krshultz

Howdy folks,

I perused the archives and found a lot of "Should I buy SA or M" kinds of things, but nothing that tackled higher end helmets. I already know I need an SA helmet for racing, so we've established that. I'm also interested in the following features:

- Aero stuff / downforce. For if I ever pull the trigger on that DSR Radical
- Light weight. Current Bell Sport 2 is a little heavy
- Not interested in forced air ( at least not AFAIK I'm not )
- Removable inner pads and liner would be great
- Good ventilation
- Nice big eyeport
- Fully closing visor - losing a contact under braking for T1 SUCKS
- Must accept cleats for the ISAAC device (I suspect this is a non issue but you never know)

Price is largely unimportant to me; I won't pay $1200 for some exotic F1 lookalike, but if it gets me lighter, safer and longer lasting, I'll pay several hundred. I'm also vendor agnostic...Shoei, Bell, Simpson...whatever.

I'll be poking around the web this weekend, just wondering if anyone has something like this and it's a particular favorite.

DBurke

If you look on the grids of pretty much any major series you see Arai everywhere. The GP-5 is the "formula car" bucket. The GP-5K is the the wider eyeport version and about $350 less than the GP-5. Either works fine in a open cockpit situation. They balance good on your head too. No excessive weight in any one area. HANS anchors = no problemo.

I don't like the Impact stuff. Thin shells unless you get the dirt shell. A friend had one inadvertent drop off a toolbox on to grass, cracked lid.

Back in Black

Karl-

Not sure how "high-end" you're looking for, but I made the decision to purchase the Bell Vortex about 6 months before selling the car. Good timing, I know.

FWIW, I did/do love the helmet. It's VERY light, and has good ventilation. I'm guessing you'd want something a bit more aerodynamic if you seriously think you might get into the Radical someday.

Prior to having it, I used that awful M2 pos. Now that was quite good at working the neck. Below is a link to the Vortex. Once taking the green, it seemed easy to forget that it was on. If it weren't for the face shield...

"Good luck with that"

http://www.thebellstore.com/Auto/ultra.html

rotten

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by krshultz &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
- Aero stuff / downforce. For if I ever pull the trigger on that DSR Radical
</TD></TR></TABLE>

My only comment would be to buy a helmet for what you're going to immediately going to be racing, not what you think may possibly, perhaps, do in the future.

I allowed myself to buy a helmet that would allow me to run in a open wheel car if I ever decide to again, despite the fact that I haven't since I bought the helmet and won't in the foreseable future. So I bought a helmet based on what I may do, rather then get one perfect for what I am doing. It was stupid, and I am kinda kicking myself for it.

I should have just said, "Well if I driver an open wheel open cockpit car I'll get a new helmet".

phat-S

Karl, if you can get beyond a need/desire for a "nice big eyeport" I would highly recommend a Bell Vortex, Vortex FA or last gen M3 (IIRC, the last generataion Sport III is the same weight as well). Whereas the older M2 was the fish bowl sized lens (exaggerating but I still do think they were huge and did own one), the redesign on the M3 went to the lighter and slimmer eyeport design (I had someone check the weights on them a few years back and they were the same as the Vortex). If I could afford it (and might just pull the trigger anyway next time I need a helmet), I would go w/ a GP-5. I wrecked a motorcycle w/ an Arai and happen to have an Arai head. I love the helmets and due to the above, have a strong trust for them in a crunch (also, that they are like 2 lbs. is a huge nice to have). But all that would require you get away from that want for an oversized eyeport (and Lord knows, I have to believe the narrower the safer).

krshultz

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by rotten &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">It was stupid, and I am kinda kicking myself for it.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Yeah but think about it this way - if you get offered a codrive in someting that requires aero, you're ready.

Jason, the Vortex looks to be "about right." Mild aero, large eyeport, light...it's got the right stuff. Might not be aero enough for a ride in a Formula Mazda, but would be enough for a codrive methinks.

Any other recommendations for a high-end hlmet that isn't impossibly ($1000+) expensive?

black3door

GP5-S

i've yet to see it here. maybe someone does carry it, but I don't know.

basically the same everything as the GP5 including eyeport size. only difference is you get one air inlet at the top instead of 3 and 1 outlet instead of 2

HALF the price of the GP5.

DBurke

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by black3door &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">GP5-S.</TD></TR></TABLE>
No such thing. I think that you are thinking of the GP-5K.

GP-5 =$1100, GP-5K $700, SK-5 $600 (Karting only, not approved for Auto Racing use.) There are aero add-ons for both the GP-5 and 5K.

The NA Importer of the Arai stuff is Speedware Motorsports. I've bought a bunch of stuff. Good guys
Link to helmets: http://speedwaremotorsports.co...k.asp

slammed_93_hatch

after reading threw this thread i wandered to google to checkout some of the mentioned helmets, and i found this which i think you, karl, might be interested in,

http://www.saferacer.com/sispvuhesa.html

its the SIMPSON SPEEDWAY VUDO looks like it meets all of requirments that you asked for, i have never used or seen the helmet though.

also, unless you have like a certian vendor, id use http://www.froogle.com , i found the above helmet for 656, from http://www.helmetcity.com who is some what local to me and i have bought all of my saftey stuff from them they are great.

black3door

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by DBurke &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">No such thing. I think that you are thinking of the GP-5K.

GP-5 =$1100, GP-5K $700, SK-5 $600 (Karting only, not approved for Auto Racing use.) There are aero add-ons for both the GP-5 and 5K.

The NA Importer of the Arai stuff is Speedware Motorsports. I've bought a bunch of stuff. Good guys
Link to helmets: http://speedwaremotorsports.co...k.asp</TD></TR></TABLE>

considering i've seen twoof such helmets, I think i know what i'm talking about

I already said I don't know if anyone in north america carries them, but if you want proof of their existence, here it is:

http://www.arai.co.jp/jpn/jp/news/gp-5s/gp-5s.html

note the SA rating and not just JAF rated.

Maybe someone ought to give Speedware a shout and ask them to import some of these. Way better bang for the buck than the GP5.

vodomagoo

its not the highest end helmet but the bell m3pro is a great helmet for the money. not much aero but im sure someone makes a add on

phat-S

Out of curiosity, I googled for it and the two links I found in English say:

from-clubrsx<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by #1 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
I use an Arai GP5S (its called the GP5K in North America), I think it retails for about $600 usd, but I bought it in Hong Kong and it cost approx. $500 cdn. Full face shield with SA2000 rating.</TD></TR></TABLE>

from-bimmerfest<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by #2 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Listen to the man, he know what he's talking about. Quality auto paint is the way to go. I painted my own many moons ago, then last year got a GP5-S (which is the Japanese version of the GP5-K... still SA2000, but I got it for about $350 due to favorable exchange rates at the time). So I decided to paint my own again.</TD></TR></TABLE>

So not saying the helmet doesn't exist but is it possible that its simply a rebadging in Asia (or here for that matter) of the GP-5K as the two posters state?

jlucas

Don't buy anything with trying it on or a very clear understanding of the exchange policy. Each brand fits differently and sometime even different helmets from the same brand fit differently. Thought I'd like the OPM helmet, got to try one from a guy at work and my nose rubs the front. Doh!

Very happy with my GP5. You can always get the the areo add ons if you go open cockpit. I don't think all the Cart & IRL guys would be using them if there was a aero concern.

black3door

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by phat-S &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Out of curiosity, I googled for it and the two links I found in English say:

from-clubrsx

from-bimmerfest

So not saying the helmet doesn't exist but is it possible that its simply a rebadging in Asia (or here for that matter) of the GP-5K as the two posters state?</TD></TR></TABLE>

shields for 5S won't fit the k

not a rebadged K, the eyeports are different

krshultz

Looks like the Bell Vortex is for me. It's not insanely expensive and has all the right features. Thanks guys.

Adam, since you've owned multiple Bells, have you found them to fit the same model to model? My outgoing Sport 2 fits me perfectly.

On edit - I just found this:
http://www.subesports.com/prod...=1340
and was surprised to see that it's only $599. I've been quite impressed with everything I've gotten from Sparco so I may have to check this out.

It'll be so nice to get this. The one I'm using really is awful. Words can't possibly do it justice.

I SAY EH

Karl,

I've been shopping for a new helmet lately, and I'm about to pull the trigger on either a Bell Dominator or an Xcelerator (not sure on the spelling). $750+, but money well spent, methinks.

As for the Sparco, they are very pimp, built in hearing protection and everything. BUT, damn things wouldn't fit on my head for the life of me. Really just wouldn't fit at all.

I know a lot of open cockpit (sports racer and formula car) guys that really like Simpson, Arai, Bell and Sparco. So as long as you find one that fits YOU the best, you can't go wrong with any of those (and many others too).

Most important: Try them all on. For like 15 minutes at least. With a head sock. Walk around the store and move your head around.

CV Products over in High Point (or somewhere near there) has a nice selection of Bell and Sparco, if you want to try that on. Or go to VIR when the Grand-AM race is in town (or even better, go to Petit LeMans at Rd Atlanta). There will be several vendors selling helmets, and plenty for you to try on.

-Matt

black3door

on a side note:

if you aren't in a dire need of a new helmet, wait till october when the 05 rating comes out

phat-S

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by krshultz &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Adam, since you've owned multiple Bells, have you found them to fit the same model to model? My outgoing Sport 2 fits me perfectly.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

They do fit the same to a degree. Its a bit confusing and probably depends on when you bought your Sport II. The M3 Pro and Vortex are both sized the same (7 3/8, 7 1/2, etc ....), the Sport III (which is a bit different construction and vent design I believe - should be lighter and narrower eyeport than the Sport II or M2) is in S, M, L, etc ... I *think* my old M2 was sized in the inches, I just used that measurement to order my M3 Pro and it was a perfect fit. IIRC, the Sport III I have is an "Med" and fit-wise, I cannot tell the difference between it and my M3 Pro.

Catch 22

Sizing can be tricky even within the same manufacturer. I had an SA95 Bell SRPro that I had bought around 1997. It was a Large.
When I replaced it in 2003 with another SRPro, naturally I ordered another Large... Nope. Didn't fit. WAY too tight. Had to go to an XL (which is actually a bit too large without a balaclava).

So always try helmets on, even if you're just upgrading within the same manufacturer.

Scott, who has in fact verified that his head isn't still growing.

.RJ

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Catch 22 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Sizing can be tricky even within the same manufacturer</TD></TR></TABLE>

Yep. I could not get a Bell M2 or M3 to fit at all. I thought I had it right with the M3, but I ended up taking it back, and trying on a M3 Pro - it was an extra $150, but it came in more sizes than "S-XL" (i.e. head sizes) and I knew right away I had a good fit - with instructing 12-15 weekends a year, I really cant afford to have an uncomfortable bucket on my lid.

phat-S

Ahh, so there is a non Pro M3 model? Ok so change my first post comments to be M3 Pro Series that shares the weight w/ the Vortex not the M3 (don't know anything about a non-Pro M3).

Out of curiosity, were you guys trying on two new helmets for sizing differences in the same company? I know that if I put on my old M2 when my new M3 Pro showed up, the latter felt like someone put it in a super shrink ray. But it was the difference in broken in vs. brandy new.

Ryan, you sure you have a Bell head? Have you tried a Shoei or Simpson? I really was suprised how I could wear an Arai that was way too small but a Shoei had to be the perfect size to not give me a headache. Might want to shop your head around (unless you have already - and btw, Shoei SA and M sizing is not anything close to each other so make sure you try the SA models).

.RJ

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by phat-S &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Ryan, you sure you have a Bell head? Have you tried a Shoei or Simpson? I really was suprised how I could wear an Arai that was way too small but a Shoei had to be the perfect size to not give me a headache. Might want to shop your head around (unless you have already - and btw, Shoei SA and M sizing is not anything close to each other so make sure you try the SA models). </TD></TR></TABLE>

I'm not sure what brand fits my lid the best, but i'm very close to OG racing, and they had the bell helmets in stock. I tried a few simpson helmets, but none of them seemed to fit quite right (at least the ones under $500).

Does Shoei still sell SA rated helmets? I called them and asked a year or two ago if they were still making them and they said "no" - my old 'M' helmet was a Shoei and it fit me fantastic.

jlucas

I believe Shoei are still made but not imported. At least that was the case 3 years ago when I was looking. You might be able to find them on some Japan sites but trying one on is going to be a problem.

Catch 22

I used to visit the Racer Wholesale showroom in Atlanta and try on pretty much every Bell and Simpson available at the time. I ordered the last helmet (the SRPro mentioned above) without trying it on making the assumption that it would fit just like the old one.
I was wroonnnggggg.

Fortunately Brett (soloracer.com) took care of me and exchanged it without question.

But I did discover that I have more of a Bell head than a Simpson head. The Simpsons fit, but were not as comfy as the Bells.
At my Skip Barber thingy they had Impacts. I can say I do not even remotely have an Impact Head (which sounds pretty funny). I tried on multiple sizes that were new and used and never got a comfortable one. The first day I went too tight for safety reasons (and hoping it would open up a bit) but ended up having to go larger due to the throbbing headache.

getfast

My two cents:

In my experience the major imported brands seem to have better construction and seem to last longer than the major domestic brands (metal visor switchgear vs. plastic, heavier liner fabric, tougher liner stitching, better padding, thicker chin strap, etc.)

For the past several years I have been using a Bieffe F1GP that is SA95 and therefore about to be a book-end. It's the most comfortable, most durable helmet I've ever seen and I will miss it... I'm in and out of it hundreds of times a year between HPDE driving, instructing, karting, and autocrossing... and it has held up much better than similar Bells or Simpsons that some people I know started using around the same timeframe.

So I'll be looking at similar Sparco and Arai helmets this fall, particularly because all my friends in the sportbike world swear by Arai... and they should know! Also because this one is a composite shell, which means I'd really notice the extra weight if I went back to fiberglass.

Long story short - you don't want the thing to be falling apart in 2-3 years like some I've seen (Bell M2-M3 in particular)... go with something imported.

As always, YMMV. Hope it helps!

Jon