing and a/f ratio's etc, and reflash his ecu.

I was wondering if ap2's ecu can be reflashed with modified files or if you have to go with an aftermarket / piggyback (i.e. aem ems, hondata, etc.)

Thanks

 

Hondata offers a reflash for 06-08 s2000's

 

So then if I get ahold of the maps, and the program to modify them then I could reflash the ecu myself correct?

 

I don't think so. I think you have to send your ECU to Hondata, they reflash it, then send it back IIRC

 

*scratches head* So I can send my ecu to hondata, they can reflash it and send it back without any piggyback or aftermarket ecu, but I can't do it? That doesn't make much sense at all.

 

You could send it in and get it reflashed but at $595 for $100 more you could get Flashpro.

Both these apply only if you have an 06+ AP2

For 06+ you can get Flash Pro here is more info

http://www.hondata.com/flashpro.html

If you have an 04-05 AP2 you cannot use the flash pro as the ECU does not have flash memory that can be rewritten. Your only option is either K-Pro or AEM.

 

Thanks camoy, that was more the direction I was looking towards. Reading the site I see no need of a wideband O2, is that the case? It appears that it just directly hooks up to the ECU itself. Or would I need the wideband for the a/f?

 

Just dont tune it, not worth it at all..

 

OK I guess I need to ask why is it you are tuning the car are you FI? I am guessing that you are since you state not wanting to run a piggy back unit. What MY is your S?

As for the wideband you need one to reliably tune any vehicle. The ecu will not need the wide band but you need to see the AFR while you are running on the dyno or street tuning.

 

[/QUOTE]If you have an 04-05 AP2 you cannot use the flash pro as the ECU does not have flash memory that can be rewritten. Your only option is either K-Pro or AEM.[/QUOTE]

^^ sux... i have an '05 and im **** outta luck. i would love the flashpro but i will have to see what else comes out in the future. if i was FI then i would get the k-pro...but way too much money for the simple bolt ons i plan on getting...i would love to lower my vtec point if it gained some extra horses but the VAFC seems to be a pretty wack option...

=(

 

I've heard the VAFC2 is good for WOT tuning just not partial tuning. I think it would still be worth it for boltons if you wanted to do it for now. Keep an eye out on s2ki.com. They pop up for sale every so often

 

VAFC2 works good for nothing, you cant change the timing.

 

AEM EMS

 

With just boltons you dont really need to change the timing do you?

 

Thanks camoy.

I'm doing it for 2 reasons: A) I want to learn, my roommate knows how to do it, so I'd like to learn first hand so that way, B) I'm hoping I'll have enough extra cash to put a kraftwerks sc in, and I'd like to be able to do it myself at that point, oh and i guess c) to squeeze what little extra numbers I can out in the process of learning ;P

It's an ap2. I would have just asked my roomate but he's not very good at answering phones

 

do you know how low the engagement point is to still make power? i am curious...i can get a first GEN Vafc from a friend... i kno there is a frog harness too but does it work for AP2? i know there was one for an AP1 but its discontinued

 

Even if you were just planning on lowering vtec, I would tune a VAFC on the dyno. Most of the people Ive seen that use it tune for WOT but I dont think they mess with vtec.

 

You will get more low end torque raising vtec.

 

I'm sure we will be analyzing every value possible :]. His STi is sitting at ~315hp (400 crank) with only a new inlet, and full spt exhaust, and of course his road tune. I appreciate all the information you guys have given me, I appreciate it. I'm trying to make this as much as a learning experience as I can.

 

Same here. I've been looking into a lot of tuning options. I might just end up going with an aem ems series 2. I know its over kill for boltons but I'll be one step closer for going turbo down the road.

 

OK still don't know the year of your AP2, if you are getting the Kraftwerks kit then the flash pro would work for you (read if you have an 06+ AP2). As the with super chargers you are limited by the pulley. If you have an 04 or 05 AP2 and you still want an EMS you will need to buy either K-pro or AEM. Though I am not sure how badly you would need one as the piggy back unit included with the kraftwerks kit is very good.

If you go K-pro and do not have a 06+ AP2 you will need to purchase about $350 in Honda OEM parts to install in your engine. The parts list follows:

Crank sensor 37500-PZX-003
Crank wheel 13622-PCX-013
TDC sensor 37510-PZX-003
TDC wheel 14112-PCX-003
Valve cover 12310-PCX-020
Drain plug washer (for PCV valve) 94109-14000
PCV valve 17130-PCX-003
IAT sensor 37880-P05-A00 (not required, but stock IAT will read about 30 degrees hotter)

It will take about a day for you to get these parts in. Two notes; you will need the hex tool for the crank pully that has a hole to allow a socket to pass through to the crank pulley bolt. You will also need at least a 1/2 breaker bar with a cheater pipe on the end as the bolt is torqued at 192 lbs ft. The next tricky thing is the exhaust cam position wheel, it is a left hand thread (service manual does not say this). Also it is an 8mm hex, you will need to buy a 8mm hex socket (3/8 drive) and cut off more than half of it. Then a flex head 3/8 ratchet to get on the bolt. Your wideband O2 analog output will be tapped into wire B21.

The rest is pretty straight forward. The pluses for K-Pro it starts like stock idles like stock and even reports back OBDII sensors and codes like stock (operates the dash temp gauge correctly). The bad all the crap you have to installl above, once you add this stuff in it costs a lot more than an AEM EMS.

AEM no parts to install just buy it apply the velcro to the back (it doesn't mount in the hole locations that your stock ECU does) and stick it in place. Wire the wideband to data log ( not sure which port it is). Pluses for the AEM more parameters can be played with it is a more powerful EMS if the tuner knows how to use it. If the tuner doesn't you can find yourself with a car that doesn't start real quick. The bad unless it is tuned right, exactly right start up and idle can be rough. You need to buy a fix for it to operate your dash temp gauge. No OBDII codes or output (can be a problem in emission controlled states). Oh and you will most likely need to beg someone to get a basemap for initial start up.

My suggestion to you save your money get the krafwerks kit and run it as is while you are "learning" don't get the kit and though in an EMS and try to learn that way. If you lean out the S motor while redlining your motor will be done. Once you understand what it is you are doing then if you still want to get the EMS and tune the car more. Though I am pretty sure that you will be happy with the Kraftwerks kit as it. If you are not happy with the kit then the issue will be that it does not put out the HP that you want. Then you will end up getting rid of it and going to a turbo. Then you will for sure need the EMS, sorry for the book but hope this helps.

Oh and VAFCs my take on them is not worth the money to buy then to really tune it the dyno time for getting the last few HP out of the add-ons that people do. If you know you are going to do a turbo later save your money and jump to it.

 

My apologies, It is an 06. Awesome information, thanks camoy!!

 

With the S being an 06 and you wanting the kraftwerks kit, the way to go is definately Flash-Pro. It will allow you to tune enough of the parameters to let you get started on learning about tuning. It is not as adjustable as K-Pro or AEM but you will be able to tune all the important parameters. With FI and an 06+ S you will run into problems with fuel delivery at high boost/HP before you really need to step into the fancy stuff that K-Pro and AEM let you change. The returnless fuel system is tricky to get working correctly, it is not like the older S where you just slap on a Walbro 255 and go.

So for your MY 06, kit choice, and desire to learn tuning I would get the Flash-Pro. It is about $600 so you can get it now and play with it and start to learn how to tune now. Hoepfully when you finally get the SC you will be ready to tune it.

 

It would be a lot safer tuning it while its still all motor then once you feel safe put your SC then re tune it all. I would rather just take it to the pros.

 

Yea, that's what I was planning on doing. Especially when I eventually get into FI, I definately won't be doing it alone... but I'd want to be able to do most of it myself, and look to my roommate for whatever questions I'm having. Appreciate the help guys :]