I also posted this on k20a.org



Hey guys,

Let me give you my set up first:

2002 RSX type S with K20a swap
Dropped on D2 coilovers
NO K-Pro
All stock other than that

About a week ago I was driving home from work when I hit a nasty bump! Said a few bad words cause I thought I might have hit the oil pan. I continued driving till I got to my house 2 miles away. On the drive home my oil light never came on, and I even got into Vtec to make sure I had oil pressure.

When I got home I looked under the oil pan and saw one small drop of oil (my car has never had an oil leak prior to this)....needless to say I got the car in the garage ASAP to inspect the damage further. There was a very slight crack on the pan along what appeared to be a previous welding patch job. I also sheered a bolt off on the passenger side motor bracket during the impact. I also noticed a chip on the crank pulley missing. It appears that the crank pulley made contact with the cross member when the mount bolt broke…I’m assuming? I knew it was time for a new pan so I drained the oil (no shavings on magnetic drain plug), pulled the old (cracked) pan off, and waited for my new parts to arrive. I even ordered a new valve cover gasket set since I was gonna be working on the car.

Parts arrived and I installed the new type S pan (Sealed with Hondabond), new mount bracket with new bolts, new valve cover gasket set. I let the Honda bond sit for 48 hours just to ensure it had time to cure properly.

I filled up with 5qts of oil, manually rotated the motor about 20 times. I pulled the ECU fuse and turned the motor over several times just to ensure I had oil flowing through all the passage ways prior to an actually start.

I replaced the ECU fuse and fired the car up......and the oil light stays on. I figured the oil sending unit wire may have come loose during all the work so I made sure it was secure then fired up the car again.....oil light stays on. I pulled the oil cap and sure enough there is fresh oil getting to the head and covering the cams. I fired up the car again and the oil light still stays on....revved the car a bit since I was sure oil was flowing and the motor ran rather rough (like something was outta balance). There wasn't any knocking noises or metal on metal sounds. I've spun bearings back in my b-series days so I'm familiar with rod knock and this didn't seem like rod knock.

Summary:

Hit a nasty bump and cracked my oil pan. NO oil light on the way home and did engage vtec...also no shavings in oil when drained (I have a magnetic drain plug), small chip was taken outta the crank pulley.
Replaced pan, pass side mount bracket and valve cover gasket set....
Now oil light stays on and very motor runs rough when revved.

Possibilities:
Messed up oil pump on impact?
Oil sending unit "just went out"?
Actually spun bearings and my R is screwed?
Crank Pulley is causing motor to run outta balance?

Any advice or pointers would help out a lot guys.

 

Any Ideas guys?

I was able to get my hands on a brand new OEM Oil Pressure Switch today. Was at work all day but will install it when I wake up.

Until then any suggestions?

 

Remove the low oil pressure light from the cluster?





j/k I really don't know man, something is missing here. If you had an aftermarket oil pressure gauge, that would really help in a situation like this. That's how I knew the oil pump on my Integra was starting to go because it normally held 75+psi, but then it started to only hit 50psi.

 

1)oil pressure sender checked with voltmeter?
2)you getting oil to the head, is there oil pressure?
3) did you inspect the oil pump and chain when the pan was replaced? When the pan was hit, the pump could have been damaged. you also may have had the chain jump on the cams.

lol at d2's on a k20a swap, I hope those pos to low spring rate coilovers did not cost you a type-r motor. I will never understand why people will spend tons of money on a sick motor and and then trust the suspension chores to some junk from the land of the eggroll.

 

1) Not checked but I installed a brand new OEM Sensor and the wire was never crimped/cut/damaged in anyway before/during/after the impact and repair.
2)Yes oil is getting to the head, but I can't read the oil pressure yet since I don't have an oil pressure guage on hand. I am working on that one though.
3) I inspected the chain and there was NO DAMAGE what so ever...I did not check timing however so that is a possibility I will have to look into further.

Thanks for the ideas!!! Good looking out

Car was purchased with k20a swap already installed. After having my EG stolen once and having to complely rebuild interior and exterior and peice together a quality GSR swap only to have it stolen again 6 months later and never have the shell turn up can be quite costly. Especially since insurance doesn't cover a majority of after market parts even if they are purchasced legally with documentation (recipts and cc statments). So saving a bit of cash and going with D2's (which are actually the same thing as K-sports just purple instead of orange) isn't as illogical as it may appear. D2's ain't buddy clubs by anymeans but for daily driving (which is all I do with the car), the suspension works great. I doubt having a 20k spring rate would matter anyways when the road look like this
___/\__/\____ but who knows maybe some buddyclubs would help with off road style driving....

 

Thanks for the suggestions guys, here is what i've done so far

changed sensor.... oil light still on

I had a friend come over and help with diagnostics....he said I may have used too much honda bond and clogged a passage way in the block or my oil pump is out cause it appeard that oil was not getting to the head. The only oil circulating was on the timing chain and that is because it dips into the pool of oil in the pan.

He also said that the motor running rough could be due to a combination of foul plugs (which I needed to replace anyways) and lack of oil to the head causing my valves to chatter.

So my next plan of action is:
1) Drain oil and see if there are shavings.
2) Clear any blockages of passage ways if they exist.
3) Order new oil pump or replace oil pump internals if there are no blockages.

Please keep the ideas coming, who knows maybe I just over looked something stupid

 

oil pressure sensors generally dont go bad, and if they come unplugged the light never comes on. your crank pulley is balanced by chipping it, it is now unbalanced, any bit effects it. depending on how hard the actual impact was depends on alot. drain your oil again and check for metal again. and i wouldnt drive it until you get a manual guage isntalled. trust me, when i was boosting D series i locked up 2 d16's due to no oil pressure, turned out my problem was a bottomed out sump. but be careful and let us know what is the deal.

 

Just thought about it and for something to check if you do take the pan off again, check to make sure the balancing shafts attached to the oil pump haven't been damaged or possibly knocked out of time with the crank, thus starting the process of vibrating your motor to death and possibly also affecting the flow of the oil pump since they are connected. It sounds like you hit pretty hard and it doesn't hurt to check everything. (I'm also assuming the K20a motor has this little treasure similar to the a3)

 

^^ I thought K20a's didn't have balance shafts? It's a comfort thing, not a performance thing.

 

The purpose of the balance shafts is for the longevity of the motor. Much like old porsche 944's, these shafts keep the motor from vibrating itself apart. Just guessing as to whether they are in a K20a. The shafts, if thrown out of balance, could cause some issues...comfort and otherwise.

 

Yea last night I had to tear everything apart. I went ahead and pulled the oil pump assembly. Considering this was my first K-series motor I thought it was similar to the type-s oil pump. WRONG, I discovered that the K20a does have balance shafts!!!

As soon as I saw this oil pump set up I realized it was timed as is the rest of the motor. I don't know if they shafts were outta time....but I did pull the whole assembly off to tear it apart and inpsect it for damage. There was absolutly no damage!

I also noticed that there was a mark at the bottom of my brand new type-s oil pan in exactly the same shape as my k20a oil pump sump.....

Here is my theory up to this point:

When the motor hit the crappy road I cracked the k20a pan along the previous owners repair weld. The impact also caused the oil pump to jump timing causing the balance shafts to rotate outta sync thus causing the motor to run rough. When I replaced my k20a pan with a k20a2 type-s pan it was too short to allow room for the k20a oil sump. In fact the two were making contact causing a serious lack of oil flow thus causing the oil light after the type-s pan install.

Next plan of action:
1) Get my k20a pan welded cause I can't find one online anywhere.
2) Re-install the oil pump assembly correctly timed.
3) Hope to GOD that I didn't spin bearings with all the oil starved starts!!!

 

Is the motor in the car right now? You might consider dropping the cradle with the motor in it. Could prove to be easier to access the side of the motor. Its a pain in the *** to line both chains up with limited space. Just a thought. Glad you isolated the problem. Good luck

 

Oh yea the cross member is only being held up by the ball joints of the kuckles....as much room as you can get on the floor of a garage.

 

Sounds like it is going to be an interesting challenge! If you can find TDC all the timing indicators will line up. Your gonna need a 6mm pin to keep those balancers in place while you assemble. Good luck and let us all know what your progress is.

 

6mm pin huh....how many paper clips add up to 6mm? haha jk....I'll just have to figure it out on the fly....I do currently have my motor lined up @ TDC since I was checking my timing prior to the oil pump assembly being removed. All is good up to this point, getting my k20a pan welded in the morning and gonna roll from there. Thanks for the help!

 

Good luck, report back to us!! I'm curious how this plays out.

 

mmMMMMmmmm....To my knowage, none of the dc5-r motors had balance shaft oil pumps...In fact I think none of the dc5's had balance shaft oil pumps...even the k20a3 motor that was in the base model....I wonder what motor you have.......

 

I assure you that the A3 has them...I have had my hands on them. As for the others, not sure.

 

Well My motor has 3 lobe intake and exhaust cams....rbc intake manifold...an oil sump that sits lower than a k20a2...an oil pan that is aluminum, stamped RBC, and isn't like a k20a2 pan or an other aluminum oil pan I've seen.....not to mention my block is stamped k20a and doesn't have a vin above the oil drain plug....not just popped off by a jacker but no rivets or anything...but I guess we will never know???

Worst case scenario... thats one hell of a base motor

 

Installed my oil pump lined up @ TDC.... Put my welded k20a pan back on.... All problems solved.... Thanks for the help guys

 

Sorry, the rsx base model k20a3 does not have balance shaft oil pumps....look for yourself....

http://www.acuraautomotiveparts.org/...ystemcomp=List All&vinnoT=&trim=&trans=&view=normal

In fact, most of the part numbers are different between the dc5-base motor and he ep3 motor...they are pretty much different motors.....If you do your research, any motor "K" that came from the jdm are labled "k20a"....even the motor out of the base rsx( integra).....my guess is to the op you have the type-r motor out of the ep3 that is real close to the k20z3 without the throttle by wire......a little lower compression, a little lower hp.

 

That very well maybe the case, I have no clue what car the motor came out of. I know K20A's came in a few different cars in Japan. I guess I could always just use a lil social engineering and use the serial # below the K20A stamp on the block to see where the trail leads. I know its faster than a stock type S. That how ever could be due simply to the RBC manifold. My concern is having the motor running properly since this is my daily driver. It just gets cool points with me since it's "JDM"

 

I stand corrected. I had no idea the RSX base and EP were that far apart on the family tree.