Dekorum

If I pick up a pair of used complete Integra (non ABS) front knuckles what are the chances that the calipers are seized/no good with fried pistons? Also, I have a 92 Si with factory rear brakes so do I need a new 40/40 proportioning valve from the Integra just because of the new front brakes? I know I am going to be getting the 91 EX 4 door MC so I can use my booster.

The setups I am looking at include lower control arms, are they the same exact as the Civic ones?

94EG8

You need the 4040 prop valve from a '90 - '97 Integra non abs (if using one from a '90 - '93 you'll need to reuse the civic mounting bracket). The '92 - '93 Si's had a 3040 prop valve. As far as the condition of the calipers? If they sat outside for a long time unused they may be seized. LCAs are basically Identical to the Civic EX/Si LCAs but they have a different part number for some reason, you can use either though.

Dekorum

Ah! Thanks a lot dude! Is there any way that I could tell the condition of the calipers before buying them if they are not on a car?

and about the '91 EX 4 door MC, is it worth it to try to look for a used one or just go for a new oem one?

94EG8

Take a large C clamp with you and see if the piston will go back into the caliper.

They're pretty rare, it's not all that likely you'll find a used one at all. Even if you did it certainly wouldn't hurt to buy new seeing as how old they're getting.

Dekorum

Oh ok, good idea.

Also, how come the part number to OEM Integra and 92-95 Civic front pads are the same? I though the Integra's used bigger rotors AND calipers so the pad should be bigger as well..

94EG8

The do and they are. '92 - '95 Civic EXs use the same larger rotors and pads though (calipers are similar but use a smaller piston than the integra. All other models (except for the '94 Si ABS (and maybe the '95 Si) used small front brakes.

Dekorum

Oh what the hell, so the 93 EX had bigger and better brakes than the 93 Si? That's retarded.

Deetz

i bet the EX weighed more

Dekorum

Thats probably correct.. I just never realized that some Civics had bigger brakes than Si's. There is almost no incentive to upgrade your front brakes if you have a 93-95 EX or a 94 Si ABS.. And are the rear brakes identical on Integras and 92-95 Civic Si/EX?

94EG8

Yes. I'm not sure what the thought was there, but the Si hatches were definitely lacking in terms of front brakes.

It had more to do with the ABS than vehicle weight I think, if you got a '92 - '95 LX with ABS it had bigger EX front brakes, the same car without ABS had small front brakes. Non ABS EX coupes did still get larger front brakes though (and larger rear drums than the hatchbacks)

Yes.

Dekorum

Ok great, thanks a lot. One more question: in your opinion do you think I should get OEM Honda pads for the front and rear or for the same price get Axxis Ultimate pads? I just do street driving and only occasional drag strip runs. (ITR motor in hatch)

94EG8

Never ran axxis pads. I have run OEM Honda though, they last forever and they're quiet. Seem to work well.

Dekorum

Honda OEM pads will probably be the way I go.

Also I am wondering how big of a difference I will see from Integra front brakes and stock MC/proportioning valve vs. Integra brakes with the 91 EX MC/4040 valve?
And is it possible to use a 99-00 Si 40/40 valve? I can get one of those pretty cheap right now, but I was thinking that keeping my 30/40 valve wouldn't show much of a difference in braking performance

grumblemarc

iTrader: (4)

Axxis sucks. Akebono performs well and less brake dust than stock pads.

94EG8

Stock prop valve is gonna put more bias to either the front or rear, most likely the rear but I really don't know, I always swapped everything together. It should work better though.

No. They're a competely different design, the lines don't fit without some pretty extreme bending and flaring, btw the '96 - '00 hatchbacks and HX/DX coupes all used the same prop valve as the '99 - '00 Si.

Akebono in all likelyhood makes some of Honda's OEM pads seeing as how they manufacture some calipers for Honda (most of Honda's pads and calipers are made by Nissin, but not all)

Dekorum

You answered about keeping the stock prop valve, but what about keeping the stock MC versus the 91 EX MC. How much difference will there really be?

94EG8

Using the stock MC the pedal will travel further, IE end up closer to the floor when applying the brakes, but I'm not sure just how much closer to the floor it's going to be.

Dekorum

Man, I am finally getting the parts together and I cannot seem to find a non ABS front knuckle setup. All the 94-01 Integras I see in the junkyard have ABS. Should I just get the ABS one? I know you can just unbolt the ABS line and sensor but you will have those few empty bolt holes, and is that it?

Also, the 30/40 prop valve that I have might actually work better because the rear bias will be needed with new more powerful front brakes. If not, I will have to find a 40/40 if I don't like how this one feels, but I definitely won't be able to find one in the junkyards around here. Clearly since I can't find the non ABS front knuckles I can't find a 40/40 prop valve.

Dekorum

Ok I found and bought a pair of non ABS Integra knuckles. The ball joint boots are ripped and ugly, but appear to move around fine. Should I spend the $50+ per side and replace the ball joints or just the boot and take my chances with the ball joints?

Two other related questions: 1) I am going to be keeping my 30/40 prop valve for a while and using the 91 EX master cylinder on my stock brake booster. I noticed I have some rust on my booster under my current MC, what are the chances of my actual brake booster being bad? And what exactly goes bad on them?

2) I noticed that the bottom of one of the Integra knuckles' dust shields (behind the rotor) is a little smashed probably from being put on the ground too hard. I am thinking of removing both so it looks cleaner and not dented up, but can any body comment on the performance or safety differences I will see? From my understanding it prevents water and dirt from hitting the back of the rotor but I don't know if this actually makes a difference for anything.

94EG8

Front knuckles and calipers really don't matter.

No. You're still going to have rear brakes that lock up first.

I'd probably just replace them. Buy genuine Honda, they'll probably outlast the car.

That rust is pretty common. Comes from the MC leaking a little brake fluid over the years on the paint. If the booster is bad you'll generally have a rock hard brake pedal.

It's really not a big deal, those dust shields rotted off most of the civics and integras around here years ago from the salt. It does keep cold water from hitting hot rotors and warping them though and it does aid somewhat in cooling. They're about $25 each from majestic honda IIRC.

Dekorum

So with both the 30/40 and the 40/40 the rear brakes will lock up first?

I always buy nothing but genuine Honda. If they will outlast the car then maybe these ball joints are still fairly good and the boot should just be replaced? I am just trying to save around $150 from buying two ball joints and the labor for getting the ball joints pressed in.

Ok, then my booster should still be good. How often do they go bad? I am fairly sure mine is original from 92 so they must last forever?

Yeah they are $25 but I would only buy a new one if I really benefited from keeping them on. I am thinking of just removing them more and more. I mean, cold water will warp the hot rotor if water hits the front of the rotor or the back, so I don't think the shield will prevent that. I wonder how much they actually aid in cooling; that is important. Have you been driving with yours off?

94EG8

No, with the 4040 they'll more or less lock up at the same time.

If there's no play, and you can rotote the stud smoothly, no binding or catching, no dry looking rust etc then the joint is ok. Check them over very well.

I've never had to change one, they almost never go bad.

Mine rotted off, left them that way for a long time. Finally replaced them a couple of years ago. I really don't think they make at that much difference though. That said you should be able to just straighten out that bent one.

Dekorum

Ok, I think I am going to get new balljoints just in case. I already have year old outer tie rod balljoints and upper control arm balljoints so I may as well have new lower balljoints to go with that.

I can't seem to find a 40/40 prop valve any where local. I have to get this within a few days =/. How many 94-97 RS Integras have been parted out? Haha, sucks that they can only be from that one model which is non ABS. Does anyone on the forums sell them?

scubasteve_91ef

OK, Guys I'm running into a similar problem... I have a 1990 CRX and doing a Disc brake conversion. I'm using 93 Integra DA front knuckles and Rear trail arms. I decided to go with a Big Brake upgrade kit form "Wilwood" front and rear. 11" rotors 4 piston caliper in the Front and single piston caliper in the rear. "What would be the best way to go with the MC and proportion" By searching it out... I was told to go with 90-93 integra non-ABS....MC and 40/40 proportional valve. Does this seem about right to anyone out there that has done this change over.

Dekorum

Bringing this thread back from the dead... It seems that after 6 years since doing the front brake swap, my stock 30/40 prop valve is going bad. It looks like it has been leaking, and this would explain the loss of fluid in my reservoir (brake pad are still good and thick).

Two questions...
1) Do you think my 30/40 prop valve started leaking due to the swap or just a typical problem with aging (25 years old)?
2) Does anyone happen to have a 40/40 from a 94-97 Integra non-ABS? It seems that the part 46210-ST7-003 is unfortunately discontinued, and I would like get a new one if possible.