I'm looking to get a new LSD for my car, car stock is clutch pack LSD. I was told that the Quaife diff is not worth the cost because if one wheel leaves the ground you lose traction. Is this true or is a customizes clutch pack better than a Quaife diff?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by DamWutaDayM3 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I'm looking to get a new LSD for my car, car stock is clutch pack LSD. I was told that the Quaife diff is not worth the cost because if one wheel leaves the ground you lose traction. Is this true or is a customizes clutch pack better than a Quaife diff?</TD></TR></TABLE>

I have not had ones in my hand to inspect but I think that quaife devised a way around little tire-life dillema. I believe their Diff. has a tensioner or something of that nature.

That's about all the info I have. Give quaife a call, see what they say.


Modified by rice_classic at 1:06 AM 8/9/2005

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by DamWutaDayM3 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I'm looking to get a new LSD for my car, car stock is clutch pack LSD. I was told that the Quaife diff is not worth the cost because if one wheel leaves the ground you lose traction. Is this true or is a customizes clutch pack better than a Quaife diff?</TD></TR></TABLE>

You are getting bad advice. Quaife makes a great diff.

 

The advice I got was from a long time track junkie. Is there anymore ppl with 1st hand experience?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by DamWutaDayM3 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">The advice I got was from a long time track junkie. Is there anymore ppl with 1st hand experience?</TD></TR></TABLE>

Yeah, I have plenty of first hand race experience and I'm telling you that the Quaife works very well.

 

Alright thanks I think I'll just go ahead and order the quaife.

 

I have and love a quaife. It is true that if one wheel is in the air, it essentially goes open, since the most it can bias the torque is 4:1 or 6:1 (I don't remember which). The way someone eased my mind on that point was to make the obvious statement that if I have a front wheel in the air, then an open diff is the least of my problems. Kinda put it in perspective.

On a RWD the answer isn't quite as cut-n-dry since you can do the pissing dog routine even under OK conditions, but in a FWD the answer is easy. Get a quaife.

 

A clutchpack will do the same thing. If one wheel is in the air, and you can't put down enough torque to get the diff to lock, you're gonna be left hanging.

For street driving, you can usually just do a clutch drop if you're stuck on a steep entrance ramp (yeah, ask me how I know), but you probably don't wanna do that on track.

 

I broke my Quaife by getting a wheel off the ground with the power on. Power on, drove over an FIA curb, when the wheel came back down it went crunch thats all she wrote. No more Helical LSDs for me. This is just my 1st hand experience so don't get all bent out of shape Johnny Mac

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by nfn15037 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I broke my Quaife</TD></TR></TABLE>

Yeah but, who else offers Limited Lifetime Warranty? So all you have to do is click here ---&gt;&gt; http://www.quaifeamerica.com/d...s.htm

 

So whats the best type of lsd for track use?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by nfn15037 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I broke my Quaife by getting a wheel off the ground with the power on. Power on, drove over an FIA curb </TD></TR></TABLE>

I never broke mine and really like it. I also have used the curbing to no ill effect. It beats dropping you trans when the clutches wear out.

Did Quaife replace it with the lifetime waranty?

 

Yes they did but I still had to drop the gearbox and take the LSD out. Warranty or not it is still a lot of time (time = $) out of my pocket. Maybe it was defective, maybe I'm a hack but whatever the reason it still pisses me off.

 

Is the Quaife diff 1.5 way like the ats one?

 

I've had a Quaife in my 200+ whp Type R for 3 years running.

I beat on the car hard every time I drive at the track

Works great (better than the stock Type R LSD) and no problems + lifetime warranty = can't lose

 

[edit] I stand corrected [/edit]

...but make sure it's from an authorized re-seller/distributor.


Modified by El Pollo Diablo at 8:48 PM 8/9/2005


Modified by El Pollo Diablo at 8:49 PM 8/9/2005

 

Had a quaife in my streetcar for two years + never a problem. Plenty of hard drag racing launches on it and hard sprited driving, not quite like a full out racecar but the diff gets used quite a bit and i havent had a single problem.

 

Been beating up 2 quaifes, one for 4 years, the other for 1. Both get beat the snot out of, and are both still working great.

I thought that the warrenty was even when raced...... might make me think twice about beat the "snot" of it the anymore.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by El Pollo Diablo &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">The lifetime warranty only applies to non-racing use...</TD></TR></TABLE>


From Quaife America:

Quaife ATB Differential Limited Lifetime Warranty
Quaife America Torque Biasing Differential Lifetime Warranty: Quaife America warrants each new Quaife ATB Differential against defects in manufacture, material, workmanship, and wear-out when used in the vehicle application for which it was originally designed, on any motor vehicle, <U>under any and all operating conditions, including racing</U>, for as long as the original purchaser, or any subsequent purchaser owns the differential. The original purchaser must complete and mail in the accompanying warranty registration form within 30 days of the purchase date to qualify for this warranty. The registrant must present a copy of this warranty together with a copy of the original receipt to the service outlet or parts store from whom the differential was originally purchased when making a claim for replacement or repair. All warranty claims submitted must include proof of purchase. Failure to provide proper documentation renders warranty null and void.

Exclusion from Warranty Coverage: The warranty does not apply outside of North America or to any Quaife ATB Differential which (a) has been improperly installed, installed in vehicles for which it was not designated, (b) has been modified or altered by the actual user or dealer or distributor, (c) was not imported or sold by Quaife America or through an authorized Quaife America dealer or distributor, or (d) was disassembled for any reason by the purchaser or his agent.

Quaife America's Obligation: Quaife America's obligation under this warranty is limited to replacement or repair of the defective or worn-out differential at its sole discretion. Quaife America has no obligation to bear any labor or other costs of return, removal and/or installation and will not be liable for any special, incidental, or consequential damages, including loss of use of the vehicle. Some states do not allow the exclusion of limited or incidental or consequential damages, so the above limitation may not apply to you.

Warranty Claim Procedures: Contact Quaife America at 32240-E Paseo Adelanto, San Juan Capistrano, CA 92675 tel (949) 240-4000 for specific instructions.

Rights of Purchaser: This warranty gives you specific legal rights, and you may also have other rights, which vary from state to state.

 

The diff is for a 02 BMW M3. It is my street car for now and is being tranform into a full track car. I know Quaife had been around Honda for a long time So I would like to get more knowledge form you guys. And up to now all you guys are of great help thanks again. Gotta love Hoda-tech.

This is quoted from my track junkie friend:
"I had a Quaife in my E30 M3, thought it was the cats azz until I had a wheel off and went into a wall. I can't say for sure if it was the Quaife but in my further research I found that if a tire lifts with the Quaife, the other loses traction. Both tires must be on the ground for traction. Oh well.

The Evosport diff is just plain sick for track work. It is expensive at 3500 for the 4 clutch static lock but that includes everything including the core. Besides that it does not lose traction if a tire lifts and it is absolutely bulletproof and comes with a 3 year warranty. If you want to go that way, call Brad at 888-520-9971 extension 15. He'll set you straight."

So has anyone every experience what he's talking about? When one wheel lifts off the ground you lose traction on the other wheel too.

 

Just a strange observation if you don't mind.

I think you'd be better off asking a BMW specific forum instead of Honda-tech.

I have a Quaife and love it. I replaced my clutch pack KAAZ 1.5 way with it because I was looking for something long term that wouldn't have to be rebuilt somewhere down the road. The plus was I no longer needed to use expensive fluids (every engine oil change) to keep the KAAZ silent or working smoothly.

I also didn't like the way the KAAZ responded in the wet....but that may be been due to my lack of experience and slightly worn street tires.... I felt the Quaife was easier to handle IMO....

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by DamWutaDayM3 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">The diff is for a 02 BMW M3. It is my street car for now and is being tranform into a full track car. I know Quaife had been around Honda for a long time So I would like to get more knowledge form you guys. And up to now all you guys are of great help thanks again. Gotta love Hoda-tech.

This is quoted from my track junkie friend:
"I had a Quaife in my E30 M3, thought it was the cats azz until I had a wheel off and went into a wall. I can't say for sure if it was the Quaife but in my further research I found that if a tire lifts with the Quaife, the other loses traction. Both tires must be on the ground for traction. Oh well.

The Evosport diff is just plain sick for track work. It is expensive at 3500 for the 4 clutch static lock but that includes everything including the core. Besides that it does not lose traction if a tire lifts and it is absolutely bulletproof and comes with a 3 year warranty. If you want to go that way, call Brad at 888-520-9971 extension 15. He'll set you straight."

So has anyone every experience what he's talking about? When one wheel lifts off the ground you lose traction on the other wheel too. </TD></TR></TABLE>

if you're gonna grip.. go with a Torsen type diff (ex. Quaife)
if yer gonna Drift.. go with a Clutch type LSD (ex. Kaaz)
both have favorable points and both have characteristics which the driver must understand before trying to push the car...

i have a Kaaz LSD in my Honda (EK9 w/usdm ITR)
and i have a Quaife w/3.73 gears in my E36 M3

a LSD is like a stooooopid open diff and will first transfer power to whichever side has the least traction.. break it loose.. then as a result the LSD will lock the other side together. (sounds like a reaction game yeah? )
a clutch type LSD should Lock ANYTIME a difference in rotation between drivetrain axles is present.. (1 way LSD's only lock on acceleration tho)
a LSD has a fairly low moment of drivetrain inertia (revs up quickly)
a Clutch Type LSD WILL need constant servicing and maintenence to be kept in consistent shape

a Torsen is like a smart diff with restrictions.. the power is delivered to the side with the most traction and will bias the power between sides up to 4:1 ?? (i forget the exact ratio)
restriction #1 do not unload a drivetrain wheel otherwise all the power will go to that unloaded wheel and the other side will recieve no power. (a tire doesn't automatically lose "traction" just cause no power is delivered to it)
a Torsen does not quite fully lock under power
a Torsen is basically an open diff when power is not being transfered from the motor through the drivetrain (decel)
a Torsen adds drivetrain inertia(motor will rev up a bit slower)
a Torsen needs little service & maintenence due to its design.. and should work as well the day you put it in as the day you take it out. (unfortunately MOST other things in the car do not work nearly as well)


as for the Quaife tire lifting issue..
in a FWD yes lifting a tire and holding the throttle can lead to a grenade blowing up when the tire lands & shockloads the diff and fragile(small) worm gears inside..
in a RWD(especially an M3) don't worry.. you got other problems if yer lifting the rear tires!! if anything the M3 would probably throttle-on understeer.. and if you push hard it might lift a FRONT tire..

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by DamWutaDayM3 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">This is quoted from my track junkie friend:
"I had a Quaife in my E30 M3, thought it was the cats azz until I had a wheel off and went into a wall. I can't say for sure if it was the Quaife but in my further research I found that if a tire lifts with the Quaife, the other loses traction. Both tires must be on the ground for traction. Oh well.</TD></TR></TABLE>

your friend doesn't know what he's talking about. if you lift a wheel with a quaife it can no longer bias torque and behaves like an open diff. this means wheelspin and no more forward drive, not loss of grip from the tire that is still on the ground causing a spin into the wall. tell your friend to stop blaming the equipment.

i've driven both a quaife and a clutch style diff. i like the quaife. both are quick, i just liked the seemlessness of the quaife over the abrupt lockup of the clutch type. i don't think you need to worry about rear wheel lift in a bmw. all the properly setup ones i've seen like to lift the inside front.

nate

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by solo-x &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">your friend doesn't know what he's talking about. </TD></TR></TABLE>

I would ***-u-me he's also got a big *** rear sway bar with that diff....