Hey hows it going fellow HT'ers i have a problem with a few Accords at my shop and just wanted to see if any of you might have seen and repaired these problems or have some insight on things that I should take a look at. I have done a search and havent really come up with anything conclusive so I thought that I might just make another thread and maybe someone else on here might have the answer. The cars that are having these problems seems to be only the ones with the 2.3L in it so basically the newer versions of the accords from 98 on.
The problem I'm having is basically finding oil mixing with the coolant, normally its the other way around so that has kinda got me stumped. The consensus has seemed to be the head gasket but I had the gasket replaced, along with sending the head out to the machine shop to check for warpage, cracks etc and the head checked out to be fine. I also used all OEM parts so quality shouldnt be an issue. I simply repalced the head gasket which is a straight forward job and now I'm still finding oil inside the coolant. The oil is definately seeping back into the coolant and its not residual because I have changed the radiator along with flushing the system but yet there is still coolant getting into the expansion tank. I havent really figured out why something like this is happening but since I have a few cars here with the same exact symptoms so I am thinking that maybe someone else out there might have already encountered this and know whats wrong or maybe have some ideas as what I should look at next.
Any ideas or help would be appreciated but I guess sending the block out to the machine shop seems like the only alternative.

 

I've lurked these threads myself for quite some time, and I too haven't seen this complaint either; and a quick query to my local independent Honda guru came back with him seeing this condition in Saturns, he's never experienced it in Honda's.
Harking back to when I wore a Service Managers hat at a local Chevy dealer I remember a rather distasteful episode where I layed off a tech as an example because the dumb a.., dispite prior warnings, insisted on using the same drain pan whenever he drained either oil or antifreeze. Need it be said he'd reuse the contaminated coolant (if it was a warranty repair) and caused all manner of problems.
It's tough to eradicate since the hoses absorb a good bit of the oil (and start swelling soon after), and it puddles in pockets of the cooling system.
We finally had to flush with a detergent and change out the hoses to get it all out.

P

 

There is a problem with some of the early production F23 motors 98 and 1st half of 99 where the block cracks internally, somwhere between the water jacket and the pressurized portion of the oiling system. It's more common than you'd think, although there was never a recall or a TSB out on it. I had one of these blocks. I put 2 HG on the car and swapped a cyl head before I replaced the motor. Never once did I find coolant in the oil. I have seen 2 other people on this board with the same problem, and I have had a honda technician tell me he had seen "several"

cut your losses right now. you can buy a low mileage F23 for about $350 or less

I've heard that you can check the block by pressurizing it at the oil filter and checking for leakdown, although I'm not sure if thats true or not.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by P_Adams &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I've lurked these threads myself for quite some time, and I too haven't seen this complaint either; and a quick query to my local independent Honda guru came back with him seeing this condition in Saturns, he's never experienced it in Honda's.
Harking back to when I wore a Service Managers hat at a local Chevy dealer I remember a rather distasteful episode where I layed off a tech as an example because the dumb a.., dispite prior warnings, insisted on using the same drain pan whenever he drained either oil or antifreeze. Need it be said he'd reuse the contaminated coolant (if it was a warranty repair) and caused all manner of problems.
It's tough to eradicate since the hoses absorb a good bit of the oil (and start swelling soon after), and it puddles in pockets of the cooling system.
We finally had to flush with a detergent and change out the hoses to get it all out.

P</TD></TR></TABLE>

yeah its kinda hard with problems like these because they dont really make any logical sense as to how its happening, with the differences in pressure it should only seem that water mixes with the oil and not the other way around. I double and triple checked it before I decided to tear apart the motor again. We used new coolants everytime and also changed most of the major hoses in the motor, the customer has driven about 4000 miles on it already and we have seen less oil in the expansion tank compared to the first time but the oil is still mixing with the coolant.

And to jweller, thanks for the info, i thought it might be a problem in the block somewhere since we just sent the head out and assumed that the block was good because we didnt see any other symptoms such as a misfire or a low compression on it, but since now I know other people have experianced this I would be more comfortable tearing apart the motor again. I'll have to get a few of these motors in and send the blocks out to be pressure tested to see exactly where this problem lies and maybe next time figure out a simpler fix.

o yeah btw i was just wondering if you knew how to pressurize it from the oil filter, i mean i dont think they really make fittings for it but maybe theres some trick that im missing?

BTW to be more specific on these motors in case next time somebody needs to know , one motor is out of a 98 Accord with a f23A1 and another is from a 00 Accord with a f23A4 both have 130,000 + miles on it.

Thanks for the help everyone...



Modified by BluLude at 10:23 PM 7/19/2005

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by BluLude &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
o yeah btw i was just wondering if you knew how to pressurize it from the oil filter, i mean i dont think they really make fittings for it but maybe theres some trick that im missing?

Modified by BluLude at 10:23 PM 7/19/2005</TD></TR></TABLE>

you know I had heard about it and was thinking abut how you would go about doing it and I'm not certain. it would make more sense in my mind to pressureize it at the oil pressure sensor on the back of the block. something you would have to rig up at anyrate. Can't figure out how you would keep it from just leaking out the valve cover anyway.

probably just one of those internet rumors

 

just as an update if anyone was wondering what was going on with the motors, i removed one of the motors today from the car and started tearing it down when i noticed one of the head bolts came out coated with the oil/water mixture on the threads. I took the other ones out and they all seem clean so i drained the oil/water out and pressurized that one bolt hole that had the mixture on the threads and saw the pressure coming out into the water jacket so basically the block is cracked.

I was also just wondering if anyone knew where to get these motors for cheap, if anyone knows please let me know.

thanks
Ray

 

http://www.car-part.com

 

try these guys JAPAN ENGINE 866-532-7878.