pinoyrukus

Aite guys like the title says what spring rates are recommended for my Rear to run a Type R 22mm sway so i don't damage my subframe.

Car : 1993 Civic Si

My Current setup is :

GC coilovers with integ rates 380 front / 250 Rear
Tc Sportline rear lcas
Kyb Agx Shocks/struts
** stock front sway bar 14mm i believe, i forgot to put this LOL**

Want to use (i already have all the hardware except for the beaks stuff still got to order it) :

Rear Type R sway 22mm
Beaks SRK
Beaks Lower Tie Bar
Energy Suspension Sway Bar Mounting Bushings

Oh and this is for a Daily Driver i want to try out AutoX/solo2 but i don't want the ride to be too harsh/bouncy cause i do drive this to work, school, and etc.

i was thinking in the lines of 400lbs for the rear, What you guys think???

photo of my setup below




Modified by pinoyrukus at 8:28 PM 12/18/2004


Modified by pinoyrukus at 12:22 AM 12/19/2004

Kyles ej1

wheres your muffler?

smart monkey

I like anywhere from 300-450 for a street car. given I live in san francisco where roads are messed up.

00Red_SiR

your spring rates are fine the way they are for that bar. You should have a decent ride and a car that will handle with those rates. Some people have had trouble with tearing out their rear subframes but I personally haven't had any trouble and my car is daily driven on less than decent roads. Spring rate requirements have more to do with driver preference and track conditions, than a "set standard" for a given setup.

ewaugh

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by smart monkey &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I like anywhere from 300-450 for a street car. given I live in san francisco where roads are messed up.</TD></TR></TABLE>

So are 450/500 to stiff for a dailyused for autox and ocasional DE's and track days with solo I in the future?

pinoyrukus

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by egcoupe &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">wheres your muffler?</TD></TR></TABLE>

Uhhh.... WTH are you thinking about my muffler? LOL im thinking about my suspension here buddy. I took it off so i could get a better photo of the lcas, shocks, and coils. KEEP IT ON THE SUBJECT PLEASE!!!

pinoyrukus

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 00Red_SiR &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">your spring rates are fine the way they are for that bar. You should have a decent ride and a car that will handle with those rates. Some people have had trouble with tearing out their rear subframes but I personally haven't had any trouble and my car is daily driven on less than decent roads. Spring rate requirements have more to do with driver preference and track conditions, than a "set standard" for a given setup.</TD></TR></TABLE>

oic.... thanks for your input but i heard that you have to run a higher spring rate in the rear so that you sway bar ain't working as much or something like that . =T What setup are you running??? and how big is your sway??

pinoyrukus

hmmmm..... i'll prolly try the autocross section o_O

StErN

iTrader: (1)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by pinoyrukus &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Aite guys like the title says what spring rates are recommended for my Rear to run a Type R 22mm sway so i don't damage my subframe.</TD></TR></TABLE>
I think that you would be good with your setup, just switch the front and back springs to create more overstear. You want to achieve equalness between both your sway bar and your coilovers. Most people who have problems tearing their subframes have a sway bar that is over powering their coilovers, so it is putting more stress on the subframe.

I have 400lbs in the rear and 305lbs in the front on koni yellows daily driven and my car rides good.

Tad

from what I've been told(by knowledgeable ppl),
to protect your subframe, you're going to want at least like 400lbs in the rear.

Eee Pee

The way it works is, as you increase the rear spring rate, the less work the bar does.
Don't tune the handling of your car with the rear bar, set it up with spring rate.
The bars are for fine tuning, not making radical changes.

Point being, the less the rear bar has to work, the less chance of a subframe tearout.

Anyways, I haven't had any problem with 400 lbs and I beat the snot out of my car at the Autocross.
400 lbs is going to be kinda rough on the street though.

pinoyrukus

oic thanks for the info guys

oh and i was also wondering would it matter if i already have a stock front sway (14 mm i believe)

Eee Pee

Would what matter?

The front bar will add some front wheel rate. As will the rear bar.

pinoyrukus

would it matter if i had one on there?? cuz i heard its better not to run one in the front, but keep a rear one. **** i dunno LOL

pinoyrukus

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by StErN &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
I think that you would be good with your setup, just switch the front and back springs to create more overstear. You want to achieve equalness between both your sway bar and your coilovers. Most people who have problems tearing their subframes have a sway bar that is over powering their coilovers, so it is putting more stress on the subframe.

I have 400lbs in the rear and 305lbs in the front on koni yellows daily driven and my car rides good. </TD></TR></TABLE>

should i do what he said and switch the springs??? or just get some from Eibach or ground control or whatever

Evs-One

run with the springs as is, then go from there

Too much understeer, then up the rates in the rear. Different driving styles= different setups

Eee Pee

If you can't make these decisions yourself, just go out there and learn to drive the car.

No offense.

pinoyrukus

oic .... but why do people say your going to damage your subframe or rip it if you run too low of spring rates in the rear? wouldn't the Type r 22mm rear be too big for me to run with my setup??

pinoyrukus

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Eee Pee &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">If you can't make these decisions yourself, just go out there and learn to drive the car.

No offense.</TD></TR></TABLE>

LOL, i could make decisions i just don't want to go out and slap that bar on and all of a sudden i have no car to drive cuz of my subframe. I love my setup right now feels good just want to slap my sway bar on already

00Red_SiR

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by pinoyrukus &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

oic.... thanks for your input but i heard that you have to run a higher spring rate in the rear so that you sway bar ain't working as much or something like that . =T What setup are you running??? and how big is your sway??</TD></TR></TABLE>

My rear bar is 3/4" in diameter and I'm running Suspension Techniques lowering springs 1.3" drop. My experience with rear subframe tearing problems has generally been linked to improper or poor installation. It certainly doesn't happen to everyone and there are lots of people running rear bars on the back of their Civics. IMHO I don't believe it's specifically linked to spring rates although unlike some other people on here who feel you need stiffer rates to keep from tearing the sub frame I feel that higher spring rates may actually contribute to the problem because it transmits more shock through the frame than a softer sprung car would.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Eee Pee &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">The way it works is, as you increase the rear spring rate, the less work the bar does.
Don't tune the handling of your car with the rear bar, set it up with spring rate.
The bars are for fine tuning, not making radical changes.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

This isn't a good thing to do for a street driven car because the stiff springs will make the car ride and handle worse over rough surfaces. Swaybars effectively increase the spring rates without any trade-off in ride quality.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by StErN &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
I think that you would be good with your setup, just switch the front and back springs to create more overstear. </TD></TR></TABLE>

This would just be a bad idea for so many reasons...

pinoyrukus

aite koo thanks guys

imma just order the beaks kit and slap it on , if it messes up den i'll prolly get a new subframe LOL.

i was thinking what if i coat my subframe with some Line-X http://www.goline-x.com/prodinfo.asp , that ***** practically bullet proof also used by the government , and my dads friend owns the shop so its pratically for free HAHAA

actually that **** is bomb proof LOL http://www.paxcon.com/home.shtml "the Line-X paint is flexible yet stronger than steel" quote from that site



Modified by pinoyrukus at 3:16 PM 12/19/2004

x4Banginx

Get the Beaks subframe reinforcement kit and you will be fine...

StErN

iTrader: (1)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by StErN &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
I think that you would be good with your setup, just switch the front and back springs to create more overstear. You want to achieve equalness between both your sway bar and your coilovers. Most people who have problems tearing their subframes have a sway bar that is over powering their coilovers, so it is putting more stress on the subframe.</TD></TR></TABLE>

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 00Red_SiR &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">This would just be a bad idea for so many reasons... </TD></TR></TABLE>

And these many reasons would be? If his fronts and rears are equal in length and pitch, then he could technically switch them. He wouldn't want to necessarily keep those specific rates. Switching the stiffer springs to the back would better the way his car rotates. Hondas have understeer stock wise, stiffening the rear end is going to compensate for this and make the car more neutral or even have a little bit of oversteer, which some people prefer and others don't.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by pinoyrukus &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
should i do what he said and switch the springs??? or just get some from Eibach or ground control or whatever</TD></TR></TABLE>

I would first get the beaks kit, put on the sway and then see how your car handles. If you don't like it from there, then try switching the spring rates etc. to achieve what you want.

pinoyrukus

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by StErN &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
I would first get the beaks kit, put on the sway and then see how your car handles. If you don't like it from there, then try switching the spring rates etc. to achieve what you want. </TD></TR></TABLE>

welp thats the advice i freaking needed LOL that sounds the most logical , imma order the beaks and see if i like they way it handles and if i don't like it i'll just up the rates to make it better . thanks

22mm itr bar here we come !!! hahaahhaa

x4Banginx

Werd to the wise, my Beaks kit is on backorder until the first week of January, so you might try Inline-Four and see if they have any in stock.