Stringing a car for toe adjustments
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Stringing a car for toe adjustments
How reliable/accurate is stringing a car to adjust the toe? I mean, wouldn't bumpers that didnt fit properly or maybe stick out a little from the fender throw off the accuracy of the string/measurements? Also, would you have to check the string, jack up the front/rear, adjust toe, put car on ground, roll back and forth, and check the string or is there an easier way to do it with the car on the ground? Another point, in the link, it seems easy cause they use monster tires that stick out pretty far due to the width and offset, but what about with normal rim and tires. They dont stick out like that. More than likely, they wouldnt even stick out past the body lines of the car. So, what a way of measuring with the string then?
heres a link as a reference --> http://www.c-speedracing.com/h...t.php
heres a link as a reference --> http://www.c-speedracing.com/h...t.php
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From: SR115
Re: Stringing a car for toe adjustments (deviant1)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by deviant1 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">How reliable/accurate is stringing a car to adjust the toe?</TD></TR></TABLE>
Fairly. (Meet your friend "~".)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by deviant1 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">wouldn't bumpers that didnt fit properly or maybe stick out a little from the fender throw off the accuracy of the string/measurements? </TD></TR></TABLE>
Yeah.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by deviant1 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> Also, would you have to check the string, jack up the front/rear, adjust toe, put car on ground, roll back and forth, and check the string or is there an easier way to do it with the car on the ground?
</TD></TR></TABLE>
As far as I know, you have to do it the tedious way. However, if you're repeatedly switching back and forth between two settings, it gets semi-repeatable with minimal bs.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by deviant1 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Another point, in the link, it seems easy cause they use monster tires that stick out pretty far due to the width and offset, but what about with normal rim and tires. They dont stick out like that. More than likely, they wouldnt even stick out past the body lines of the car. So, what a way of measuring with the string then?
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Use a ruler to measure distance between wheel and string.
Fairly. (Meet your friend "~".)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by deviant1 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">wouldn't bumpers that didnt fit properly or maybe stick out a little from the fender throw off the accuracy of the string/measurements? </TD></TR></TABLE>
Yeah.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by deviant1 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> Also, would you have to check the string, jack up the front/rear, adjust toe, put car on ground, roll back and forth, and check the string or is there an easier way to do it with the car on the ground?
</TD></TR></TABLE>
As far as I know, you have to do it the tedious way. However, if you're repeatedly switching back and forth between two settings, it gets semi-repeatable with minimal bs.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by deviant1 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Another point, in the link, it seems easy cause they use monster tires that stick out pretty far due to the width and offset, but what about with normal rim and tires. They dont stick out like that. More than likely, they wouldnt even stick out past the body lines of the car. So, what a way of measuring with the string then?
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Use a ruler to measure distance between wheel and string.
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From: Pacific Northwest, USA
Re: Stringing a car for toe adjustments (deviant1)
Hey, Crescent is famous. 
Yes, it's reliable, and yes it works. It doesn't matter what the bumper is doing because as long as the string is in the same place every time, it's fine.
There's lots of different methods of measuring toe, some more accurate than others, but I use something similar to what Crescent does at the track all the time (I use jackstands & string).
Yes, you're constantly lifting, lowering, rolling and measuring. That's how it works unless you have a rack.
Yes, it's reliable, and yes it works. It doesn't matter what the bumper is doing because as long as the string is in the same place every time, it's fine.
There's lots of different methods of measuring toe, some more accurate than others, but I use something similar to what Crescent does at the track all the time (I use jackstands & string).
Yes, you're constantly lifting, lowering, rolling and measuring. That's how it works unless you have a rack.
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Re: Stringing a car for toe adjustments (johng)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by johng »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Hey, Crescent is famous.
Yes, it's reliable, and yes it works. It doesn't matter what the bumper is doing because as long as the string is in the same place every time, it's fine.
There's lots of different methods of measuring toe, some more accurate than others, but I use something similar to what Crescent does at the track all the time (I use jackstands & string).
Yes, you're constantly lifting, lowering, rolling and measuring. That's how it works unless you have a rack.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
say the front bumper is tweaked and it sticks out a little more than the fender. This wouldn't create a very slight angle to the string? It surely wouldnt be parallel with the side of the car. i only ask, cause when you look at my front bumper from the front of the car, you can tell the pass side is warped or something. You can see a whole lot more tire tread than the driver side tire (if that makes sense). In this case, the string would rest on the front of the tire anyway all the time on the warped side.
Yes, it's reliable, and yes it works. It doesn't matter what the bumper is doing because as long as the string is in the same place every time, it's fine.
There's lots of different methods of measuring toe, some more accurate than others, but I use something similar to what Crescent does at the track all the time (I use jackstands & string).
Yes, you're constantly lifting, lowering, rolling and measuring. That's how it works unless you have a rack.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
say the front bumper is tweaked and it sticks out a little more than the fender. This wouldn't create a very slight angle to the string? It surely wouldnt be parallel with the side of the car. i only ask, cause when you look at my front bumper from the front of the car, you can tell the pass side is warped or something. You can see a whole lot more tire tread than the driver side tire (if that makes sense). In this case, the string would rest on the front of the tire anyway all the time on the warped side.
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From: Midlothian, VA
i had some concerns about it too, but i figured i'd do it and just keep an eye on uneven wear and it seems to have worked so far. i've worn an even amount 2mm across the fronts. the rear may be out of alignment some, it looks like the rear's have a difference of like .5 mm, but i dont know if thats just the way im measuring or what. it could be going into the rubber more on one side than the other.
i also used the fact that it tracked straight to act as a guide. when i first started it pulled god knows what direction, as i did it a couple times itleveled off and i goes relatively straight now. sometimes it pulls in a direction a little bit, but its not constantly in one side, it changes between them.
although if you're talking about a racecar you might not have the luxury of being able to check tire wear as you go. gotta hope its right from the beginning so i dont know...but from my limited experience, it works
i also used the fact that it tracked straight to act as a guide. when i first started it pulled god knows what direction, as i did it a couple times itleveled off and i goes relatively straight now. sometimes it pulls in a direction a little bit, but its not constantly in one side, it changes between them.
although if you're talking about a racecar you might not have the luxury of being able to check tire wear as you go. gotta hope its right from the beginning so i dont know...but from my limited experience, it works
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From: west, mich, usa
Re: Stringing a car for toe adjustments (deviant1)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by deviant1 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
say the front bumper is tweaked and it sticks out a little more than the fender. This wouldn't create a very slight angle to the string? snip.</TD></TR></TABLE>
i thought you set the string at some known distance from a fixed point on the car such as axle nut in front and hub in the rear and adjust the strings to be some set distance all the time. the bumper is just the starting point and place to "hold" the strings.
they don't form the basis for the alignment.
say the front bumper is tweaked and it sticks out a little more than the fender. This wouldn't create a very slight angle to the string? snip.</TD></TR></TABLE>
i thought you set the string at some known distance from a fixed point on the car such as axle nut in front and hub in the rear and adjust the strings to be some set distance all the time. the bumper is just the starting point and place to "hold" the strings.
they don't form the basis for the alignment.
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From: HP, NC, USA
Re: Stringing a car for toe adjustments (tom91ita)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by tom91ita »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
i thought you set the string at some known distance from a fixed point on the car such as axle nut in front and hub in the rear and adjust the strings to be some set distance all the time. the bumper is just the starting point and place to "hold" the strings. They don't form the basis for the alignment.</TD></TR></TABLE>
That's correct.
I use jack stands and my reference points are the axle nuts. I level the car and set camber first. Then roll the car and settle it, set up the string box (yellow fishing line) and check toe. I can adjust toe without moving the car or lifting it.
Takes me about an hour...which is WAY less time that it takes to hook up the trailer, load the car, go to an alignmant shop, unload, wait, reload, go home, & unload again. And it's free! Accuracy is within 1/16th total.
i thought you set the string at some known distance from a fixed point on the car such as axle nut in front and hub in the rear and adjust the strings to be some set distance all the time. the bumper is just the starting point and place to "hold" the strings. They don't form the basis for the alignment.</TD></TR></TABLE>
That's correct.
I use jack stands and my reference points are the axle nuts. I level the car and set camber first. Then roll the car and settle it, set up the string box (yellow fishing line) and check toe. I can adjust toe without moving the car or lifting it.
Takes me about an hour...which is WAY less time that it takes to hook up the trailer, load the car, go to an alignmant shop, unload, wait, reload, go home, & unload again. And it's free! Accuracy is within 1/16th total.
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From: Future Site of the Runoffs, USA
Re: Stringing a car for toe adjustments (Track rat)
why don't you just spend $50 on a set of tow plates and be done with it? saferacer has them on sale right now in fact.
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From: High Point, NC, USA
Re: Stringing a car for toe adjustments (tnord)
The only problem with toe plates is they only show you the relative toe between the two wheels. If one rear wheel is toe out and the other is toe in the toe plates will show zero toe even though the car is crabbing down the road sideways.
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From: The Hudson
Re: Stringing a car for toe adjustments (Track rat)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Track rat »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
I use jack stands and my reference points are the axle nuts. </TD></TR></TABLE>
I do this as well. I have toe plates from Longacre, so I only occasionally string the car to check the thrust angle, and when I do, I only string one side. I get that side set straight, then I use the toe plates to set the other axle parallel.
Most of the suspension changes have such a minor effect on the thrust angle (once the car is set up properly), that I rarely do it though.
I use jack stands and my reference points are the axle nuts. </TD></TR></TABLE>
I do this as well. I have toe plates from Longacre, so I only occasionally string the car to check the thrust angle, and when I do, I only string one side. I get that side set straight, then I use the toe plates to set the other axle parallel.
Most of the suspension changes have such a minor effect on the thrust angle (once the car is set up properly), that I rarely do it though.
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Re: Stringing a car for toe adjustments (Track rat)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Track rat »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
That's correct.
I use jack stands and my reference points are the axle nuts. I level the car and set camber first. Then roll the car and settle it, set up the string box (yellow fishing line) and check toe. I can adjust toe without moving the car or lifting it.
Takes me about an hour...which is WAY less time that it takes to hook up the trailer, load the car, go to an alignmant shop, unload, wait, reload, go home, & unload again. And it's free! Accuracy is within 1/16th total.</TD></TR></TABLE>
are there any DIYs for this box and jackstand meathod on here? and how the heck do you get under the car with it on the ground? in fact, how do you make the adjustments seeing that the wheels are on the ground and wont easily move on the pavement with a simple twist from a wrench on the tie rod.
That's correct.
I use jack stands and my reference points are the axle nuts. I level the car and set camber first. Then roll the car and settle it, set up the string box (yellow fishing line) and check toe. I can adjust toe without moving the car or lifting it.
Takes me about an hour...which is WAY less time that it takes to hook up the trailer, load the car, go to an alignmant shop, unload, wait, reload, go home, & unload again. And it's free! Accuracy is within 1/16th total.</TD></TR></TABLE>
are there any DIYs for this box and jackstand meathod on here? and how the heck do you get under the car with it on the ground? in fact, how do you make the adjustments seeing that the wheels are on the ground and wont easily move on the pavement with a simple twist from a wrench on the tie rod.
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From: Cogito ergo sum, Canada
Re: Stringing a car for toe adjustments (deviant1)
I tried the search function by typing in "DIY alignment" in the Search For box and Archived Content, but did not come up with the following thread I made a while back that might help you out. Someone please fix the search function on this board;-(
Have a look at this:https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=597192
Method works fabulous and is very cheap, precise and repeatable. It can easily be adapted to many cars.
and also this thread that the same search actually found! https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=688287
where I got the idea to buy this after I got tired of just using hand-held scales and tapes:
http://www.mktechnologies.com/
The price on the digital protractor SmartTool has been reduced and you can get it from Amazon for $99 with free shipping:<U>http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0000225AL/qid=1142510811/sr=8-6/ref=pd_bbs_6/103-2362359-9364627?%5Fencoding=UTF8&v=glance&n=228013</U>
Have a look at this:https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=597192
Method works fabulous and is very cheap, precise and repeatable. It can easily be adapted to many cars.
and also this thread that the same search actually found! https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=688287
where I got the idea to buy this after I got tired of just using hand-held scales and tapes:
http://www.mktechnologies.com/
The price on the digital protractor SmartTool has been reduced and you can get it from Amazon for $99 with free shipping:<U>http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0000225AL/qid=1142510811/sr=8-6/ref=pd_bbs_6/103-2362359-9364627?%5Fencoding=UTF8&v=glance&n=228013</U>
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From: HP, NC, USA
Re: Stringing a car for toe adjustments (deviant1)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by deviant1 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
and how the heck do you get under the car with it on the ground? in fact, how do you make the adjustments seeing that the wheels are on the ground and wont easily move on the pavement with a simple twist from a wrench on the tie rod.</TD></TR></TABLE>
My garage floor has a smooth finish and I squirt a little soap/water mixture under the fronts before I start. I cut the wheels hard-over to each side and break the tie rod lockdown bolts loose before I set up the string box. It is pretty easy to reach in from the rear of the tire and turn the tie rods with a 14mm wrench with the wheels straight and the string box in place.
and how the heck do you get under the car with it on the ground? in fact, how do you make the adjustments seeing that the wheels are on the ground and wont easily move on the pavement with a simple twist from a wrench on the tie rod.</TD></TR></TABLE>
My garage floor has a smooth finish and I squirt a little soap/water mixture under the fronts before I start. I cut the wheels hard-over to each side and break the tie rod lockdown bolts loose before I set up the string box. It is pretty easy to reach in from the rear of the tire and turn the tie rods with a 14mm wrench with the wheels straight and the string box in place.
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From: The Hudson
Re: Stringing a car for toe adjustments (deviant1)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by deviant1 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
and how the heck do you get under the car with it on the ground? in fact, how do you make the adjustments seeing that the wheels are on the ground and wont easily move on the pavement with a simple twist from a wrench on the tie rod.</TD></TR></TABLE>
It's actually not to hard to reach the adjustment points while the car is on the ground.
To make the adjustments, I bought some aluminum flashing from home depot, cut two peices and placed them under the tires. Slides very easily, and that way you don't have to keep rolling the car forwards and backwards.
and how the heck do you get under the car with it on the ground? in fact, how do you make the adjustments seeing that the wheels are on the ground and wont easily move on the pavement with a simple twist from a wrench on the tie rod.</TD></TR></TABLE>
It's actually not to hard to reach the adjustment points while the car is on the ground.
To make the adjustments, I bought some aluminum flashing from home depot, cut two peices and placed them under the tires. Slides very easily, and that way you don't have to keep rolling the car forwards and backwards.
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