SleepyEG

I know that i should search the archives or whatever, but I have tried, and can't find a good answer to this question. Now please, someone correct where my thinking is wrong. I haven't gotten a good answer to this question yet.. I think I am correct in assuming that most people who swap in a B18C1 into an EG hatch as I'm doing, bought the B18C1, so the only wiring they have is the wiring on the motor. Now keep in mind when answering me that I am dumb, and also am very visual, so i don't do well with written explanations of this ****. My case is different because I have a whole GSR at my disposal..I was under the impression that the "additional" wiring that is done in a swap is basically running a few things from the motor to the ECU, since those things aren't accounted for in the connecting (shock tower) harness...is that correct? Things that didn't exist in the EG don't have wiring, I understand. Here's my confusion, if I am using a GSR ecu, and GSR motor/wiring, why can't I just put in my GSR connecting harness, and if I can, why is there anything else to wire? I'm sure this is a stupid question, but someone please humor me and help clear this up.
~james

Side note, I haven't actually started the swap yet, maybe once I do, it'll all make a lot more sense, but I need $$ first..I need a clutch, tires, etc..and a job!! Anyone in eastern MA, want to employ a 3rd year Mechanical Engineering student?(shameless)

Turbogixxer

If you have the whole integra, just swap the dash and chassis harness and you will be done

SleepyEG

well I sold the dash, and wasn't planning on swapping the chassis harness, but that still doesn't really answer my question...

SleepyEG

ok, well I decided it was time to stop being dumb. So I ripped some **** apart in the integra, and came to the conclusion that the "shock tower" harness doesn't just plug in somewhere on the otherside of the firewall, it's wired in, neccessitating the aforementioned wiring to be done. So now I understand. Now that that is said, can anyone point me in the direction of a swap wiring guide, for people that aren't competent in wiring? I see/hear so many explanations about pinouts and A13 and D6, etc.. but I don't know what any of this means. Thanks again,
~james

Lei Siew Long

hope this helps:

SleepyEG

so what are those 3 wires? besides running those to the ECU..what else do I have to do? The plugs going into the ECU, do they have open slots that I put the other ends of my new wires into?
~james

Lei Siew Long

for the 92 civics, there are only two wires that are missing that needs to be plugged into the ECU: wire for the knock sensor and IAB. the open slot labeled #3 in the above picture is where the knock sensor goes. and for the IAB, this hasn't been proven to be correct yet, but, there is a fourth harness on the GSR's engine harness that is left empty that is supposed to be for the IAB.

what i mean is, there are three harnesses on the civic shock tower harness. all three harnesses from the integra's engine harness plugs right up to the civic's shock tower harness. but, there will be a fourth harness (two wire harness) that would be left open. this harness is from the integra's engine harness and there wouldn't be a plug for it on the civic's shock tower harness. i believe this is a male harness and what you are supposed to do is, salvage a female two wire harness from the same vehicle and run that to the ECU.

for the knock sensor, there is an open slot on the ECU harness. for the IAB, there is an empty slot on A17 and you would have to splice the second wire to a 12v source such as B1, that isn't empty.

SleepyEG

this is starting to make a lot more sense, when I posted my last post, which probably seemed stupid, it was because the only picture of the plug loaded, and not of the ECU, so I was still confused some..anyway..

So I don't have to wire the VTEC solenoid, or VTEC pressure switch, for the knock sensor, I run a wire from the number 3 hole in the shock tower harness to D3 hole in the other end of the harness. For the IAB solenoid, I am taking one of the two wires off of that fourth harness, and running it to A17, and the other to B1..
so here are my remaining questions:
1. how do I know which of the two wires goes to A17, and which goes to B1..
2. what do I do for the EVAP purge solenoid?
3. what do you mean by....<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Hatch4urSnatch &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> this hasn't been proven to be correct yet, but... </TD></TR></TABLE> Not that I don't trust you, I'm just confused. Has anyone done it like this before? If not, how do others do it?
Thanks again so much, I'm finally starting to understand.
~james

Lei Siew Long

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SleepyEG &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

So I don't have to wire the VTEC solenoid, or VTEC pressure switch </TD></TR></TABLE>

if you have a 92 civic, you don't because i checked with this list and all the wires are there, with the exception of knock and IAB:

Engine Side ECU Side
Desciption Wire Color Pin/Connection
VTEC Solenoid Yellow/Green A4
VTEC Oil Pressure Sensor Blue (passenger side harness) D6
VTEC Ground Black chassis ground
Knock Sensor Red/Blue D3
Evap Purge Power Yellow/Black 12V power (hot in ON or START)
Evap Purge Solenoid Red A20
Secondary Intake Solenoid Pink/Blue A17



<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">for the knock sensor, I run a wire from the number 3 hole in the shock tower harness to D3 hole in the other end of the harness</TD></TR></TABLE>

that is correct, from #3 on the pic to D3 slot on the ECU harness.


<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">so here are my remaining questions:
1. how do I know which of the two wires goes to A17, and which goes to B1..
2. what do I do for the EVAP purge solenoid?
3. what do you mean by.... Not that I don't trust you, I'm just confused. Has anyone done it like this before? If not, how do others do it?
Thanks again so much, I'm finally starting to understand.
~james</TD></TR></TABLE>

1. good question, from my recollection, there is a red wire (might have a stripe, but, i don't remember) and a black/yellow wire, which happens to be the same color as B1. so the red wire goes to A17 and black/yellow wire to B1.

2. EVAP is already there. i went through all the slots on the ECU and matched up all the colored wires in the above list from the integra's engine harness to the civic's shock tower harness, and all the wires are there with the exception of the two wires i mentioned: knock and IAB. (for 92 civics that is)

3. it's good you have a better understanding of this because i felt overwhelmed with the wiring before but, Poison did a good job of guiding me through it.

what i mean is, for the IABs, i wired it this way on my friend's swap but haven't confirmed that the IABs are functioning correctly because we're still in the process of breaking in the clutch, so it hasn't been driven over 3000 rpm. on top of that, we just removed the tranny a couple of days ago to have it shipped back to the seller (of the swap) because of the grinding. we're waiting for the seller to repair the damages and send it back to us.

i ran into a guy at the local junkyard that claims to have done thousands of GSR to 92-95 civic swaps, and he told me that he took all the loom and the electrical tape off of the integra's engine harness to trace the wiring of the IAB, and it leads the two wire male harness. he seems like a knowledgeable guy that wasn't talking out of his ***. in retrospect, i have searched and searched on this forum for IAB wiring, and not one person has mentioned this wiring method for the IAB.

i'll confirm this wiring method either by revving it to or pass 5750 rpm in neutral when we get the tranny back or when the clutch is broken in and we're able to drive it hard.

Lei Siew Long

in addition to these two wires, you have to obtain a four wire oxygen sensor from an integra, and wire that up to the ECU directly. here are the instructions for the o2 wiring:

It's simple anyway. here's how to wire four wire o2 sensor:

WHT wire goes to D14 which is O2 Sensor Input
BLK wire goes to A6 which is Heater Control
GRN wire goes to D22 which is Sensor Ground
BLK wire goes to B1 or A25 (doesn't matter) which is Sensor voltage

also, you never mentioned the year and model of your civic

SleepyEG

still have a few more questions

first, <TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Hatch4urSnatch &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
WHT wire goes to D14 which is O2 Sensor Input
BLK wire goes to A6 which is Heater Control
GRN wire goes to D22 which is Sensor Ground
BLK wire goes to B1 or A25 (doesn't matter) which is Sensor voltage

also, you never mentioned the year and model of your civic</TD></TR></TABLE>

1. Two of those say black, how do I know which is which?
2. Now I'm a little bit more confused, because those pictures/diagrams said that for B18C1, you have to wire up EVAP, but I think your saying it's already wired up?
3. Assuming I don't have to wire EVAP..or even if I do, is this everything I have to do for wiring?
Knock
IAB
O2 Sensor ( I thought the DX was a four wire already..never checked though )
EVAP (maybe not?)

Sorry I forgot to mention. This is a 95 B18C1 going into a 92 Dx hatch.

Also, what is EVAP??

~james

poison

You're doin a great job Hatch4urSnatch

I'm gonna clear some more things up for you and help you understand SleepyEG. I went thru the whole thread and finally saw specific what year the motor is and what year car, heh.

Being you have a DX, the O2 sensor wiring is NOT required. It already comes previously with a four wire O2 sensor, which is a little load off you.

However, you will still need to wire up the IAB (secondary butterflies) and the knock sensor if you plan on using the OBD1 P72.

As for the EVAP, that is also not required when swapping in a B18C1, however, you still may do it.

The EVAP purge solenoid also comes on 92-95 Civic EX/Si's and goes to A19 (yellow wire) and Grn/Blk which goes to A17, for which you need for the secondary butterflies. So this is not required as I would leave it. Just be sure to have your EVAP canister vacuum hoses (two of them) connected at the throttle body and intake manifold.

There is a braided hose that connects near the MAP sensor on the throttle body, and the vacuum hose (which is capped off) goes to the back of the intake manifold.

ALSO

Being you have a 92 Civic (any model), you will also NOT need to wire up any VTEC wiring, as Honda in 1992 used mainly the same main chassis harness in virtually all models in that year. So the three wires for VTEC will already be there and not required for manual wiring. You just simply grab the GSR engine harness and plug it right up to the shock tower.

Pretty simple.

The ONLY things you will need to manually wire up is the Knock Sensor to the D3 pinout, and the Secondary Butterflies for which is:

12v sourced wire - A25 or B1 which are both Yel/Blk wires that lead to the main power junction harness near the brake master cylinder. B1 is actually spliced with A25 by factory and does not matter for which you put to.

IAB ECU signal wire - This wire goes to the A17 pinout as you have a 95 B18C1 you are wiring in.

Had it been an OBD2 GSR harness, you would need to wire it to A17 as well (using an OBD1 ECU), but instead you would need a ground since the diaphram/vacuum
lines is slightly different. But this does not apply.

When doing wiring, just mainly take your time, know where you are at, do not lose track, and make sure they are tight connections. I would recommend you solder along with heat shrink wrapping on the wire to ensure professional look, but soldering with electical tape will do as well.

When Hatch4urSnatch told me about the issue with the person at the salvage yard doing this idea, it's a very swell idea, and looks professional nonetheless, but is a major pain. I would have to say it's worth it though, but definitely some timing-involving work.

As for swapping in mechanical parts, everyting will bolt right up. You will need to use everthing included inside the GSR engine bay -- B series shift linkage, engine harness, motor/tranny (obviously), axles/midshaft, header and everything else.

I'd also suggest swapping over the radiator and fuel pump as well.

Wish you best of luck, bro. Keep us posted.

SleepyEG

well thanks everyone for all the help...I'm scared to say this, but I think I pretty much understand all of it..Brandon, I IM'ed you a few last questions. Hopefully I'll be doing the swap soon. I need a job first, but hopefully I got one today. Senor Project Manager is calling me monday morning. I love H-T.
~james

Lei Siew Long

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SleepyEG &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">still have a few more questions

first,

1. Two of those say black, how do I know which is which?
2. Now I'm a little bit more confused, because those pictures/diagrams said that for B18C1, you have to wire up EVAP, but I think your saying it's already wired up?
3. Assuming I don't have to wire EVAP..or even if I do, is this everything I have to do for wiring?
Knock
IAB
O2 Sensor ( I thought the DX was a four wire already..never checked though )
EVAP (maybe not?)

Sorry I forgot to mention. This is a 95 B18C1 going into a 92 Dx hatch.

Also, what is EVAP??

~james
</TD></TR></TABLE>

ha, ha, Poison to the rescue.

for future reference, since you don't need to wire in a four wire o2, from what i recall, the two blacks could be wired either way, it doesn't matter.

and for the evap, here are a few pictures of what the EVAP purge solenoid looks like and it is located on the intake manifold behind the throttle body.





and wiring in the two wire harness for the IAB (if it is correct), isn't difficult at all and i'll post pictures of it very soon.


Modified by Hatch4urSnatch at 1:24 PM 6/20/2003

SleepyEG

I IM'ed poison with this question, but I'll post it, incase others are reading/wondering...what does the EVAP do? and more importantly, poison mentioned something about wiring it in the swap being optional, could one of you expand on that? I'm assuming that since it's attached the the IM, that I'm going to switch it with the motor, but what are pro's/con's of wiring it up? These may be dumb questions, but since I don't know what it is, it's hard to ask good questions about it
~james

Turbogixxer

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SleepyEG &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">what does the EVAP do? </TD></TR></TABLE>

At higher RPMs it lets vacuum into the coal container (i don't feel like typing today) it is for emissions

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SleepyEG &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">and more importantly, poison mentioned something about wiring it in the swap being optional, could one of you expand on that? </TD></TR></TABLE>

Yes, it is. It is emissions and i don't know how your state is with that. I think that the only state that you have to have it working ( i mean they are strict about it) is Cali. I wire is up cause it takes like 2 seconds to do.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SleepyEG &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">what are pro's/con's of wiring it up?</TD></TR></TABLE>

Pros - saving the earth, (Sometimes i have seen this) Not have a gas smell in the car, less wiring, less weight, that all i can think of right right.

Cons - (Sometimes i have seen this) have a gas smell in the car, failing emissions

SleepyEG

ok, I understand completely how to wire knock and o2...but I'm getting conflicting stories from you guys...earlier I thought that I had to wire EVAP, then thought I didn't, then thought I did...I would like to have it connected, do I have to, or is it included in the civic shock tower harness...
Originally in Hatch4ursnatchs posts, and in the picture/diagram, he made it seem that EVAP is included in the civic shock harness, so there's nothing to wire..
then poison stated that it's optional, now if it was in the civic harness, then it couldn't really be optional... So, are there wires for the EVAP in the civic harness, or do I have to run them...Poison specifically mentioned which colors and where to run them..I'm confused..

Is EVAP in the civic harness or no..
Sorry for being dumb, but I'm not doing it on purpose!
~james

MaxSterling

think what they are saying is,

on the ecu side for p72 obd1 (what you want to install, what you have) A20 pin is for EVAP and A17 is for IAB. If you have integra engine side harness, you would need to swap A20 wire to A17 on the civic cabin harness side, thus losing EVAP functions. You dont need EVAP to make the car run. But if you still want to hook it up then you need to add another wire from the shock tower to A20 pin on the ecu.

above is if you have integra engine harness. if you have civic engine harness its different b/c you have wire on the cabin side and engine side. peace out.

Lord Helmet

bump for good info

Lei Siew Long

as stated in my previous post, EVAP is prewired with the 92 civics. i have confirmed this by going through the ECU harness and the shock tower harness as well. the colored wire for the EVAP matches up with the correct slot in the ECU harness and it is the same colored wire as stated in the list i posted earlier.

SleepyEG

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by poison &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">As for the EVAP, that is also not required when swapping in a B18C1, however, you still may do it.

The EVAP purge solenoid also comes on 92-95 Civic EX/Si's and goes to A19 (yellow wire) and Grn/Blk which goes to A17, for which you need for the secondary butterflies. So this is not required as I would leave it. Just be sure to have your EVAP canister vacuum hoses (two of them) connected at the throttle body and intake manifold.

</TD></TR></TABLE>

This whole paragraph doesn't make sense to me. If it's prewired in as your saying..then how could it be optional? Poison, can you clarify? As far as i can tell from what your saying, it's wired into the shock harness, so then I can forget all about it, so why is poison giving me wiring instructions for it?
~james

thanks again!

Lei Siew Long

i've done my best to clarify this issue for you. you don't have to believe me.

SleepyEG

I do believe you, I'm sorry if it came off as insulting, all I was trying to say is that it seems as is poison was saying that it isn't pre-wired, and I know you had mentioned he explained it to you, so I expected you to both say the same. I'm still confused about the EVAP, but in regards to everything else, thank you very much, the diagrams especially were very helpful. Thanks again,
~james

SleepyEG

poison? anyone?
VTEC Villian? I was expecting you in here at some point

~james

poison

Sorry I haven't been here in a while. Took the weekend off work and didn't have a computer at home

As for what is going on. Hatch4urSnatch, great job

As for the purge control solenoid, I mistakenly got it confused with the Lockup control solenoids for which is on the EX/Si/DX/CX/LX by factory. This is not needed as it requires the same pin-outs for IAB's on the GSR.

With the EVAP purge control solenoid, the wiring for this is PRE-WIRED for this set up.

The EVAP purge wiring is as follows (which is pre-wired) so all you need to do is plug it in, and the pin-outs match up.

Purge Control Solenoid:

Yel/Blk (power wire) to the Power Junction harness, and leading to A25.
Red wire to Red/Blk to Red again to the A20 pinout.

As for how it works, turbogixxer explained very well on the functions of it. Basically, the solenoid opens up for excessive vacuum and gas fumes into the EVAP canister (mounted at the firewall) to reduce emissions and help the earth out.