i found out i should bleed them in a certain order... does anyone know what order this is?

Right Rear, Left rear... etc... ???

because it has ABS, they said i should make sure i do EXACTLY as Honda recomends!

i couldn't find a link on the model specific US version '02 civic si brake bleed, anyone else find one?

Thanks!

 

WAIT- i'm not Bleeding them dry.. i'm Flushing the sysytem.
i'll be using the new "DOT 5.1 Synthetic ABS fluid"

also... should i install the new pads and rotor PRIOR to doing the bleed/FLUSH?
or vice versa?
i think it is "change pads first" but i'm just checking!

 

If you're in Minnesota and running the car year-round, then use standard DOT 4 fluid (especially if it is a street car). Castrol makes a good DOT4 fluid, and it's cheap. The synthetic absorbs too much water and needs to be changed frequently for maximum performance.

As for bleeding procedure--it should be the same for the RSX as it is for the EP3. Pretty standard stuff.

Yes, change the pads/rotors first, then bleed.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Todd00 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">...The synthetic absorbs too much water and needs to be changed frequently for maximum performance.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
ok...
Thanks Todd...

?but now i'm even more confused... ?

this is why i bought the ABS synthetic DOT 5.1-
http://www.carcare.org/Brakes/brake_fluid.shtml
"Brake fluid must meet one of three U.S. Department of Transportation (DOT) specifications. DOT3 and DOT4 are glycol-based fluids, which absorb water. DOT5 is a silicone-based fluid and does not absorb water. The main difference is that DOT3 and DOT4 absorb water, while DOT5 doesn't. "

hmmm.... ????


as far as -the same pattern as the RSX-
after a quick Google search...
"...ok, bleed it from the farthest to the mbc which is the rear right, then rear left, then the front right and front left."

Does that sound correct? -because- A brake-bleed Video i saw shows them doing the Bleed under the master cylinder first, then moving away from it...

(seems like there are too many experts on the web!)
i just dont want to get in it and...
the brakes feel softer than before!

....or one wheel stops faster than the rest!

...or the ABS light wont go off

...ETC! i just want them done right, Perfectly!

thanks for the help!

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by WyldRice &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> (seems like there are too many experts on the web!)</TD></TR></TABLE>
LOL i was collecting my tools to get the rotor/pad job done first this morning-

one EP3 brake DIY thread said to get 10, 14, 17, and 19mm wrenches/sockets .
..so i bought the missing ones last night

i just read another thread thismorning that states "Get these tools- 11mm, 12mm, 13mm, 18mm... " etc.

WTF???
- i guess each ep3 was made differently! LOL

"That is not the correct order to bleed the brake lines. You start at the left front, then to the passenger front, next is passenger rear, then you finish up on the driver rear. Basically clockwise from the driver side front of the car.
This info. is straight from the RSX-S Service Manual.
my friend works for honda and told me this is how you do it. so that's how I did it."

GRRRRRRR......

"1. Start with your car facing NORTH!"
"No!
1. Start with your car facing SOUTH you idiot!!!!"

guess i really wont know until i start this nightmare-
WISH ME LUCK! i'm going to the garage... BBL ...MUCH LATER!


Modified by WyldRice at 6:57 AM 11/11/2007

 

ok,
i searched this question about bedding my brakes- check this answer out...
"How do i bed my burnish my new brakes?"

The new brake rotors should be used lightly with no performance testing or heavy usage. go five or six days of gentle driving.
(On the new rotors and pads?)

SEASONING ROTORS FIRST
Bring them up to temperature= Perform four consecutive stops from 60 mph to 15 mph at about 50% maximum stopping force.

Next, drive for 5 continuous minutes at freeway speeds and allow the rotors to cool.
Then perform four medium-effort stops from 60 mph to 15 mph with approximately 75% stopping force.
Once this procedure is complete, drive at freeway speeds for about 10 minutes with little or no braking and allow the rotors to cool.

Park the car and allow the brakes to cool overnight.

The NEXT DAY, warm the brakes to full operating temperature and perform
four more 50% effort stops, followed by a 5-minute freeway cool down.

Then perform four more 75% effort stops, followed by a 10 minute cool down drive.

Then, perform six hard-effort stops from 60 mph to 15mph, taking care not to lock up the wheels.

Follow this with another 10-minute freeway cool down.

Again, allow the car to sit overnight and the rotors to cool to ambient air temperature.

Bedding Brake Pads
Once the rotors have been seasoned, the pads can be bedded.
(um, Didn't i "Bed" the pads when i was seasoning the rotors?)
No!-

...Never bed pads on rotors that have not first been seasoned, as outlined above.
(WTF?)

To properly bed new pads of any type,
perform two light to medium stops from 65 mph to 10 mph. This will bring the rotors up to temperature.

Then, perform two back-to-back heavy stops from 65 mph to 10mph at a point just prior to wheel lockup or ABS actuation.

Drive for 10 minutes to allow the brakes to cool, then perform three light stops in succession.

Finally, perform eight heavy stops in succession from 65 mph to 10 mph.
Again, push the brakes as hard as possible without achieving wheel lockup or ABS actuation.

Finish the bedding procedure by driving another 10 minutes, allowing the brakes to cool.

-ok, by now my pads and rotors are about half gone... and need to replace both again soon! Right? LOL!

anybody know the correct proceedure-
this seems ridiculous that i would need to do this "Easy 28 Step Burn and Turn" system to get them on right.

And should i "Season" the rotors with "Old PADS?" that seems odd???
-too much info!-

HELP straighten this out- if you can make heads or tails of it! THANKS!!!

 

What are you doing with the car, exactly? If it is just a street car, then it really doesn't matter in what order you do pads/rotors/bleed.

I know plenty of people that do pads/rotors are the same time and get good stopping power and brake life. Now, if you are running for the SCCA runoff championship then I'd say go for that extra .10, but does what you are doing with the car really matter that much to get your head spinning?

Also:

"However, silicone is the highest-maintenence of all brake fluids, one that demands frequent attention. While this is acceptable in a race setting, it is less so in everyday commuting. The plain fact remains that vehicle manufacturers use glycol fluid because, with its being designed for the average consumer, it poses the least liability to them. In reality, the answer to the usage question is simple -- the brake fluid type the manufacturer recommends is the best. In most cases this will be the glycol fluid, the one that is designed to meet all of your brake system's demands and do so with very little fuss. "

Again, if you have a street or weekend autox car, DOT 4 will be fine and it won't present any problems.

Read this for more info on brake fluids:

http://www.stoptech.com/tech_i...shtml

Also, why are you spending so much money on a DOT 5.1 brake fluid? Will you really need that extra performance?

"You start at the left front, then to the passenger front, next is passenger rear, then you finish up on the driver rear. Basically clockwise from the driver side front of the car.
This info. is straight from the RSX-S Service Manual.
my friend works for honda and told me this is how you do it. so that's how I did it."

= that's how I bleed them.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Todd00 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Also, why are you spending so much money on a DOT 5.1 brake fluid?</TD></TR></TABLE>
Why not have the best... it's designed for ABS-and higher temps and only cost about a dollar more than DOT 4.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Todd00 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Will you really need that extra performance?.</TD></TR></TABLE>
yes, i live on the (in winter times "icy") ski hill! my ABS system gets USED and ABUSED-
that's why i want performance brakes- 15% Grades! there's even 20% Grades going down by the river!
my kids do ride with me at times! better safe, than sorry!
i've seen too many idiots get brake fade coming down our hills- and i've even experienced it once or twice- Not Cool!

if i lived on the plains of the midwest, i wouldn't worry about this stuff.
...could i get by with "Reg, Cheap Brakes" Sure... by why not go with better stuff?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Todd00 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I know plenty of people that do pads/rotors are the same time and get good stopping power and brake life.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Cool!

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Todd00 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">"left front, passenger front, passenger rear, driver rear.
= that's how I bleed them.</TD></TR></TABLE>
AWESOME!

Thanks again for setting me straight Todd... YOUR THE BEST!
i went to do them this morning, but wifeypoo got called into work

so, Car's up on stands, tools in place... kids were fed lunch...

just waiting for hunny to get home so i can have someone watch the ankle-biters for a few hours!

....1/2 hour and i'll be wrist deep in greasy knuckles!


Modified by WyldRice at 1:16 PM 11/12/2007

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by WyldRice &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">


yes, i live on the (in winter times "icy") ski hill! my ABS system gets USED and ABUSED-
that's why i want performance brakes- 15% Grades! there's even 20% Grades going down by the river!
my kids do ride with me at times! better safe, than sorry!
i've seen too many idiots get brake fade coming down our hills- and i've even experienced it once or twice- Not Cool!

if i lived on the plains of the midwest, i wouldn't worry about this stuff.
...could i get by with "Reg, Cheap Brakes" Sure... by why not go with better stuff?</TD></TR></TABLE>

Performance brakes won't help you out in this situation. Good working brakes is what you need, and nothing is 'better working' then a good OEM 100% system.

Note that your ABS system was designed to work with OEM pads and fluid. Changing this in extreme ways (performance pads, DOT 5.1 fluid, etc) might have a negative impact on this, thus negating what you are trying to do.

Honda ABS systems are usually pretty good with adapting, but on all of my race Hondas with ABS I've noticed that the attitude of the ABS system changes. This may not be a good thing on icy roads.

Also, consider engine braking techniques for extreme hills. That and a decent set of pads is all you need. Driving on the track is a lot more demaning and requires something different than a good street setup. You're building a track setup and I don't think that's quite the best approach--but that's your decision.

 

ok, thanks Todd- i get what your saying...
and your right if it's just my DD...
but i dont use my gears to slow my car! (our transmissions are touchy enough!)
i slowly pump the brakes while going downhills- i never upshift and let the clutch out!
(i guess in an emergency i would)

so, when i went in to get serviced, i got the "You need brake flush, pads, and rotors"
No, i didn't!
the back pads were only about half gone- but i changed them, expecting the fronts to be worse.
...the rear rotors were fine so i didn't mess with them!

when i got to the front....
almost brand NEW PADS! -maybe 4/5th compound left compared to the Hawk pads

Fkucin Stealership just wanted to squeeze another $700+ out of me for Nothing (Bogus Brake Service!)
...so i didn't have to change the front pads or rotors.

i did a brake bleed on all 4 -since i had everything off... and put the snow tires on,

other than that- it was just a HUGE waste of 2 days and a bit of money!
(<U>at least i'll have everything and the know-how for when they do need replacing</U>)

Thanks again Todd.

 

Just rev-match and slip the car into a lower gear (not too low) when going down large hills. That's not hard on the tranny and it will keep the car somewhat slowed down and save your brakes.

 

does this need replacing?


<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Todd00 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">That's not hard on the tranny and it will keep the car somewhat slowed down and save your brakes.</TD></TR></TABLE>
i thought that was hard on this engine... Brakes are "Replaceable!"
going up and down the hills produced too much back pressure -with the old "Carbon Fiber (Fart-can) Exhaust"-
it sounded like it was always on the verge of backfiring- and after a few days with the car and searching forums, i came to the conclusion that i'd be better off using the brakes.

NEW Hankook I-Pike Ice Grabbers (they are about 1+1/2" taller than the Neo-Gens)

i picked it up with 41K miles, so it must have had a front brake job already...
i'm pretty sure they are not OEM. so only about 10,000 miles on the front pads-

and EVERYTHING was painted red- pads, spring covers, lines, etc...


with the "mis-matched pads" i'll see how it is on the ABS system (as we get some more snow!)

*PS- IMHO, if you must have a carbon fiber hood- get it to match!-
people can't tell on mine unless they get 15 feet away from it! (see pics!)


Modified by WyldRice at 1:15 PM 11/12/2007