Since the Spoon N1's don't come with bumpstops, it seems the stock bumpstops should be used. Did you guys cut the bumpstops at all, or just put them in as is? If you cut them, how much did you cut off? Also, can the stock dustboots be used with the N1's at all? I'm, guessing if they do fit that they may have to be shortened. If they don't work, is there anything that will work? OK, once those questions have been answered all i'll have to figure out is whether to go with 14k/12k springs or switch them and go with 12k/14k.
Thanks in advance.

I posted the same thread in the suspension forum as well, but since it's itr related....

 

According to Ichishima.....these dampers didn't come with bumpstops cuz you'd be hard pressed to bottom them out.

When we last spoke, he was under the impression some pretty stiff *** spring rates would be used.....

If you want that little extra margin of security...juss cut and chop the stock bumpstops.....

 

i'm always confused on what the heck is this bumpstop everyones talkn about..any pics of this part?

 

i was just talking with an owner of spoon n1 suspension for his ek hatch. he said it was terribly stiff even for the softest setting (there are 5) and he had to use spoon's softest straight spring.

i have the spoon n1 fix types, but they sit in my room

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by carbing’ed &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i have the spoon n1 fix types, but they sit in my room </TD></TR></TABLE>

The fix type dampers are not "N1" dampers.

They are a mild street upgrade.

 

i stand corrected

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by RagingAngel &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">According to Ichishima.....these dampers didn't come with bumpstops cuz you'd be hard pressed to bottom them out.

When we last spoke, he was under the impression some pretty stiff *** spring rates would be used.....

If you want that little extra margin of security...juss cut and chop the stock bumpstops..... </TD></TR></TABLE>

Do you really think i need to though? Or am i just worrying about nothing? I figured that these would be extremely hard to bottom out but didn't want to find out that i was after they were already installed. I'm sure i told you what spring rates i was going to be using. After all, you recommended them for me, pretty much. I measured my ride height with the Type Flex before i took them off and was pleased to see that the ride height was right in between the ride heights that A&J had for street and Circuit settings for the Spoon's. At least i know i won't have to worry too much about scraping curbs or ***** on the street.

 

14k fron and 12k rear, the other way arounds rotates too much, i like the honda understeer feel because you can control understeer with left foot braking, ebrake or throttle and steering, but when it oversteers by it self and not being a rwd, its harder to control and thus spin out occurs more easily

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Transport &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">14k fron and 12k rear, the other way arounds rotates too much, i like the honda understeer feel because you can control understeer with left foot braking, ebrake or throttle and steering, but when it oversteers by it self and not being a rwd, its harder to control and thus spin out occurs more easily</TD></TR></TABLE>

Reading pwn3d me.....

CanadianR: I don't think you need to worry about putting those bumpstops in place. You can try what I did before which is tie a zip tie right at the top of the damper and after a run at AutoX, jack it up slightly and check how much the damper travelled. I recall it being within a very safe margin


Modified by RagingAngel at 8:10 PM 3/29/2005

 

ppl talked about the 1st part of the question im giving him some opinions about his 2nd part...please learn to read

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by RagingAngel &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

CanadianR: I don't think you need to worry about putting those bumpstops in place. You can try what I did before which is tie a zip tie right at the top of the damper and after a run at AutoX, jack it up slightly and check how much the damper travelled. I recall it being within a very safe margin </TD></TR></TABLE>

Yes, i thought of trying that. I think it's a good idea. Now that i think about it, i'm pretty sure i never hit the bumpstops on the Flex's at about the same ride height as i will be on the Spoons, and the Flex springs were alot softer. What the hell, if i leave out the bumpstops, i don't have to take apart the OEM dampers

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Transport &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">ppl talked about the 1st part of the question im giving him some opinions about his 2nd part...please learn to read</TD></TR></TABLE>

touche..... learning to read a bit more everyday....I stand corrected.... cheers

Good luck CanadianR

 

Thanks, i may need it the first time i hit Race City's road course with 12k/14k rates

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Transport &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">14k fron and 12k rear, the other way arounds rotates too much, i like the honda understeer feel because you can control understeer with left foot braking, ebrake or throttle and steering, but when it oversteers by it self and not being a rwd, its harder to control and thus spin out occurs more easily</TD></TR></TABLE>


I drove my Type R (14K front/ 16K rear with 26 mm rear bar and nearly slick RA1s) in the pouring rain yesterday at the track.

Rotation was just fine and nothing to be afraid of. You control it with the gas pedal.

Cars that push are SLOOOOOOOW

 

i've got the swift springs on there 10kf n 8kr luvin it.. not hitting a lot of bumps...the rear tire rubs a bit but it is set to the highest height possible.. i knew you were askn fer pics of it on the car...here's the link https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=1193735&page=1

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Transport &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">14k fron and 12k rear, the other way arounds rotates too much, i like the honda understeer feel because you can control understeer with left foot braking, ebrake or throttle and steering, but when it oversteers by it self and not being a rwd, its harder to control and thus spin out occurs more easily</TD></TR></TABLE>

You clearly have no idea what you're talking about.

Please don't bother to share your suspension tuning wisdom next time.

 

I'd stay away from doing that.

We put the stock bump stops/dust boots to my N1s, and while the fronts seem to be doing OK, the rear of the car went nuts. Way too bouncy. We took the bump stops out, but kept the dust boots, still bouncy.

Hopefully, the dampers aren't damaged, and taking the dust boots out should fix the problem.

If the Spoons didn't come with them, there must be a reason. I agree with Raging Angel.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by fso_BamBam &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I'd stay away from doing that.

We put the stock bump stops/dust boots to my N1s, and while the fronts seem to be doing OK, the rear of the car went nuts. Way too bouncy. We took the bump stops out, but kept the dust boots, still bouncy.

Hopefully, the dampers aren't damaged, and taking the dust boots out should fix the problem.

If the Spoons didn't come with them, there must be a reason. I agree with Raging Angel.</TD></TR></TABLE> i'd hate to take mine out again n redo it.. ergh...

 

I have 14kg front and 12kg rear on my spoon N1s but my car is street driven and i find this set up ideal. I cant imagine having a harder spring in the rear as i have it set on the softest setting at the moment (#1) and #2 in the front and if i go any higher in the rear it tends to skip on bends slightly. On a track it may handle like crap but for a street driven car i thing softer springs in the rear is ideal, after all the stock springs are softer in the rear than in the front.

I had the front two shocks out a few months back and there are no bump stops (the N1s were on my car when i got it from japan)

 

hmm.... some good info since my last reply. I was thinking of starting one last thread to ask for opinions on whether to go with 14k/12k or 12k/14k. Since some of the people that responded to this thread are some of the guys i hoped to get opinions from, maybe i'll give a little more info about my situation and ask for some more feedback from you guys. I'm going to be doing alot of autocross with these, and i think i'd love the 12k/14k for that. But i'm a little worried about running these rates on the local road course, as i've only done one event there previously, a HPDS. I'm a little worried that maybe i'm not experienced enough to run the higher rear-bias on a road course; i guess i worry about a few areas on the course ie) high speed sweeper coming into chicane where i've had the rear end start to feel light and start to swing out when braking with too much steering input. Is this setup (12k/14k) something you guys would recommend for an intermediate driver? I know Raging Angel tried it and said he personally felt it was too twitchy for him, but did say that Big Phat R loves it. Maybe BPR, Reid, Bambam, or anyone else running rear-bias on the N1's could give me some more insight. Damn long post, i know, sorry.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by CanadianR &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">hmm.... some good info since my last reply. I was thinking of starting one last thread to ask for opinions on whether to go with 14k/12k or 12k/14k. Since some of the people that responded to this thread are some of the guys i hoped to get opinions from, maybe i'll give a little more info about my situation and ask for some more feedback from you guys. I'm going to be doing alot of autocross with these, and i think i'd love the 12k/14k for that. But i'm a little worried about running these rates on the local road course, as i've only done one event there previously, a HPDS. I'm a little worried that maybe i'm not experienced enough to run the higher rear-bias on a road course; i guess i worry about a few areas on the course ie) high speed sweeper coming into chicane where i've had the rear end start to feel light and start to swing out when braking with too much steering input. Is this setup (12k/14k) something you guys would recommend for an intermediate driver? I know Raging Angel tried it and said he personally felt it was too twitchy for him, but did say that Big Phat R loves it. Maybe BPR, Reid, Bambam, or anyone else running rear-bias on the N1's could give me some more insight. Damn long post, i know, sorry.</TD></TR></TABLE>

I'm running the same setting (16k/14k) as BPR, but I have yet to track the car. If I find it too twitchy for my liking, I may swap the springs. I'll be sure to post my impressions once I hit the track. I think for autox use, your settingss are good to go.

Since everyone has a different driving style, it's really hard to say whether my setup would work for you, or vice-versa. I think that's the one thing you should experiment with, and see what fits your style.

 

It's not a big deal to switch the springs around.

I would go with the JDM setup first and if you feel that you want more oversteer tendency - go with the rear stiff setup.

"twitchiness" I think is more related to tire compound and alignment.

There's a zillion factors involved in car setup. Spring rates and damping are two variables that you can play around with.

I wouldn't go with high spring rates unless you are going to stiffen the chassis (i.e. roll bar) as well. Otherwise the chassis flex will be another variable that you have to deal with - and your dampers won't work as effectively.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Big Phat R &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Cars that push are SLOOOOOOOW</TD></TR></TABLE>

Funny... was reading an interview with the Renault F1 engineers and how they set up the cars for slight understeer on corner exit.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Chris N &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Funny... was reading an interview with the Renault F1 engineers and how they set up the cars for slight understeer on corner exit.

</TD></TR></TABLE>

Okay - I stand corrected

1500 lb cars with 800 hp that understeer are not slow

 

OK, OK some more good advice. Well, i've already got the springs here so i'll be going with 12k/14k, if i really hate it i'll order some 10k springs and go from there. I think i'm gonna try 12k front and 14k rear, since i'll be doing at least 5 or more autocrosses before i get to a road course. I'll see how i like it, and if i feel i'm over my head or really don't like the feel i'll just switch them around. For now there will be no roll bar, but since i want to do Solo I next year, or the year after at most, depending on money situation, then a bar of some kind will go in. I definately will be doing alot of experimenting to get the right setup for me, (i can see an adjustable rear sway in my future) and that's alot of the fun, i think. Actually, a big reason why i got these dampers is because i want to try to get the car setup for what i'm wanting to do with it, and the old setup i had just wasn't going to get the job done. I figured you gotta start with springs/dampers first and make the smaller changes after that. Trying to fine tune the car with the Flexes i had was going to become pointless, as anything i bought was likely to not work the same with a new spring/damper as it did with the Flexes and i just couldn't run the kind of spring rates i felt i would need with them. Thanks for the advice guys i'll let everyone know how i like it all once they're in and played with a bit. The next thing i'm going to have to get an idea for is alignment settings. Unfortunately, i didn't get any of the sttings from my last alignment, so i have only an inkling of what i want. I'll be using RA-1's for autocross and if i feel confident after a session on the road course with my Azenis, i may use the RA-1's there as well. I know i need at least -2.5 deg. of camber to use the RA-1's optimally. If anyone has some ballpark advice in this area and wants to give it, feel free. Otherwise i'll do some more research and figure out what settings i want to start off with. Thanks guys