i have been trying to search a little but im not comming up with the answers im needing. im in the process of building an lsvtec and im to the point where i need to buy some pistons. the problem is i dont know which pistons i should run. basically im going to run a b18a1 bottom end out of a 93 integra ls. i havent opened up the block yet due to the car is still running but im planning on staying 81mm, not sleeving, running a block guard, i have a set of eagle H beam rods ( im told there the early design with smaller rod bolts), i plan on having everything blanced out including flywheel and crank pully, only thing i need is pistons and bearings. im planning on running around 12.5:1 comp. if i was going to run oem pistons id prolly get some p30 pistons. but since im going to run aftermarket rods i might as well run pistons. but whats confusing me is the more i read up, the more i dont know what to do. i know 80% of problems with different builds is prob user error. but from what i read i have to think about low silicon, high silicon, them cracking, them scaring sidewalls of cylinders? i thought about just contacting eagle and askimg them what they recomend but i thought i would see if i can get some feedback from here.

 

Supertech, CP, Mahle, Wiseco, Arias all make a good piston. The clearance's just need to be correct.

 

run honda pistons. forged pistons need more piston to wall clearance because they expand more than cast pistons do. get a set or jdm itr pistons that are oversized and have the machine shop bore and hone your block so you have about 1.5 thousands piston to wall clearance or so. this will leave you with 11.7:1 compression. perfect for the street. if you want more, have the block decked or mill the head to get the desired compression you want. goodluck

 

well if you suggesting he get the blocked bored and honed, then he might as well get aftermarket pistons rather than the jdm ITR, since the piston to wall wouldnt be an issue anymore.

 

He already has eagle rods so if he still wants to use them he would have to either A) rebush them to press fit the itr pistons on or...
B) have the itr pistons machined to accept circlips
C) do the logical thing and get some strong, light weight pistons.

Eagle will probably recommend JE's or SRP's since they sell them.

Low silicon pistons expand less with heat. You will want the block honed to the clearance specified by the piston manufacturer not by what someone says on the internet (unless you can truly trust them and their reputation.)

Rico

 

Whatever mr_magoo says. He probably knows how to fit the press pins in your Eagle rods, or how to add circlips to the OEM pistons. I would have him do this for you on the cheap, as it is his suggestion. Actually he should do it for free, because that's what his info is worth, nothing.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by DonF &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Whatever mr_magoo says. He probably knows how to fit the press pins in your Eagle rods, or how to add circlips to the OEM pistons. I would have him do this for you on the cheap, as it is his suggestion. Actually he should do it for free, because that's what his info is worth, nothing.</TD></TR></TABLE>

I smell own3ag3

In less sarcastic terms, If your running eagle rods you cant run honda pistons without haveing the pistons machined to fit the circlips. or the rods rebushed because the eagle rods do not accept pressed in pins like the stock rods do.

My $.02: If the car is a street car that you hope to get alot of mileage out of before a rebuild just run oem (itr, ctr) parts and keep the revs down. otherwise if you want to go all out use forged internals.

 

spun Vtec- thank you for the 2 cents thats what im looking for. now i am planning on this to be a dialy street car and i know i cant go around town reving to 10k every light. i had no intent to, but i would like to build it since i already have most the parts. you say to go with stock rods and pistons unless i plan to do a rebuild soon? why is that? i dont plan on running stock pistons due to the extra work. i might as well run aftermarket. are you saying aftermarket rods and pistons are going to be less relyable than stock? if so why? thats what im trying to learn. from what i know or thought, which isnt much since im just learning. when you build a motor for more power, its better to go aftermarket.... so im just trying to learn how to find out which one is better for my needs. i mean i plan on trying to get a 13 or 12 second car out of this and wouldnt mind being able to auto cross. and that also in a car planned to be daily drivin. no i dont plan on beating it every time i get in it but i also want to take all the proper steps needed in this build to make it last, within a budget. and what i mean by that is only step i dont plan on doing is sleeving. right now im leaning toward Wiseco.

 

With proper machining, correct assembly, regular maintainance, a good tune, and a smart/good driver, you will not have any longevity issues whatsoever.

 

forged pistons expand more with heat than oem cast honda pistons do, You will have to run a larger bore (bigger piston to wall clearance) On a race engine no prob they are usually ran to the max and dont see more than 40,000-50,000 miles. An All honda internal combo with 12:1 compression If driven right would last at least 80,000 miles.
Im no expert but If your not spraying the motor I would sell the eagles becasue your intent is not to make huge revs.
I would say you could easily make a high 12 - low 13sec car out of a ITR piston shot peened rods and arp rod bolts.
I would reccomend lower compression around 12:1 for a street motor. less risk on pump gas. I dont see a real "need" for forged internals in your app.

If you dont care and dont mild to rebuild after a few 10,000. miles and want to spend extra money that you dont really need to just to feel good than go for it. What head are you going to run? I assume vtec b16a, b18c1??

 

B16A HEAD, minor porting and pollished, gsr cams ( plan on buying skunk2 stage2), skunk2 intake man, 70mm bbk tb, stock inj (plan on buying rc 370cc)

 

seems like from reading other peoples posts, aftermarket pistons and stock sleves dont go well together. i think thats what some of you are trying to tell me.

 

bump for you cause im trying to figure out the same thing

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by sled &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">seems like from reading other peoples posts, aftermarket pistons and stock sleves dont go well together. i think thats what some of you are trying to tell me. </TD></TR></TABLE>

no. people are trying to tell you that if the piston to wall clearances are within spec and the tune is good you dont have to worry about forged pistons.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by doood &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

no. people are trying to tell you that if the piston to wall clearances are within spec and the tune is good you dont have to worry about forged pistons.</TD></TR></TABLE>

lol so basically if i choose Wiseco 81mm pistons, make sure i have the block honed or bored to its specs?

 

bump

 

Why do you think you need forged pistons in a naturally aspirated street motor???

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by spun Vtec &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Why do you think you need forged pistons in a naturally aspirated street motor??? </TD></TR></TABLE>

honestly, thats where im a newb and im asking. the more i think about it, if the compression range im after i can get with oem pistons and rods, what are the benifits of going aftermarket rods and pistons.... i dont know the answe to that questions. honestly the reason im leaning toward aftermarket rods and pistons are because i already own rods, didnt pay for them, and there new in box (been sitting on the shelf for a long time) seems like by the time i sell them, buy stock pistons and get the machine work done. i might as well just go with aftermarket pistons if its better. meaning am i going to get more power, more reliable out of aftermarket vs stock. i always assumed yes. but im still learning

 

yup that was my same question. tryin to build and all motor high comp myself. and im wondering the same thing since this going to be my first motor build ... i know theres at least one person out there that has the answer to that question!! come on ... help us newbies out.

 

You do not need forged pistons in a naturally aspirated street motor. Oem pistions will be fine for well over 250+whp with a good tune. There arent any benifits that i can see from useing an forged piston over a stock piston. other than that they can be used with eagle rods. I dont know alot about b-series rods but i doubt you even need forged rods if you are staying below 8500 rpm with arp rod bolts. (others welcome to chime in here).
T<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by spun Vtec &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">forged pistons expand more with heat than oem cast honda pistons do, You will have to run a larger bore (bigger piston to wall clearance) On a race engine no prob they are usually ran to the max and dont see more than 40,000-50,000 miles. An All honda internal combo with 12:1 compression If driven right would last at least 80,000 miles. with good tuneing</TD></TR></TABLE>

There are alot of other threads about this topic so try searching.

 

use forged pistons if you cant get the compression you want with oem pistons or if you're going for a bigger bore

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by spun Vtec &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">You do not need forged pistons in a naturally aspirated street motor. Oem pistions will be fine for well over 250+whp with a good tune. There arent any benifits that i can see from useing an forged piston over a stock piston. other than that they can be used with eagle rods. I dont know alot about b-series rods but i doubt you even need forged rods if you are staying below 8500 rpm with arp rod bolts. (others welcome to chime in here).
T

There are alot of other threads about this topic so try searching.</TD></TR></TABLE>

forged pistons and rods ARE lighter than OEM parts. In nearly ALL cases. It means higher reliable revs. Easier to accelerate the piston up and down. Easier on the crankshaft and on the sleeves since there will be less load on the sleeves.

A lighter rotating assembly will always make more power given all other factors are the same. Plus they are stronger so if you get a bad tank of gas or something and your engine does detonate the odds are better that you won't crack a ringland as quickly.

The looser piston to wall clearance that you have to run with forged pistons may not be that good for longevity (100k+ miles) but it will make more power.

My vote is get some forged pistons and use your FREE set of eagles that you got and enjoy the solid bottom end you will have... who knows you may get bored with the power it makes and it will be able to stand up to a 75shot better than stock pistons would.

Rico

edit* coating the pistons will help things last longer and make slightly more power.