fleabag

My family's Volvo S60 go into an accident with a truck and it has caused some damage to the sheet metal of the car and while I've been shopping around for quotes to get repairs, I've noticed most body shops mention the use of bondo for repair. I'm well aware that bondo and other like body fillers are the standard for body repair in the industry today and supposedly they have great results as they just apply a very thin layer to smooth things out. Despite this, I'm still very interested in finding a body shop that uses body solder, lead or lead-free in order to work on its repairs.

Does anyone have an idea of where I can find a shop that does this? It's supposedly pretty rare nowadays but I'm really interested in getting this repaired the "correct" way.

-RedneckDave-

Dude it is really hard to find anyone that does metal filling anymore. It is becoming a lost art except in the custom car world.

fleabag

So if I find a shop that does "custom car" work, then they're most likely to be able to do that? I called a random "classic car" shop in New Jersey and the owner said they do in fact do body solder with lead. They charge $100 an hour for working with lead and $75 for the "standard" body filler. In my area, the rates are already $85 an hour, unfortunately NJ is all the way across the country, but I'm hoping that I'll be able to find a shop in the bay area that can do this work for me.


This was the only body shop thusfar that I could find that uses body solder (lead).
http://www.gcautobody.net/index1.htm

They don't even use lead-free stuff because they don't like how it sets..

Spawne32

iTrader: (3)

You wont find a shop in the bay area in california that does that because its not allowed by california environmental laws. Thats the reason why its a lost art.

fleabag

Well I found a shop in sacramento that can do it, so it has to be legal, however I'm hoping I can find a shop that is closer that can do it.

DC2.2_GSR

why would you want body solder instead of poly filler? that doesn't even make sense.

gorillafart

iTrader: (1)

even after you do body solder, they're still going to use body filler to do final shaping and sanding to smooth things out.

fleabag

SRSLY? Proof???!?!?!?!?! They didn't even have that plastic filler **** back in the 50s yet had body solder and used that exclusively so I don't see how that can be true. The point of body solder is so that you've got a filler that is more metallic in nature and will expand and contract the way the steel does. The "plastic" body fillers used today, no matter how good, just don't expand and contract the way body solder or the actual steel does. I don't trust that plastic **** for a second.

Spawne32

iTrader: (3)

nobody is gona use body solder on your car, its cheaper to replace the entire god damn panel on a honda then use body solder, stop living in the past.

donut.

Spawne32

iTrader: (3)

nah lol i just think its retarded thats all

DC2.2_GSR

you're completely incorrect in every one of your assumptions. what you seem to not understand is the fact that all body shops use poly body filler and will probably laugh at you if you ask for body solder instead.

i don't understand this random thought that poly filler is inferior. any one of the real body fillers (NOT Bondo lol) are light years beyond body solder in terms of durability and longevity, as well as overall heat related reactions and corrosion protection.

modern metal glazes and fillers are not the same as they used to be, where the heat produced during the chemical reaction between the filler and the hardener would cause condensation to build up behind the filler against the bare metal and cause rusting issues later on. that slight rust created would cause the filler to separate from the panel and the repair would be destroyed. modern fillers have many different chemical compounds that etch into the metal and protect the metal from corrosion, which solves the problems of old fillers.

along with the chemical advances in modern fillers, modern repair techniques have all but completely eliminated problems with filler cracking and separating. body fillers all have thickness limits and all competent body men will follow these rules to the T, for fear that the repair will fail and the job will come back, causing them to do it over for free. before filler is applied, the metal work is done. doing metal work to the panel first to ensure that the minimal amount of filler is to be used. after the proper metal work has been done, usually only a skimcoat of filler is even needed. never have i seen a standard poly filler applied more than 1/8" thick, which is the thickness limit of all standard fillers.


if a certain shop still makes repairs with solder, it's because they cater to customers who are very concerned with period-correct repairs on their classic cars. some people out there, believe it or not, won't even put modern nuts or bolts in their cars and they'll wait months and pay a TON of cash just to have new, old stock parts on their classics.

even in shops that still use body solder, they still realize that it can't be used on modern high strength steel. take a look at a fender from your family's volvo and take a look at a fender from an old classic, like any vehicle up until the 80s. notice the difference in thickness? body solder is applied by heating the surface to the point where the solder will melt. if you do that with modern thin steel that's on every vehicle, you'll warp the hell out of it and cause giant problems. the only place body solder is sometimes used is along roof lines and in the middle of A, B, or C pillars (C = sail panels... the tops of quarter panels) when doing a 'chop'. those areas are much stronger because they have much less distance between body lines, welds, or other attached panels.

any competent body shop will make a repair that you will never see for the rest of the vehicle's life. to be worried about the repair because of the repair material is just a waste of time. find a good shop that does repairs the right way and you'll have no problems. if you have any doubt about what i've explained, i'll be happy to explain it more clearly.

Spawne32

iTrader: (3)

amen, this guy knows what hes talking about, ashame your gona get tired of wasting your breath on this forum over and over again like i did.

DC2.2_GSR

thanks man. yeah it seems a little pointless to make a lot of the posts i make, but ignorance is one thing i can't stand. not necessarily ignorance of the person asking the question because he or she might just not know, and that's okay. everyone learns. it's the ignorance passed on from incompetent 'techs' who think they know how to do repairs or paint the correct way. the people spreading retarded information is what really bothers me. whoever led this guy to believe that modern plastic filler is in some way inferior to ancient body solder techniques is the person who i have a problem with. if he or she is spreading that kind of info, that means that somewhere out there someone is making money by doing repairs that suck. those people give a bad name to people in shops like mine who do things with only the most modern materials and techniques, and who are genuine and honest about the work that they do.

IMPATIENT

iTrader: (1)

amen....materials nowadays are leaps and bounds ahead of what most non autobody people think about. when people think of "bondo" they think of that old tan impossible to work with cloggy junk. The stuff that has been out for the past however many years is just so much better, flexible, strong, and so much lighter than previous stuff. I mean they have self leveling water resistant glaze for every type of material out there. One thing the autobody and paint industry has not done, is go backwards. Every year there is new and improved stuff coming out for everyones advantage.

DC2.2_GSR

very true. people always talk about filler and think 'bondo', but in reality bondo is the worst you can possibly use. even just spreading and sanding a high end filler from USC or Evercoat, like my favorite, the Rage Xtreme, you can tell the difference. it's night and day compared to bondo. it's like using a cassette player and then an iPod.

fleabag

But I want body solder cause it's more like vinyl instead of the garbage that is a cassette or an ipod with "compressed" (low bitrate) music on it. Good analogy btw..

Speaking of evercoat, what about this stuff? http://www.evercoat.com/productDetail.aspx?pID=37

rxbahamut

I know you can go to eastwood they sell non-lead body solder, equipment, and they even have some dvds on how to do it yourself if you are interested learn it on your own. I know it is alot in the filing of the solder. If you don't like bondo types of fillers you can go the fiberglass filler which is a little stronger or even aluminum filler that is supposed to be able to tap and dyed, so it is really strong, but is a little expensive for a quart.