Hi Guys, I have an old Miller Dialarc HF-P. On the machine it says it draws 76amps at 240v. I plan to run a wire from the breaker box to my garage, but searching the internetz tells me i need 2gauge wire to handle 76 amps?! is that correct?

Basically what I'm asking is ... how are you guys wiring up these welders? Are you using 2 gauge wire? If not, what are you running?

I just don't think people are running 2 gauge wire for their welders b/c its huge! also the plug on the welder itself is not a 2 gauge

thanks for your input

 

get an electrician to do it for you and give him a case of beer.

 

firstly, i dont think an electrician would do it for a $20 case of beer

secondly, i am perfectly capable of doing this myself. i have already run 220v power from my breaker in my basement to my garage... its just the current wiring is not thick enough for the welder's amperage. i researched the internet and it says for around 80amps you should be using a 2 gauge wire ... but i find that hard to believe for some reason ... can anyone provide a better/more thorough answer please?

 

you obviously arnt capable if you are here asking questions about what to do...........

know that your welder might MIGHT MAYBE peak at 76 amp draw, but wont hold that

it should weld fine off of a 30a circuit.

if it truly pulls 76 amps that fuccer is a beef cake and its going to burn your house down

 

thank you welfarepc ... you gave me the answer i was looking for.

i am new to welding (im setting up my first machine in my garage) but i AM capable ... i think if i wasnt capable i wouldntve even thought/planned this much and just hooked it up ... of course it probably wouldve been OK but thats not my style.

i know my post count on this forum is low (i lurk a lot since i dont add much welding knowledge) but it irks me when more knowledgable forum members give answers like "get an electrician" especially when my question is perfectly valid and worded normally. im sure this information can help others as well.

i know people like to have the hoity-toity attitude of knowing it all ... and thats cool, but at least share the knowledge also! i mean people have to learn somewhere right?

 

If you are supposed to use 2 guage wiring, and you have researched it, then why would you go any thinner?? and if the welder peaks at 76 amps then there is a good chance taht it will hit that on occasion, which will pop your breaker.

Second thing to look at is that you said your house is 220 and the welder is rated at 240volt...well the higher the voltage the lower the amperage in most cases so by dropping 20 volts you will be needing a couple extra amps to make up that difference, of course that is how I understand it and I could be wrong, but I don't think so.

Also you should check to see what your service to your house is...if its only 80 amps or 100 amps then you are in for some serious power troubles running a welder that size, you might get interference, power surges and the like... Just some things to think about.

 

Just a data point. I have my Miller Dyanasty 200dx hooked up to a regular 110v receptacle and have welded aluminum at 200 amps on a 15 amp breaker. Its not something i would recommend but it can be done if you take some breaks in between beads to let the breaker and wiring cool down. At 220v a 30 amp breaker and the proper wiring for those loads should be more than enough for my 200 amp tig.

As im sure you know be careful, and it never hurts to upsize your wiring except in the wallet. Good Luck!

 

My electrician I believe ran 3 - 10gauge wire (1)green (1)white (1)black to a double 60 amp breaker. and i run a tigmate cracked max it will pull 76 amps on ac ,hasn't give me any issuses yet it been over 6months and i do alot of welding.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by CarTunr22 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Just a data point. I have my Miller Dyanasty 200dx hooked up to a regular 110v receptacle and have welded aluminum at 200 amps on a 15 amp breaker. Its not something i would recommend but it can be done if you take some breaks in between beads to let the breaker and wiring cool down. At 220v a 30 amp breaker and the proper wiring for those loads should be more than enough for my 200 amp tig.

As im sure you know be careful, and it never hurts to upsize your wiring except in the wallet. Good Luck!</TD></TR></TABLE>
you have an inverter type welder, not the same as an old *** dialarc as I'm sure you know....

 

ddeviant, my research said 2 gauge, but it tripped my common sense sensor... 2 gauge is HUGE and i just figured that people werent running it. i made the post to get more information.

also 220v is pretty much 240v. i am aware that 220v requires more amps (amps*voltage=power). my house gets 200amps. i think ill use 6 gauge wire on a 30 amp breaker and see how it works ... at least this way the wire will be beefy enough, and it will be setup so that the breaker will trip before wires melt

thanks guys

 

I'd call an electrician, because you clearly don't understand how that machine works. If it says it draws 76 amps, why the hell would you put in a 30 amp breaker?

If you have home owners insurance, you might be [freak]ed if you do it yourself and burn down your house.

 

I had one of those machines. great machine but it will blow a 30 and a fifty is alright if your not going to flat foot it. 60 will work. all depend on what your going to be welding.

do it once and forget about it or play around and do it twice

 

Yeah most house insurance policies will be void if you don't either have a certified electrician do the work, or get it inspected after you do it.

 

keep in mind, it should only be drawing 76 amps at 100% duty cycle, which probably won't be all that often.

my dad (my electrican) doesn't drink beer, so he did it for free.

 

hey k24em2, please explain how the machine works since i 'clearly dont understand how this machine works' ... are you running a 2 gauge wire around the house? i figured i would run a 30a breaker first so that would be the failsafe ... a breaker tripping is easy to reset, and replace ... however melting wires is much worse. if it pops the 30 repeatedly, ill just pull it out and put a 50amp in its place

it says it draws 76 amps ... turns out thats at 100% duty (thanks to the help of this forum), which i doubt i will be using... so most of the time 30a or 50a will do, and it will just pop the breaker when it goes above that ...

good call about the homeowners insurance though. id better get my work checked out, but im sure itll be fine.

 

If you do any AC welding with it you will DEFINITELY need a bigger breaker. The old machines take a LOT of power.

Do it right, or do it twice.

 

2 Gauge wire is good for 200 amps, you can use 6 or 4 gauge .. 6 gauge can handle 80 amps and 4 can handle 125..

People probably just use 2 gauge to be super safe..

also, when it says 76 amps, thats going to be the MAX that its gonna take, if your using the complete duty cycle, its the same thing as a car audio amp, when the box says MAX POWER 1000 Watts, if you pump 1000 watts for more than a minute your ***** gonna blow, but it CAN get turned up to 1000 watts

 

The gauge of the wire must increase as the length of the run increases too...Like 2 gauge is only good to acertain lenght then you have to go to 1 guage, beyoun that multiples of 0 guage.... Really if you don't know what you are doing don't do it, you are playing with you life here, not to mention your house everything you own......


Modified by DDEVIANT1 at 8:53 AM 5/6/2008

 

You should do a load calc on your main panel before you go pulling any wire. You may be using more power for everyday things then you realize.

That is a whole lot of power to be screwing around with yourself. The $100 you save doing it yourself may be the worst $100 you ever saved if your burn down your house/garage whatever.

That being said, 2 should work given reasonable distances to the panel. The inrush current on that transformer is going to be large, it may be 76 amps, or it may be even higher due to the age of the transformers and thermal break down of the insulation barriers in the core. This is one reason I would have a electrician put an ammeter on the damn thing when you turn it on and watch it, then watch it while you weld.

 

thats what im sayin, he said he read that 2 gauge is what people use, to be really safe, the 6 can handle 200 amps, but his welder is going to push 76 amps MAX, so id say at more than 20 feet its gonna knock off amperage handling, but i still say the 6 gauge is fine

 

It really depends on how far he is running the wire. If his garage is 200 feet from the breaker panel you could have issues with smaller wire.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by bamboosted &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">My electrician I believe ran 3 - 10gauge wire (1)green (1)white (1)black to a double 60 amp breaker. . </TD></TR></TABLE>

You better find a new electrician, thats against code. #10 wire can be fused at 30amps MAX.

Whoever said 2 gauge wire is good for 200amps is a moron, for 200amps you need 3/0.

As far as voltage drop.. I wouldn't worry about it TOO much, your good 5% drop is within limits, 3% if its between services, but thats not the issue.

As far as doing a load calculation on his current service, i doubt he has the knowledge or you, do to any accurate type of load calculation, residential load calculations are usually pretty low, he should be find to add a welder... Unless he has a 60amp service.

If the welder draws 76amps, You should use #2 wire and a 80amp breaker. Just get a piece of romex, its not that expensive.

From the knowledge you display here you sure don't sound too capable of doing it yourself.. btw, i am a electrician.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by HamiltonRex &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
From the knowledge you display here you sure don't sound too capable of doing it yourself.. btw, i am a electrician.

</TD></TR></TABLE>

winnAr

 

On my 250DX we have an 80 amp breaker and THHN #4's to a disconnect, then a whip with #4's as well into the machine.

This has not failed me at all, we have been running this for over a year now, but I have never and dont plan on running 300+amps on the machine, the most ive used is 260 for some thicker aluminum pieces.