CivicFerio

Here is the rough spec of the mugen 26mm bar.

26mm solid
39in length (approximately)
5.3 in arm length (approximately)

And here is the spec of the hollow bar I'm using.

31.75mm (1.25in) hollow
.120in (3mm) wall thickness
39in length
5.1in arm length


From my calculations the mugen bar will require approximately 318lbs to twist it 5° while the hollow bar will require about 422lbs to twist it 5°. So is it correct to say it's 33% stiffer than a mugen 26mm??

I think the best way is to check the rates on the anti roll bar tester. I wonder where I can rent one.

Charleston

tekstyle

i think the plate should take the shape of the subframe more. i dun really think people would care about the color, but as for me, darker would be a plus b/c i dun like my stuff flashy under there ( kinda ricey). also, i think if u can design one actually bolts onto the subframe at more than just 6 locations (2 LCA bolt, and 4 swaybar bracket bolts), it can be a lot stronger than it is currently. even stronger than the comptech bar. maybe make a L-shaped plate that goes parallel with the spare wheel area for the addition of extra bolts under the car ( might require sum drilling and sum beefy looking grade 8 bolts and washers).

Outsane

you could mount the bars up to a jig, and hang weights and measure the amount of drop

Outsane

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by CivicFerio &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Here is the rough spec of the mugen 26mm bar.

26mm solid
39in length (approximately)
5.3 in arm length (approximately)

And here is the spec of the hollow bar I'm using.

31.75mm (1.25in) hollow
.120in (3mm) wall thickness
39in length
5.1in arm length


From my calculations the mugen bar will require approximately 318lbs to twist it 5° while the hollow bar will require about 422lbs to twist it 5°. So is it correct to say it's 33% stiffer than a mugen 26mm??

I think the best way is to check the rates on the anti roll bar tester. I wonder where I can rent one.

Charleston</TD></TR></TABLE>

Did you do those calculations with flex in the mugen arms..

I doubt those aluminum arms you have in your design flex anywhere near as much as the mugen ones do...

Jon V

How much would you be lookin to sell a replica set up for?

The plate and the hollow sway bar set up, mounting hardwear to if thats not to big an issue? You still using stock end links?

I also like the idea that some one else had about the mounting points. I'll have to look again, but is it only mounted to the LCA mounts? If so it would probly help to mount it to the stock sway bar mounting points too.

Jon V

Or are you not even using the LCA mounts, just the sway bar mounts?

descartesfool

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 89civicdx &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Good job...looks like the RTR piece on the RSX

I know where to get the bar and lever arms but where did you get the mounting hardware? Is that a bushing or a bearing?

</TD></TR></TABLE>

Here is a link to a company selling those types of bushings, arms and splined sway bars. Other race shops sell them as well.

http://www.1speedway.com/Swaybar_Arms.htm

Another place that has them is

http://www.hrpworld.com

Very nice work by the way.

Here is a link to a table with comparable sway bar rates for various hollow bars and solid bars (just click on any length to get a table):

http://www.1speedway.com/sb_rates.htm

For the issue of the flexible arm in the Mugen bar, that will make very little difference in the overall rate because the arm is so short and it will not flex much. If you do the calculation, there is very little difference in % terms, say 3-4% I think.

Jon V

So you an just kind of peace your own together? Is there such thing as to stiff of a sway bar? And whats with the 15 degree spline arms, they for a different car? I don't know the measurments for what i would need anyone want to help.

I got an EK

And I still want to pick up one of these plates, any word when they might be available?

CivicFerio

It should be available in a week (today is 3/12) depending on how busy the machinist is. I have a question for all you guys. Looking at the brace we can see 6 bolts which holds it on to the subframe, then we have 4 more bolts which connects the D brackets to the brace. I want to make the brace universal so people with skunk anti roll bar kit or a ITR anti roll bar with brackets can use it. So do you prefer that the outter D bracket holes drilled to a specific kit or have a drilled upper hole and a sloted lower to acomodate different D bracket width or no holes drilled and the end user drills the hole themselves? Thank you very much for the input.

Charleston

greebler

Wow I am impressed, does yoru friend sell these? Or better yet, does he want to make some money?

Jon V

Personally I think that this particular item is meant for someone with series racing in mind. Knowing this you might as well make it a package deal and sell your hollow sway bar as part of the set up. It has been said that the hollow one is stronger than just about anything else on the market, so you might as well just sell the whole set up together.

Thats just my opinion though. I plan on going with the brace + hollow sway eigther way

The fact that I don't have a sway bar yet makes it easy for me to say that though

yakitori

wow thats real innovative

00JunSi

if i recall, your subframe is not the stock one...i remember you welded additional sheets of metal on the inside of a new rear subframe and installed it on your civic. i'm just wondering if a stock subframe with that brace would hold up as good since it doesn't benefit from the additional metal welded to it as your's does?

Jon V

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 00JunSi &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">if i recall, your subframe is not the stock one...i remember you welded additional sheets of metal on the inside of a new rear subframe and installed it on your civic. i'm just wondering if a stock subframe with that brace would hold up as good since it doesn't benefit from the additional metal welded to it as your's does?</TD></TR></TABLE>

Ahh, I would also like to know this. Is the stock EK hatch sub-frme strong enough to support your 32mm hollow sway with th additional brace that you are selling? Or do you need even more bracing like he has just mentioned?

CivicFerio

00JunSi

Good memory! That was like 2 years ago when I have to replace my subframe. Changing the subframe was no easy task, I has under the car for a day grinding and drilling all the spot welds off. I hope I won't have to go through that again.

Jon V

The stock subframe should hold up to the 32mm hollow bar with the proper spring rates thats why it's going to be installed in some Honda Challenge cars for initial testing.

The 32mm was in my car to see if the reinforcement that I made, make any difference. I would also want to know the next weakest link on our subframe.

I have high hopes that the brace will eliminate any furthur reinforcement needed for the stock subframe with the 22mm solid and even 32mm hollow so you don't have to go through repairing the subframe like what happend to me. Here's some old pictures of my subframe repair. Thank you.

Charleston

TeamSTEALTH GSR

for Charleston

Nice work. Seen it in person

Jon V

So the only reason you had to change/modify your sub-frame was becasue you damaged it in the first place? Thats when you added the extra support or did you just put in another OEM sub-frame?

Jon V

Does the brace strengthen the same places you added the extra pieces on to? Or does it just take the stress off of that area?

00JunSi

I remember when you did that Charleston, because we were discussing reinforcing the sub frame a lot back then, to your ingenuity
-shawn

CivicFerio

TeamSTEALTH GSR,

Thank you very much!

Jon V,

You are correct. When I damaged my subframe I reinforced the new one before installing it. The internal brace distributes the load upward to the main subframe piece while the external bolt on brace was made distribute the load downwards to the LCA bolt and bridging it across thus making it a one solid piece. I honestly don't know if I'm over engineering this brace but I think it's better to be too strong than too weak in this department.

Here is the final product ready for anodizing. If you guys have any suggestions about the design feel free to let me know. Thanks

Charleston

WalkingKenshin

Charleston,
have a question for you. In fact a huge favor..

Can i have the exact dimension's of the plate and the lca bolts... i can have mine cnc'ed out tomorrow night and have the raw plate by next Tuesday. I could paypal you a couple bucks for your time, at-least enough to get a 12 pack.

.RJ

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by [label &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">kenshin]Can i have the exact dimension's of the plate and the lca bolts... </TD></TR></TABLE>

Is that a joke?

WalkingKenshin

naa, just trace it and take some measurtments

WalkingKenshin

actualy.. lol i just realized it was on his car.. haha. my bad

.RJ

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by [label &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">kenshin]naa, just trace it and take some measurtments</TD></TR></TABLE>

Why dont you call SMSP and Hytech and Mugen and ask them too? I'm sure they will trade their R&D time for a case of budweiser....