JSTOCK

Any comments or concerns? I came across one on partstrader for $1200 b/o. Is it worth it??

Conechaser

JRSC doesn't do much for the d15/16.

I know of a guy w/ a JRSC D16 w/ an auto, that runs identical 1/4 mile times as my car. I don't think it will give you enough advantage for what class it would put you in.

WRXRacer111

If it did put out any worthwhile power, it would merely result in molten inside front tires while coming off corners.

johng

It'd be a fun street car, but you'd most likely get smoked in SM. It'd still be a fun car and it looks a lot cheaper than a B block motor transplant.

CivicSiRacer

I was going to say the same. You would be in Mod class - prolly Street Mod and you would be destroyed in that class. But autocrossing is all about fun right As long as you are having fun and don't care about getting destroyed then go ahead and buy it.

JSTOCK

Thanks people!!!! Unfortunatey, I'm a competitive **** so I'm gonna pass.....I wanna have some chance at winning a few. LOL

Todd00

That setup would be better than a B series swap IMO. An LSD is a must, but you'd retain the lightweight D series motor and get torque. Put 13x8's on the car with 225 tires and you won't liquify the front tires with that setup.

I think it could be pretty competitive. If you don't want it though, send the link to me

CivicSiRacer

Also remember you will not be "KING OF THE HILL" the first year or two autocrossing. Be ready to be humbled by people in 67hp who have been racing for 10-15 years.

Your first year should be a learning curve don't worry about mods - worry about modding the driver first.

grippgoat

I think a turbo would be better. With a JRSC you'd be lucky to break 150 whp, prolly. I'm buying a civic soon, and in my motor option window-shopping, it occurred to me that a built turbo D16 could easily put 250 to the wheels (I'm talking like 10+ psi with built internals) and be nice and light with a low center of gravity. However, what derailed that train was realizing that I don't think anyone makes an LSD for that tranny.

-Mike

fsp31

It can win, but in a class like SM it's all a matter of $$$.

IMO, a setup like this could ultimately smoke the class after some modification. Under SM rules, engines can be FI, stroked, ported, cam'd, massaged, or whatever but no matter what, a D-series motor is lighter than a B-series. It remains to be seen whether a SC or turbo will be the ticket. But given the huge budget that *somebody* out there is guaranteed to have, it's possible to build a D-series motor that makes all the power a FWD autocross car could possibly ever use (I don't think the "useable" limit is all that high. refer to the Lombardo Express)... and still weigh 80-100+ lbs less than a B-series motor.

I drove a SC'd Del Sol (SOHC non-vtec) and was thoroughly unimpressed. However, people have proven that it's possible to develop a lot of power with a supercharger. It's just not necessarily a "bolt on and go" type of thing. But then, neither is a turbo.


[Modified by fsp31, 8:21 PM 1/16/2002]

Todd00

A turbo is too sketchy in a FWD autox car IMO. I'd prefer the smooth curve of a supercharger and not have to worry about lag. 150HP is plenty to win SM right now if your car is light enough and setup correctly.

And quaife makes an LSD for about any application, so that shouldn't be an issue.

JSTOCK

All of you guys are leaving great feedback. Thank you, kindly!! I think I will definately hone my driving skills first with the basic I/H/E setup and I'm just gonna hook up my suspension first and foremost. Gonna be running 15x6.5 Rota Slipstreams (not sure what rubber yet), Koni yellows w/ Neuspeed Race springs, upper frt/rear strut bars, lower sways, and possibly a lower rear tie bar if my budget goes as planned. I believe that will be a decent setup for now. But I think the JRSC is very tempting for a nice future project after I blow this engine. LOL!! I have the SCCA Solo II rules coming in the mail so I'll have to read up on some other ?'s I have!! Thanks people!!!

P.S. - Make sure you say hello to Sloth......he loves people (doesn't get out much)

fsp31

>>And quaife makes an LSD for about any application<<

... and the prices for D-series applications are *cheap*. Less than $600 last time I checked.

A key will be to shoot for the 1800 lb minimum weight. It's gonna be tough enough with a D-series, and dang near impossible with a B-series. A well driven (an easy thing to type ain't it? ), 1800 lb, LSD equipped, Honda with ~150 Hp and ~150 ft/lbs of torque will be reeeaaalll competitive. Power numbers like that will be pretty easy to get from a D16. But start adding weight and you get in trouble quickly.

Grady Wood has been busy with his SM project. It's a 3G hatch with the original motor. It is *light*. And he's getting an impressive amount of power from the motor even though it's still N.A. Should be interesting to see how he fares this year.

BTW, everyone be sure to pray that Tom Ellam leaves SM alone.

JSTOCK

Here ya go dude..........SLOTH luvs ya

http://www.thepartstrader.com/Single...=130&C2ID=1004

grippgoat

Oh, right. AutoX. I kind of forgot that was the point of the topic. Anyway, I agree, a turbo, especially one big enough to net the power I want, would most likely be tough to drive at an autox. But I'm thinking more about track events.

Grrrr... I couldn't find it on the application list at quaifeamerica.com. Oh, but look at that.

Honda - Civic/CRX Si/EX models 88-99, except 90-91 Si** inventory reduction sale >> 60.309.155 $695.00

I think my eyes read it as 88-89.

-Mike

fsp31

I know I saw the Quaifes for D-series tranny's at $595.00. A recent bout of oldtimers disease prevents me from remembering where.

KekeK_5G

I am building the car your speaking of right now. I ran my car in SM last year and did quite well regionally. I have beaten among others, a Hybrid 5G w/built GSR turbo running Hoosiers, DSMs, WRX's, EK w/ built B20, 400 hp A4's. My car only has an NA D16 with IHE. I also have a Quaife, GC's, Energy Susp. master kit. For tires I ran Advan A032R's. There is one Eclipse who really whooped me and also a WRX, both of which had very experienced drivers and very large and sticky tires. Really whooped means about 1.5-2 sec 's.

My car is a 92 Civic DX, no rear seats, no AC, no PS. Weighs about 1970 lbs. I believe the minimum is 1900 lbs for my setup. This season I'll be running a JRSC w/8 psi boost and some Kumho's, also getting an alignment.

This is a very balanced car, the lightweight engine is awesome, especially with the Quaife. It is also pretty easy to drive. The JRSC will also only add weight behind the engine, this wont hurt the weight balance too much. The B series add more weight up front and add a turbo and all the associated plumbing and the balance gets worse. Add a turbo to the D16 and your gonna hurt the weight balance also.

As far as production of boost goes, there is now an electronic boost limiter (EBL) which can be set to give completely linear boost production, keeping the linear NA power curve the motor has, while also keeping the car easier to drive.

I think it should work out fine. BTW this is on a college student's budget.

grippgoat

I'm not sure I see how a turbo on the D16 would weigh substantially more than a JRSC. Sure, maybe 20 pounds, but that's not a lot. And the weight should be lower in the engine compartment. However, the JRSC (if it mounts in the same place as a GSR) would be between the axles, where as the turbo would be in front of the axles.

How much wheel horsepower do you expect from the JRSC?

-Mike

Todd00

1flysi:

If you want to do that car right, 13x9's are a MUST with 225 hoosiers, period. I think a FWD Honda may be able to do it, but SM requires a cash layout to be competitive. And trust me, there are people who are willing to do it just to win an ugly red jacket.

KekeK_5G

grippgoat,
I'm not shooting for a number, just looking to get extra performance out of the engine for a reasonable price. If I had to put a number on it, I would say the car probably has about 115 to 120 whp now, so 145-150 would be nice. Not expecting any more than that. With respect to the turbo, it doesn't add much more weight than the JRSC, but its where the weight is added. The JRSC's weight is at about the same height as a turbo, but behind the motor. Plus the swap from the stock cast exhaust manifold to the header netted about 10 lbs or so.

Todd00,
The 13x8's would be nice (keiser's are yummy), especially with hoosiers, but thats very expensive and wouldn't fit over my fastbrakes 11 inch rotors, the require a 15 inch wheel minimum. The Kumho's should do just fine for now in a 205-50. I'm not looking to be nationally competitive, I don't have the budget or the time to attend the events. It would be nice to have a regionally competitve car though, while it is pretty close to that now, I believe my main problem is hp right now, as the car handles very well. All of that beside, I am still learning, and thats what makes the biggest difference anyway.

Jay

KekeK-18

Sometime you just need to find out the answer yourself. People will think its rice or crazy if I tell them I'm gonna run 225 50 16 tires in front and 205 50 15 in the rear on my little civic. It's hard for them to give any advice without driven your car which is heavily modded. You are a good driver and all the mod that you add so far make perfect sense (include the JRSC) since you're in SM already, you'll be fine with the supercharge and just have fun with it. See you when the next season start Jay!

Lo-Buck EF

werd to that. if u run the sc and set the car up, u could be in there. it hinges on two things. the nut behind the wheel and the set-up.

Todd00

Honestly, huge brakes are a disadvantage for autox. 205 kumhos will make you locally competitive, but that's about it. If you have any fast CSP or ESP cars in your area that run at national events and do well, you'll see that kind of competition in SM.

JSTOCK

All of you people are gettin' me madd excited for this season. It will be my first but definately not my last. I can't wait for the local SCCA meeting coming up in my town next month!!!!