I remember some ppl said "1/8 degree of total Toe out in front and zero degree of Toe in rear" can help the car rotate/ turn in better (autoX)......

Someone also said they using " Max Toe out within spec and zero Toe in rear" .....

My question is: which setting has MORE Toe out? 1/8 total or Max within spec??


From my Honda service manual alignment spec, total Toe (front):

Standard................( New )
0 +/- 2 ..................(0+/-0.08)


From the data on Alignment machine, total Toe (front):

Specified..............Range
-0.16* .................0.16*
* = degree


are those number equal to each other?? If anyone knows, what is the Alignment Spec on the 2001 ITR. I'm very confuse.

Thanks for your help


Oscar

 

Damn, there's someone else on this board named Oscar. The range is 5/32 total toe out to 5/32 total toe in. I think I would stick to an 1/8 total toe out

 

i run 1/16 total toe out in the front, 0 toe in the rear. combined with -3 degrees camber, it works for me. i've found the car to be too twitchy at high speed with any more toe.


[Modified by rodney, 3:41 PM 4/10/2002]

 

Thank you guys

I'm kinda new to alignment setting. Anyway, I'm planning to do 1/8 inches total toe out and probably 0 teo in back......will this become dangerous in daily driving?
If so, will a little toe-in in the back help !?

My main goal is getting a little more rotation at autox but also want to be safe on daily driving. Thanks again

 

Not sure if this helps...

All my cars have 0 F and 0 R. They all "wander" a bit at high speeds, but are not overly tail happy or anything uncomforatble. But, they are all RWD and solid axle.

I would use more toe out on the front of the RX-7s if I wasn't concerned with top speed at the race track. I would not use more tow out on the Caprice, as it would be difficult to keep in a straight line on the highway (surface irregularities would pull it back and forth).

 

The front toe out, zero toe rear, is more for bite at turn in then for rotation. Most cars set that way have suspension setups for oversteer.

My guess is that if you have stock, or street suspension, you could run some toe out in the rear to get some extra rotation. Just a guess, so maybe some1 who knows what they are talking about can confirm or deny that.

 

well, if you want more rotation at an autocross, pump up the rear tires...... seriously, when i ran an event in e stock in 2001 (99 civic si, DEAD stock, aside from hoosiers) i ran 34 psi in the front and and 60psi in the back! it was the only way to legally rotate the car and not wreck the wifeys daily alignment.

 

I do the opposite to get rid of osme understeer. I reduce the pressures in the rear so they distort more and lose grip earlier. Of course, I have to put 48 psi in the front tires just to avoid rolling over onto the sidewall, so pumping up the rears is out of the question anyway.

 

It's been a long time since the last debate about increasing/decreasing rear tire pressure (relative to the front) in order to reduce FD understeer in an autox environment. The consensus was both do, depending on a few factors.

Edit: I should really say the consensus was that either can, depending on a few factors.


[Modified by 4doorH22, 12:15 PM 4/13/2002]

 

Yes, you can increase oversteer for autocross by adding toe-out at the back. It works very well for WRXs. I've played a little with the low/high rear pressure ideas, and a few things I've noticed... high-pressure tends to make the rear of the car "skate". It seems to break loose more smoothly on smooth surfaces. However, it also acts to increase the wheel rate. On bumpy surfaces, you now have a stiffer "spring" at the grip interface. My car at least, tends to give up traction in a hurry with a ton of pressure in the rear and mid-corner bumps. The low-pressure setup works better for this, since the tire acts as a softer spring in this instance and absorbs bumps better. For instance, on smooth asphalt the high-pressure setup worked awesome for me, while it was nearly undrivable on bumpy concrete.

PS- My Integra ran 1/8" toe out, 0 toe in the back, -2.25 degrees camber in the front. It's *twitchy* but I didn't think it was dangerous. I tend to like twitchy cars more than a substantial percentage of the general population, so you opinion of its "safety" may be different. Not a problem for me, but may not be to you personal preference, since it IS more twitchy than a factory alignment.

 

is that street tires? i'm sorry, i should have stated that i meant on race tires. i do not need to worry about tire defelection with the hoosiers.

 

You should also note that toe out in the rear will make the car more unstable during braking and transitions. This is not to say toe out in the rear is bad, just is going to make the car a little more on edge in those maneuvers.

EC