mist sITR

st cloud minnesota open track day aarrf
i'm in the red civic what the cf hood.....

this RX7 is run by Domieon ?spell? nicest guy u'll ever meet with one of the nicest cars

me

"D"

grouping

me




some drifting










flipped his V6 accord

sackdz

The one that rolled, is that a civic too?

mist sITR

nope an accord V6
he flipped it about a half hour into the day
i dont really think he should have had that car out there (really heavy and he drove it like it was a civic) he lost it around the turn and tried to save it instead of turning into the ditch.
it's a shame. the kind of thing u wouldn't wish on anyone

89civicdx

your civic and his accord look the same...kinda...from the pics

thats like 2 girls showing up at a party wearing the same dress

CRX Lee

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I thought so too, I thought this post had a sad ending

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thats like 2 girls showing up at a party wearing the same dress</TD></TR></TABLE>

Oh my gawd...I hate it when that happens!

What kind of facility was that? I didn't see any runoff room, tirewalls, guard rails, etc. in the name of safety to keep you out of the shrubs or off your lid.

tnord

they HAVE GOT TO change the runoff at that place. that's like the 10th rollover there this year. there's not going to be anybody left to compete in a couple years cause everybody busted up their car.

do they still have that stupid cone death chicane towards the end of the straight?

Greyout

I can't tell if this is on the track, or while driving to the track...

Threshold

How many AARRF events have you been to this year? I don't recall seeing you there.

10th rollover? No, that's the 3rd this year and there are a total of four in the three years that AARRF has been using that facility. Consider the fact that there are 25-40 cars at each monthly event, I'd say that's a pretty good safety record.

Change the runoff? Go get a shovel...better yet, build a track in MN that's close to civilization. As you know, there are very limited facilities in MN. You know what some of the other venues that AARRF, SCCA and other groups have used? Raceway Park, Elko, etc. That's a cement wall, what kind of runoff would you rather have? I've seen probably a dozen cars go off at MHSC and they have not flipped.

Cone death chicane? The chicane is there to prevent accidents. If it was not there, people would get going way too fast and increase the chances of heading into the corner too hot. If you can't navigate a simple chicane, that's your issue.

As far as not being anybody left....I doubt it. Of the four that have flipped, two have already returned. The owner of the Accord will be back in his 240sx, so that makes three. The other, well he won't be back and I'll leave my comments unsaid for that. If you race your car in any form, you better accept the fact that you can do damage to yourself and your vehicle. If you can't accept that, then go rent 2F2F.

As Charlie from AARRF says, "We can't make motorsports safe, but we can make it safer."

Tstorm

And I see that there policy of charging a fee for going off track is really detering people from driving way over their ability. Yes, MN really only has 1 track BIR, however Mid-America, Road America, Blackhawk Farms and others are with in a reasonable distance. The St Cloud facitily is better than nothing, but not by much.

Greyout, that is the track.

mist sITR

that was my first aarrf event. i'm been to the track before but never with aarrf. over all i had a good time and i'm sure u'll see more of me next year

yeah there is no run off on most of this course

yes they still have the chicane. i think it's a good idea to have it but this day is seemed alot tighter then normal (some guy in a BMW came through it wrong and flew about 100 yards off the track into the brush) both he and his car was fine

me exiting the chicane

Threshold

Just like the government's posted speed limits are doing the same?

Maybe people should take responsibility for their actions? It's easy to point out what's wrong, how about offering up realisitic suggestions for operational improvements? Don't expect a club that uses a track for a day to have the power to make facility changes.

I should also add that the Corvette club, BMW club, Porshe club, Vintage club and others that I'm not remembering have used and/or continue to use this facility.

GSpeedR

Speaking of "zero run-off" this picture really makes a tire wall look appealing...

siisgood00

U hittin ur bumpstiorps?

Timmah!!

That track looks like it was built in the 50s and has never seen any safty uprades

Tstorm

Its not a "real" track, it is the MN Highway safety center. Used for police driver training.

Lo-Buck EF

well, on a positive note, the roof held up very well on the accord

tnord

1 this year, 2 last year, and maybe 2 the year before. i don't like them, or the track, which is part of the reason i don't attend. also, their schedule frequently conflicts with the schedule of Midwestern Council, and i much prefer to run with them.


<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
10th rollover? No, that's the 3rd this year and there are a total of four in the three years that AARRF has been using that facility. Consider the fact that there are 25-40 cars at each monthly event, I'd say that's a pretty good safety record.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

where did you come up with 4? Llew Montgomery, the competition director for AARRF, was in at work about a week ago, and he informed me of the many many rollover incidents that occur there. ones i can remember off the top of my head:
Mercedes 300E (can't remember the model)
WRX
328is
M3
the accord from this thread
older civic hatch
new gti

these are just the ones i remember, i'm sure there's more. then start considering the corvette club and i'm sure the tally will rise significantly.

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Change the runoff? Go get a shovel...better yet, build a track in MN that's close to civilization. As you know, there are very limited facilities in MN. You know what some of the other venues that AARRF, SCCA and other groups have used? Raceway Park, Elko, etc. That's a cement wall, what kind of runoff would you rather have? I've seen probably a dozen cars go off at MHSC and they have not flipped.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

yeah that's right, change the runoff. or better yet, create some. suggesting that i should do it personally is so absurdly rediculous. it's the track's responsibility to create a safe environment, or else people will stop competing there, ie BIR. a muddy ditch isn't exactly what i call runoff. i don't know if you've ever been to a real track or not (i doubt it), but once you do, you'll see what runoff is. great, 0 of 12 cars that go off haven't flipped. if the next one does, that's 1 of 13, which is a HORRIBLE ratio. there should be upwards of 100 'offs' with 0 rollovers.


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Cone death chicane? The chicane is there to prevent accidents. If it was not there, people would get going way too fast and increase the chances of heading into the corner too hot. If you can't navigate a simple chicane, that's your issue.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

wrong. when they start MOVING the thing around mid-session, that's THEIR problem, not mine. when that 'apex' cone gets knocked over, they do not put it back in the same place. that's NOT SAFE at all and is 100% the clubs fault. and HOLY CRAP, they're using those giant construction barrels now, is their intent to damge everybody's car?

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
If you race your car in any form, you better accept the fact that you can do damage to yourself and your vehicle. If you can't accept that, then go rent 2F2F.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

check the sig buddy. i have 4 years experience doing Solo I type events at REAL race tracks, about 4 Solo II events, 3 track days, 3 drivers schools, 1 W2W race, and most importantly, a competition liscense. how much experience do you have?

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As Charlie from AARRF says, "We can't make motorsports safe, but we can make it safer."
</TD></TR></TABLE>

most of the guys ar AARRF think they're such important people. their procedures are poor, effeciency is poorer, and safety procedures more than questionable. i have tried to discuss how these things could be improved, and the only response i got from them was yelling, telling me that if i didn't like the way they did it, i wasn't welcome. no explination for why they did what they did, or consideration for my ideas.

god forbid there could be a better way, or that a new org could ever make mistakes.

to AARRF

Jon Nelson

Has anyone done track days with Donnybrooke at BIR (Or whatever it's called these days)???

What are the chances of a return of "real" roadracing to BIR? Anyone starting a NASA chapter? Love to run Honda challenge at BIR..... It's "only" a 5 hour tow for me.

tnord

yes, i have. i used to work for them on occasion at these events actually. they're pretty well run with more track time than you can shake a stick at, usually have pretty darn good instructors, and are fun guys to hang out with (at least they were when i was working). i know the owner and can give you their phone number if you don't already have it.

and the chances of real road racing returning to BIR is very good. don't ask me how i know.

Skunk2Civic94

i like the yellow ek

Jon Nelson

OK, I'm not gonna ask..... I'm gonna DEMAND!!!!

Come on, just a hint? How about a sanctioning body....SCCA? NASA? Council? ....NASCAR?

It's a lovely track, really, and nice and close to me. I'd love to do a couple of double regionals each year in my ITA CRX. I used to crew for a guy with a GT3 510, spent at least 4 weekends a year there.

Puhleeeeeeeeese?

Jon

mist sITR

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Skunk2Civic94 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i like the yellow ek </TD></TR></TABLE>
well heres sone more pics of it just for u

Tstorm

I would just like to add; What Tnord said x2. They aarrf are completely against any change. I went to one event this year and do not plan on going to any more unless some changes are made.

I did an event with Donnybrooke earlier this year, it was a good event and a lot of track time.

Threshold

Wow...textbook denial response. Classy!

The rollover numbers you have still don't add up to ten, there's no need to exaggerate. I have NEVER heard of more than four cars and I'm pretty familiar with what has gone on, although I could certainly be wrong. I sent a note to Llew as I'm curious.

Why would I consider the Corvette club or other clubs? You're making it sound as if AARRF is responsible for cars rolling over.

I'm not saying AARRF runs a perfect operation. The point is, to me, it's the best opportunity to legally drive a car on a track that is close to the cities. I don't have the time or the money to consistently make trips to BIR, MAM, Gingerman, etc. You don't have to agree with me - I just don't understand the pointless attacks.

The way you reply and provoke, it does not surprise me in the responses that you have gotten.

Sorry to go off topic here....

GokuSSJ4

nice pics ,