grandtheftlunchbox

Anyone have any suggestions for a rear sway bar? I did my suspension recently but I still have more oversteer than what I'd like, so I'm thinking I should add a rear sway bar. Would an OEM sway bar reduce this oversteer enough, or would it have a negligible effect? I can't afford an ST sway bar kit so does anyone have any other suggestions?

davefromPA

you have too much oversteer?? as in the back end wont stay planted? or understeer as in you cant turn fast enough cause the front is sliding?

grandtheftlunchbox

Yep, the car came factory with no rear sway bar, so the back end likes to swing around a little bit when I corner hard. Just wondering if an OEM sway bar would do enough to correct this, or if I would have to go aftermarket. I'm debating over just saving for an ST sway bar kit. Not sure yet though.

davefromPA

what suspension did you install? if you bought one with adjustable shocks, turn the dial a little stiffer in the rear. and if you have just a little bit of oversteer you should get a stock bar.

alphalanos

I think you mean you have too much understeer. Adding a rear bar will reduce understeer.

davefromPA

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by alphalanos &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I think you mean you have too much understeer. Adding a rear bar will reduce understeer. </TD></TR></TABLE>

thats why i asked him with a description of understeer. his problem is the back end sliding when braking hard.

get stickier tires in the rear or up the rate a bit on your shocks.

grandtheftlunchbox

Well, its a street setup and the rears are not adjustable, they are Tokico blues. I was under the impression that a rear sway bar would reduce oversteer (which means lack of traction in the rear, or so I thought...) by reducing body roll in the rear. I think I'll try adding a stock bar and see what happens from there. Thanks guys.

Mashimaro

iTrader: (1)

adding a rear sway bar will help your problem out.

however, i think you should at least get the ITR sized rear as the other OEM ones are quite dinky in size and probably won't do much.

a cheap alternative could be a Blox 21mm sway bar. i have an old Skunk2 21 mm sway bar (which i'm sure is the same **** as the blox) and i find it helps me rotate the car on track better. just my opinion of course

gizzerhatch

if you add a rear sway bar you will increase oversteer and decrease understeer.

gizzerhatch

do you have a front sway bar?

95vxtealhatch

you have no idea what your talking about. stock civics don't have oversteer.even stock civics with sway bars don't oversteer. Learn how to drive or correctly identifity your problem. Your probly feeling worn bushings.

Matt.D87

from what iv read you've got your oversteer and understeer mixed up. Your probably witnessing understeer so yes a rear sway bar will help but if you get ones thats thinker than 15mm its best to get some form of chassis bracing like the ASR brace

grandtheftlunchbox

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 95vxtealhatch &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">you have no idea what your talking about. stock civics don't have oversteer.even stock civics with sway bars don't oversteer. Learn how to drive or correctly identifity your problem. Your probly feeling worn bushings.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Wow, way to be a dick man. We're all in here to learn a thing or two, not make asses out of each other. My struts and springs are NOT stock to clarify. None of my bushings are worn, I checked them when I changed my oil last time. ANYWAYS. I picked up a rear sway bar, itll be here in a few days.

Now, here's the definition of oversteer: Oversteer is a phenomenon that can occur in an automobile which is attempting to turn. The car is said to oversteer when the rear wheels do not track behind the front wheels but instead slide out toward the outside of the turn. Oversteer can throw the car into a spin. The effect is opposite to that of understeer.

From what I understand, a rear sway bar helps disperse the downward forces on the rear suspension in a turn, keeping the wheel towards the inside of the turn planted on the pavement, which will increase traction. It also (obviously) reduces body roll (which COULD be what I'm feeling. I guess we'll see).

Scott.

iTrader: (1)

ctr rear sway bar..FTW

fatpride111

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by grandtheftlunchbox &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Wow, way to be a dick man. We're all in here to learn a thing or two, not make asses out of each other. My struts and springs are NOT stock to clarify. None of my bushings are worn, I checked them when I changed my oil last time. ANYWAYS. I picked up a rear sway bar, itll be here in a few days.

Now, here's the definition of oversteer: Oversteer is a phenomenon that can occur in an automobile which is attempting to turn. The car is said to oversteer when the rear wheels do not track behind the front wheels but instead slide out toward the outside of the turn. Oversteer can throw the car into a spin. The effect is opposite to that of understeer.

From what I understand, a rear sway bar helps disperse the downward forces on the rear suspension in a turn, keeping the wheel towards the inside of the turn planted on the pavement, which will increase traction. It also (obviously) reduces body roll (which COULD be what I'm feeling. I guess we'll see).</TD></TR></TABLE>
i would think that you would have under steer seeing how its a FWD unless your front spring rates are WAY lower than your rear.

if thats the case, then you needa lower your rear spring rate, and raise the front, that'll give the rear more traction, but induce bad understeer. i would know. i have 450F/380R, and my understeer is a bitch. in that case, your best bet is going with a ITR, or thicker sway bar in the back to help combat the understeer.

if youre set up is Stiffer in the rear, then i'd imagine you can only take turns so fast before your suspension travel gives out, and sends you spinning out of control. ive never messed with anything like that set up (if thats the case), but to my best knowledge, id say something like gsr swaybar rear, and some THICK aftermarket up front. but i'd do more research if i were you.

with that said... got any pics of your Impy, or caprice?

my brother has a fully built LT1 impala ss, pm me some pictures of yours. im facinated with these led sleds

Matt.D87

It is very unusual for you to be witnessing oversteer in a FWD car.
Its most like what 'fatpride111' said and that your rear spring rates are a lot higher than the front.

If you fit just a rear sway bar, like you said you will get more traction but it will make the rear alot stiffer and induce more oversteer lol

If you do have very stiff springs at the back a itr or ctr sway bar will not make much of a difference as the suspension movement is minimal compaired to the spring settings on the itr/ctr

grandtheftlunchbox

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by fatpride111 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
with that said... got any pics of your Impy, or caprice?

my brother has a fully built LT1 impala ss, pm me some pictures of yours. im facinated with these led sleds </TD></TR></TABLE>

I'm starting to wonder if maybe the "understeer" I'm feeling might be related to chassis flex too. I don't have any tie bars (yet) and I think it might be a combination of that + no sway bar(?). I guess we'll find out.

I do have pics of both cars, but they're on my mom's computer from when I lived at home. The Impala was completely stock and in MINT condition with 50K miles, and the Caprice was a tank that just fell apart the more I drove it haha. I'll get pics next time I'm at home though, if I remember.

DrewMD

iTrader: (1)

I recommend finding out what rates came with your coilover kit, and which rates you put in the front and in the back. This could be the answer to your problems.

Stiffer rates should be in the front to induce less oversteer.

fatpride111

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by DrewMD &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I recommend finding out what rates came with your coilover kit, and which rates you put in the front and in the back. This could be the answer to your problems.

Stiffer rates should be in the front to induce less oversteer.</TD></TR></TABLE>
x2. let us know your spring rates and we can give you more detailed help.

alphalanos

Stiffer rear rates keep the front from lifting, but also having a front bar (stock is fine) will keep the front from rolling. You are correct that a larger rear bar (CTR 22mm is a great choice) will make the back slide first which is desireable. Youll have to play with stiffness of your dampers to get what you want. Get a rear sway bar and a brace (ASR is good) Then see how it feels, change the stiffness in small increments until you get something you like. Also check your tire pressures. Chassis flex is an issue but not nearly as much as having a good suspension setup. I think front and rear strut bars are plenty for a street car. Good luck.

drave

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">thinker than 15mm its best to get some form of chassis bracing like the ASR brace</TD></TR></TABLE>
Why is that? I know that you need it for anything over 14mm, but nobody ever told me why. Can someone enlighten me?

Matt.D87

sure

I was mainly refering to fitting a 22mm anti roll bar as I dont know of any other bars that are available between the EK4's 15mm and the EK9's 22mm.

The EK9 has a chassis bar between the rear LCA's which allows it to have a 22mm anti roll bar.

If you where to fit the same size bar into your EK4 you are at risk of having the bar being ripped off the chassis during hard cornering. A brace will help reinforce the chassis and stop it being ripped off like the chassis bar the EK9 has

AutoXer

To cut the clutter, the condition you're describing (back end kicking out) is oversteer, not understeer.

Oversteer is impossible to have in all conditions in a FWD car, so if that's what you're experiencing there is something wrong.

Adding a swaybar can increase traction in certain conditions, but will stiffen the rear and increase rotation and oversteer as stated above.

I went from bad understeer to stiff springs and swaybar in the rear, and the car would spin on a dime at the track. Not a good setup for the streets.

thedanny88

do you have drum brakes in the back? if so they might be locking up during hard turns and the back end slides out(oversteer).