Just noticed i had some camber wear, after reading the number of posts that claimed this was in fact a myth and toe was actually causing the tire wear i was surprised it was dramatic as it was.

The story goes like this i'm running 96 integra gsr. toe 0 font and back, camber -2 front, rear. the car was just alligned, i watched the guy do it on a hunter machine so i know the numbers are right. Kumo XS tires. Since the alignment it has been about 3 weeks and i've seen one track day at lime rock, in ct. I was surprised to see how much the inside of the tires was warn out. The car was working well with this set up so i'm reluctant to change it, but it is eating the tires a little. I have a feeling that it's alot of negitive static camber(I know it's not extreme, but more than factory spec.), and i have no caster adjustment combined with the soft rubber that is making this problem a little more noticable than i have read that it should be. Just looking for some guys with more experience to comment, maybe share some setup info. And to let maybe some less experienced guys know that you can get some camber wear, given these conditions.

 

Did you rotate the tires after each session while at lime rock?
Hard driving will make them wear faster than daily driving.
Did you have the alignment checked again to see if something moved?

 

Correct me if I'm wrong, but with hard cornering doesnt the inside wear more even on a car with 0 camber?

Reasoning being that as long as the left and right side suspension is connected by swaybar (with larger ones making it more apparent), in a turn both sides will compress and gain camber. As the car leans toward the outside, the outside tire has a roughly even contact patch on the ground, while the inside tire will have the majority of the contact patch on the inside of the tire, thus increasing wear. Thoughts?

 

honda dnt get camber wear just toe wear is everything on ur car nice n tight?

 

Just because you watched somebody do an alignment does not mean they did it right. You may want to consider the sources of error in their alignment procedure.

It's also possible that hard driving caused the toe to come out again.

It's also possible that you get some toe out under braking.

I would play dumb and go back to the alignment shop and have them check it again.

 

In addition to what others have said above, there are other things that can cause excessive tire wear on the inside of the tread. Specifically, I'm referring to suspension problems, everything from bent components (e.g. control arm), to blown shocks, to blown ball joints, to rotting/cracking bushings. Put your car up on a lift and have it checked thoroughly by a guy who's really good with suspensions.

And if you're wondering why the tire wear is occurring now rather than earlier... It could be because the alignment was done wrong (as stated above). However, it could also be because you now have stickier, faster-wearing tires and you just did a track event, so you have gone through a whole lot more tire wear than you would normally experience with the same small number of street miles on less sticky tires.

I've gone through suspension problems like these in the past 12 months with all three of my cars, and the primary symptom that alerted me to the problems was tire wear on the inside of the tread in all three cases. One car (which is sometimes tracked) turned out to be ball joints, another (which is also sometimes tracked) turned out to be bushings, and the third (daily driver only) was a combination of leaky shocks and a bad spring.

 

Whats the offset of your wheels? Lower offset wheels increase scrub radius.

 

Does a change in scrub radius correlate to more or less uneven wear?

 

I run massive front camber, -4*.

My street tires wear perfectly evenly.

My track tires wear out the inside faster. I was confused as to this, until I learned just how much inside front tire spin I get exiting corners. I'm sure threshold braking with that much camber also has to wear the inside faster.

Once you hit the track, all bets on tire wear are off. Take temps, try to keep them happy, and understand that you just wrote them off as expendable the instant you put the car on track.

What beanbag wrote is also probably correct. Lowering our cars produces toe out. Brake dive should do so as well.

 

off set is 37mm.

About the alignment, i will get it checked again for sure. But the guy that did the alignment definatly knew what he was doing. It wasn't a fly by night shop, he definatly took some extra time to make sure everything was correct. However it was very possible that something got knocked out of wack. It was in the back of my head that this could be the case, I just really don't want to believe it.

First i heard of brake dive causing toe out, would the special projects upper control arm kit help this because of the increase in caster? I have the skunk 2 kit on there now and they seem very similar, i could be wrong tho.

Interesting about the bushings. this is my third summer on poly bushings, i will be replacing them next summer. I have been inspecting them frequently, so far all is good, they are just getting pretty squeaky. There was a post in here about a guy running them for 6 years, and his looked pretty worn out. i figure it will be good to replace them over the winter as i don't drive the car.

I more or less rotate the tires weekly or bi weekly to try to keep the wear as even as i can. Never thought to rotate tires between sessions, i'm thinking that might make it harder to keep tire pressures consistant. I'm about 10 pounds low in the outside front. run fronts at 33 rears at 30 hot.

Also i'm pretty new to this, just trying to learn. I feel like the car still has more in it than i'm capeable of, as much as i hate saying that, ha. thanks for all the info!

 

Well, if you wanted to rotate tires between sessions during the event, you could add and subtract 3 psi to the appropriate tires. However, there's a problem with rotating tires during the event, which is a time constraint. Make sure you allow enough time to let the tires/wheels/hubs cool down a bit before you swap tires around. I once made the mistake of swapping a wheel/tire shortly after coming off the track, when the hub was very hot. As a result, I could torque the lug nuts to, I don't know, I'm guessing maybe 60 ft-lbs, but when I went further than that with the torque wrench, it just wouldn't reach the point for it to click (set for 80 ft-lbs). What happened was that the lugs were hot enough that they stretched as I tried to tighten them. Lesson learned.

I don't normally rotate tires between sessions. I usually put them on the car in specific places (e.g. the one with the least wear on the outside shoulder goes on the left front where the shoulder wears the fastest; the one with the most wear on the outside shoulder goes on the right rear where the shoulder wears the slowest; ones I'm trying to wear out the quickest go on the front where they get more wear; etc).

 

this is what i do also.

 

Increasing scrub causes more tearing/shearing of the tread as it rolls. It will exacerbate what others may consider a "normal" alignment setting.

In this case - 37mm isn't all that earth shattering - something like a 10-20mm offset on the other hand...

 

shocks are an often overlooked source of tire wear. my DD uses tame 300F 250R rates on a 2650lb DC2. after months of using the underdamped tokico blues the tires developed what looked like toe wear. after doing the tape check total toe out was under 1/8", i swapped out the blues for a set of koni sports set in the middle. the "toe wear" has vanished