jdm92_accorn

64mm tb and skunk2 pro h22 intake manifold. The reason for the 300psi cylinder pressure is the cam was way to small for that high of compression. If you had a level 3 bisi cam it would have survived. The ringland could not take the cylinder pressure. The timing also was very conservative aswell, I'd imagine, due to high cylinder pressures. If you did add timing cylinder temp, pressure and detonation would soon occur. This is why my build was successful, I used the proper compression for the cam I am running. the pin offset of the k20 pistons are fine when turned where the valve reliefs match the head, another mistake was using used pistons. Are those RRC pistons new or used and are you aware that those pistons will likely be 13:1 compression or higher in your engine? I would suggest being very careful to select a camshaft that will bleed off some of that compression. You don't want any more than 220-230psi cranking pressure on a street car, this I promise you. A delta 272 and bisi level 2 are best with 10:1 and I would not go higher than 10.5 or lower than 9:1. I am very glad to see you are still hard at work on the teg, keep it up.

ivan93egreppin210

im not sure you read the thread but the motor/setup was completely unknown to me. i had no idea what i was doing or what the motor would do. i built it with a bunch of "junk" laying around the shop. pistons,header, h23 intake manifold,h23 fuel rail, head. you get the point. there was no budget to even consider a bisi 2 cam let alone new pistons. dizzy, plugs were out of the used /junk wire bin. i found the dizzy by chance just looking for one that didnt have external coil. who knew the obd1 nonvtec dizzy would bolt right up? not me. the 272 cam was the only thing i spent money on. best $98 i ever spent. my motor made good power for what it was. i destroyed every allmotor setup i ran except for an h2b 1500lb crx and an h23 h2b hatch with boltons. also my motor never failed. it was experiencing blow by from dirt/dust getting sucked into intake. i no longer had ring seal. the motor still put down 175hp 154 tq on a dynopack the week before. i dont know how you came to the conclusion my ringlands were cracked or that i was running very conservative timing? you are aware the k series pistons can handle good amounts of boost. i doubt my cr was high enough to even come close to cracking a ringland. and i am aware of the static cr of the rrc pistons. thats why i purchased them. i just mentioned i was putting a cam in it. im looking for 250+hp and 180tq. i get the feeling you didnt read the thread. if you did, thanks. if you didnt i suggest you read all 10 pages. lots of good tech talk in it.

jdm92_accorn

i have read the whole article, the lack of torque your produce with the compression and bore/stroke of the engine on e85 and through a b-series trans at that ,which easily is 5% less parasitic drivetrain loss, is how i determined that the ingition timing was conservative. restrictions on intake or exhaust would have showed up as low peak hp not as much low torque and the fact that compression went from 300psi to 180psi and 130psi on a few means the rings had to fail quite badly, in my experience rings dont fail that bad without a failed ringland whether it be a small crack or a huge chunk of piston missing. im not knocking you for throwing spare parts together to have some fun with. if you had waited im sure you could have found used running f23 cheap, swapped your head and made over 200whp and still be driving it today. the experimenting is great, ive had many failures trying new endeavors to make more power. i think you'll do fine with the RRC pistons, you just need to make sure you get the proper camshaft for the compression. this chart is a good reference. you can go half a point up or down but anything more will cause you nothing but problems. ex good compression ratio for my cam (.415"/.391" 217*/222*) would be around 9.8:1 judging by the chart. my current compression is 9.7:1 so i can run an aggressive ignition curve which produces good power and torque. it's not recommended to go below 9.3:1 or above 10.3:1. now would 9:1 hurt it, no but it would be a little sluggish down low. would 10.5:1 hurt anything, no but the difference in power wouldn't be noticed between 10.3 and 10.5, but it's a hell of alot easier to find 10.5:1 pistons, lol. also @.040" duration is very similar to @.050", enough to determine the camshaft you want. if you do plan to go with a bisimoto level 3 i recommend, for the money, checking out DDtechcams.com derek and danny have been very helpful and will be making the cam for my 11.5:1 tsx piston build. i'll be looking to build 240-250whp and 180wtq range aswell, only difference is i got to make it happen with a T2W4 with a 4.64FD. good luck with the build, i look forward to the results.

unuselectus

Still a great thread. Has anything else on this build been solidified? I'm very interested to try this still.

Ceedee5

hey sorry for re flaming an old thread, but I am in process right now like right this second in build a f series f23a with k20a2 pistons but when i got to tighten the rod bolts the crankshaft will be stuck and wont turn over.. i am stumped, i did use acl race rod bearings that have a .25 marking on the box buy i thought its standard size rod bearings.. but that shouldn't be affecting the crank from getting stuck when fully torque down the rod bolts right?? I did install the pistons reverse like everyone has said to do. I installed the rods to pistons the same way as usual if 8nstalling f23 pistons on f23 rods.. I would assume the reverse will come in play when you go to install the piston right? Not reversing the rod while connecting them to the piston with the wrist pin no?? Sorry for all the questions also and I just have done countless hours of research but nobody has ever done a step by step k20 piston install on f23 block. But if you can help me that would be great and I would be in debt to you. Thanks

JRCivic1

"Ten over" bearings will NOT fit in a standard sized rod with a stock spec rod journal on the crankshaft. This is likely why your are locking up the crank when torquing down the rod caps.

Ceedee5

thanks for the reply brotha! Sorry for the late reply brotha! 😆 but Ive gotten it all figured out.. I was using oversized bearings and got the right size on and it spun freely, but I've been through 2 and now my third engine im building.. that f23a block with k20a2 shelf pistons didn't last but a week.. lol.. I was using a stock f22b1 ecu for one.. and it was my first time building a engine from top to bottom.. so I had my rods facing towards the intake side instead of exhaust side with the tangs.. I had oil pressure loss then I took it apart and all of the ringlands on all pistons were in the bottom of the oil pan... 😆 I'm not sure what caused this.. but the bearings were a bit worn out as well.. might of been too much compression or what ever.. but I rebuilt the block with f23a jdm spec pistons that have a slight higher compression than usdm ones.. not much but perfect for boost.. and put a stock f22a1 head on it and tuned it this time myself on 8lbs of boost. It ran really well for a car I built myself and tuned myself, not knowing what the hell I was doing.. 😆 🤣 I drove it for about 7 months but it always hd a oil leak well a couple of them.. and I decided to take it out and rebuild it again.. but I've gotten my hand on a fresh f23a1 block with brand new bearings that were color matched and measured.. the crank turns over by just breathing on it.. 😆 so the clearance is lovely!.. I'm thinking about using j35 or j32 pistons for a comp bump but I don't want to hit over 11.5:1 or keep it in the 10s and use this delta 272 I have already.. I've read jdm92_accorn posts day and night and follow his YouTube page. I love his build and he's done so well with the f22a head and stock f23a bottom end.. id like to just put new pistons in since I have the block already torn apart and a fresh hone on all the cylinder walls looking brand new with great cross hatching at 45 degree angles 👌 I would really like to break 200whp.. thats my ultimate goal.. but my chassis is heavy as ****.. going in a 95 accord ex cd5 sedan... was a auto but I've manual swapped it myself with a m2f4 I scorde from a junk accord I bought for 120 dollars! A whole car and whole manual swap i got lucky on.. 😆 I didn't know anything about f series and h series coming from a k series background.. but once I got on the highway and noticed it was at 3300 around 60mph.. I was like hmm seems kinda high.. but I looked it up and its a prelude si h23a1 non vtec trans... go figure 😆 I know its not the best trans.. but its what I have to work with.. if I can get 200whp and torque that will help pull this heavy *** boat to the finish line, it would make me happy. Plus, it seems like everyone on the road loves to pull up on a old 95 accord and test the waters.. no matter what type of car they have.. they know they'll have a 90 percent chance of gapping it 🤣 so it'll be fun to get some good reactions from time to time with a single cam.

lioneljdm2c

i have a ek hatch with H23a/gsr/4piston head/skunk 2 intake/1320 hood dump exhaust. i just bought a f23a engine. if i am wanting to run boost, which block would you start with?

JRCivic1

JDM H23A VTEC engine in the car now ??? If so, use that. It is a way better choice than the F23A engine.

Chance EG

H23's are God's gift of displacement to 90s Hondas.

Would not hesitate to use that, love those engines.

lioneljdm2c

@JRCivic1 Okay fair enough, i just watch a ton of utube videos and came across one stating the crank casing and the closed deck is better for boosted cars on the F23A. The reason why i bought it and was going to get hbeam rods and k20 pistons then use my (4piston) H head with different valves and cam.
Thank you, i will keep the F block for backup an spend my money on the H23A.

Chance EG

H head on an F engine is asking for problems because the oil galleys and water passages won't line up properly. Those "G" series engines are neat but a reliability nightmare to say the least.

If you can, invest in sleeves for your H23 and never look back.

Ceedee5

hey bro, if you have a h23a vtec in the car now, I would build that for all motor, or you can do mid compression turbo build with that, and not go through the hassle of doing a engine swap.. but I would choose the f23a best for boost, the compression is 9.8:1 and that engine loves boost.. it has stock iron sleeves already as well,, so if you wanted to just throw a turbo on it and run 10 to 15 pounds, it can be done easy. Even without arp headstuds. I would get arp, just to make sure the head doesn't lift, but if your after low boost and mild power, you'll be okay. I'm running a f23a1 block with f22a1 head, just to make my tuning easier for me. I run 10 lbs for a daily with no issues at all, I make sure to keep a eye on my ect and air intake Temps, and of course I'm always messing with my tune when I drive everyday, I run on honda tuning suite and just adjust my air fuel ratios as needed from summer to winter.. other than that, its a solid platform for first time boosters 👌 once I feel 100 percent comfortable with my tuning capabilities, ill buy a 3 bar map sensor and turn up my boost to 15 lbs daily, I almost have my timing maps down, thats the only thing that is hard for me.. is tuning or setting the degrees of timing without over doing it and cause knock.. without a dyno, it can be hard.. but yeah, you have a good setup already? I wouldn't even boost. If I had a 4 piston head on my block.. you should have plenty of power with a h23a and gsr transmission along with a 4 piston head...

Ceedee5

bro, I know this is a old post.. but can you tell me real quick, if the euro R intake manifold fit f22a1 heads like yours with no modifications? Or did you need a adapter plate?thanks bro in advance.

lioneljdm2c

@Ceedee5 Thank you for some inspiration! guess i just need to install the fueltech setup and get rid of crome out my hatch to get a good tune down for better E.T.'s I just bought this hatch a couple months ago, I do also need to tare it open and find out what pistons and rods i am running......maybe it could be as simple as pistons or a better intake (skunk2 now) and injectors to make this motor come alive. I feel the motor (H23A) is solid for sure but it also feels that i am lacking something. You said it best, Tune, Tune and Tune!