most of, no about 99% of all my past exp has been with ported boxes. i have an amp that is 800rms @ 2ohm. im going fo SQ and im not sure if i should go with a 10 of a 12. the speaker im looking at is a type R because i know its a decent driver and it handle 500rms rather then most of the other ones in its class that are only 350. as far as output goes the sensitivity is 2db higher on the 12.

the other speakers are 6 1/2 all the way around so if i have a 12 in a sealed box with i still get the full sound spectrum or will i have a hole? better to go with the 10 or 12?

 

if you choose a 6.5" speaker with a low enough resonant frequency (fs) you should be able to highpass them pretty low.

since you had ported boxes in the past, i'd say go with a 12" because of increased displacement/output over the 10". the 10" being in theory being a lighter cone which would be more "dynamic" and subjectively hit "tighter" isn't going to be very "sq" sounding if it's bottoming out or distorting.

 

i'd go for a 12’ in a sealed box. TypeR is a sealed enclosure sub ONLY. Or you can try building a box like this: Vol: 2.075 cu.ft., port: Dv=5in, Lv= 37.25in That will be a heck of a pipe
Even though I have to admit that besides of a group delay of 25ms at 20Hz ( ) the output curve looks quite tempting.
In general 10 and 12 inch TypeR's look very similar, but when it comes to subs, the general rule is: the more area each individual speaker has- the better (within the same class, of course). For instance a couple of 15s will always sound better than 3 10s.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Olegus &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> For instance a couple of 15s will always sound better than 3 10s.
</TD></TR></TABLE> I don't think so 94

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by fcm &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> I don't think so 94</TD></TR></TABLE>

agreed on the 15's, if it's sound quality he's looking for, sealed would be my best suggestion. Three 10's COULD sound incredible in the car...on the other hand so could ONE 10", if he had the capability for a little tuning...it all depends on what your idea of what "sound quality" is. If you want to LISTEN, then a single sub with good power SHOULD be sufficient. If you want the capability to still pound a little, I might consider have two 10" subs sealed...the extra cone area will help with that kick that you want, and the system can still sound clean without much effort...at least in my opinion .

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by dc24me &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">if you choose a 6.5" speaker with a low enough resonant frequency (fs) you should be able to highpass them pretty low.

since you had ported boxes in the past, i'd say go with a 12" because of increased displacement/output over the 10". the 10" being in theory being a lighter cone which would be more "dynamic" and subjectively hit "tighter" isn't going to be very "sq" sounding if it's bottoming out or distorting.</TD></TR></TABLE>

baby jesus wants to cry


for some clarifications:

The resonant freq has almost no influence on how low the driver is able to play. There are four things that "playing low" is dependent on:

1. Environment
2. Mmd (mass of the diagphram) of the driver
3. BL (motor force) of the driver
4. Enclosure

Some drivers that comes to mind are the Stereo Integrity Magnum. The FS may be higher (at 32hz), but put that baby in a sealed box and watch that thing drop low before a steep roll-off.


If using the same motor, the inductance of both 12" and 10" should be the same. There should be no reason why one would be "quicker" than the other. The dynamics of the subwoofers are hidden behind frequency response and the quality of the driver itself.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Olegus &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i'd go for a 12’ in a sealed box. TypeR is a sealed enclosure sub ONLY.
</TD></TR></TABLE>


errr.. people are able to get the Type Rs in ported enclosure no problems. In fact, many are saying there is no reason not to get the type Rs in a ported enclosure unless you're limited on space.

 

this is off the12volt.com:

Fs Driver free air resonance, in Hz. This is the point at which driver impedance is maximum. "This parameter is the free-air resonant frequency of a speaker. Simply stated, it is the point at which the weight of the moving parts of the speaker becomes balanced with the force of the speaker suspension when in motion. If you've ever seen a piece of string start humming uncontrollably in the wind, you have seen the effect of reaching a resonant frequency. It is important to know this information so that you can prevent your enclosure from 'ringing'. With a loudspeaker, the mass of the moving parts, and the stiffness of the suspension (surround and spider) are the key elements that affect the resonant frequency. As a general rule of thumb, a lower Fs indicates a woofer that would be better for low-frequency reproduction than a woofer with a higher Fs. This is not always the case though, because other parameters affect the ultimate performance as well."

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by GSteg &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
The resonant freq has almost no influence on how low the driver is able to play. There are four things that "playing low" is dependent on:

1. Environment
2. Mmd (mass of the diagphram) of the driver
3. BL (motor force) of the driver
4. Enclosure
</TD></TR></TABLE>

i never did say or imply the Fs is the only factor to look out for. but aren't most car speakers designed for infinite baffle? is the car an anechoic chamber? isn't it a lousy environment to reproduce music? what about cabin gain? Is the speaker making noise? yes, it is acuurate? no? does it give the perception of low bass? yes? just like noise from your tires or your exhaust. it's a car not an anehoic chamber!!! hell, remember those aura bass shakers?

"....there is no one single parameter that will characterize how a speaker will perform. An ideal speaker for infinite baffle confiqurations generally needs to have a high. qts and low resonant frequecy to efficently..." sp14 from Alpine CAIT- encyclopedia of car audio 1987.

playing low? we're talking about infinite baffle buddy. most people don't care about those esoteric drivers you are talking about. you mention nothing about power, nothing about xo slope and TUNING and numberous other factors aside from your mentioned "four". from what i read from the original poster he just wants to make sure his 6.5"speakers can play low enough without bottoming out and have it sound good.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by GSteg &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
If using the same motor, the inductance of both 12" and 10" should be the same. There should be no reason why one would be "quicker" than the other. The dynamics of the subwoofers are hidden behind frequency response and the quality of the driver itself.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

intertia?

everything is car audio is general, nothing is absolute as there is a multitude of variables. accept it.

 

One of the reason why the Fs is lower is because the increase in Mmd. You increase Mmd, the Fs decreases. Likewise, there are A LOT of speakers out there that has low resonant freq yet have very low output. There are just as many speakers built for sealed/vented as there are for IB. Power, Xover slope, etc will not affect how absolutely low the driver will play. the power will only increase the magnitude of the response, but the roll off is there still. The xover will only be suitable to attenuate freq. above the rolloff. there is no point to cross lower than the natural roll off. But of course if he just wants midbass output to blend in the sub, most mids today will handle down to 75hz.

inertia does not have much to do with transient response as you think it does. If the guys at Adire audio are able to increase the mass of the cone heavily while maintaining the same transient response, then mass must not be a variable in transient response.