problem with my 2000 turbo si
07-04-2006, 05:16 AM
#1
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problem with my 2000 turbo si
ok, so i have a basically stock motor 2000 civic si with a custom turbo kit pushing 7-8 psi tuned on uberdata. the car has 62,000 miles, and the turbo kit has been on for the past 3000 miles.
i was driving home the other day from work and all of a sudden it started smoking realllly bad. at first when you would get on the throttle it would blow mostly white smoke then gradually change over to blue. my first thought was headgasket cause it has been using coolant and oil. BUT the thing is, alot of the smoke is coming out of my valve cover breather filter, alot of smoke. my question is, wth can that be? my pistons are fine i think, they look great, and there arent any scratchs in the cylender walls, and a very very minute amount of play of the piston inside the cylender walls, 2, 3, and 4 have no play, and number 1 moves from left to right about 1/64 of an inch.
so what can cause oil and coolant smoke to blow out the valve cover? could it all just be the headgasket or can something else be wrong too?
i was driving home the other day from work and all of a sudden it started smoking realllly bad. at first when you would get on the throttle it would blow mostly white smoke then gradually change over to blue. my first thought was headgasket cause it has been using coolant and oil. BUT the thing is, alot of the smoke is coming out of my valve cover breather filter, alot of smoke. my question is, wth can that be? my pistons are fine i think, they look great, and there arent any scratchs in the cylender walls, and a very very minute amount of play of the piston inside the cylender walls, 2, 3, and 4 have no play, and number 1 moves from left to right about 1/64 of an inch.
so what can cause oil and coolant smoke to blow out the valve cover? could it all just be the headgasket or can something else be wrong too?
07-04-2006, 07:21 AM
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nope, but the car felt way slower, so im assuming the compression is down, my buddy thats a mechanic told me its the headgasket, so like a moron instead of doin a leakdown i just tore it all apart, now ive been doin some research on here and it sounds to me like i might have some bad rings or broken ringlands. thing is, a bad headgasket doesnt explain the smoke from the valve cover, and its a lot of smoke, so im getting bad blowby, which means rings, my cylender walls are perfect, but i guess that doesnt matter much
07-04-2006, 07:34 AM
#4
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Most likely your Ringlands are cracked = your rings are shot and u need new pistons and rings.. and its possibly leaking into your valve cover because of bad valve seals
07-04-2006, 07:49 AM
#5
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Re: (maxum17ft)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by maxum17ft »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">nope, but the car felt way slower, so im assuming the compression is down, my buddy thats a mechanic told me its the headgasket, so like a moron instead of doin a leakdown i just tore it all apart, now ive been doin some research on here and it sounds to me like i might have some bad rings or broken ringlands. thing is, a bad headgasket doesnt explain the smoke from the valve cover, and its a lot of smoke, so im getting bad blowby, which means rings, my cylender walls are perfect, but i guess that doesnt matter much</TD></TR></TABLE>
IF you have the head off, pop the pistons out. If it's as bad as you say it'll be obvious.
IF you have the head off, pop the pistons out. If it's as bad as you say it'll be obvious.
07-04-2006, 08:00 AM
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Re: (JDMlyfestyle)
ok, thats what i thought, well, if i werent in debt enough, now i will be more so.
whats the cheapest/best solution here if i plan on running up to 10psi in the future?
i said i had the head off, i think, well, anyways, the head is off, and i have the full honda service manual, so i guess now i get to pull it apart some more, yay
.
o, if anything, its worse than what im saying, i stopped at an intersection on the way home and the entire intersection was filled with smoke after i was sitting there only like 25 seconds. soo much smoke is coming out the exhaust and breather filter you cant even see/breath inside the car. BUT, like i said, the block looks beautiful, but that doesnt mean the ringlands, rings, seals arent shot. guess its time to for a rebuild, dammit
whats the cheapest/best solution here if i plan on running up to 10psi in the future?
i said i had the head off, i think, well, anyways, the head is off, and i have the full honda service manual, so i guess now i get to pull it apart some more, yay
.o, if anything, its worse than what im saying, i stopped at an intersection on the way home and the entire intersection was filled with smoke after i was sitting there only like 25 seconds. soo much smoke is coming out the exhaust and breather filter you cant even see/breath inside the car. BUT, like i said, the block looks beautiful, but that doesnt mean the ringlands, rings, seals arent shot. guess its time to for a rebuild, dammit
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07-04-2006, 08:09 AM
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well, since im extremely tired and lazy, i was planning on geoin with eagle h beam rods, but whats the best bang for the buck piston that will last
07-05-2006, 12:29 PM
#14
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Re: (maxum17ft)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by maxum17ft »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">well, where would i route the pcv gasses to, the intake side of the turbo or the im where there is 8psi?</TD></TR></TABLE>
No to a Vented catch can that way you wont be building up ur crankcase pressure and that pressure goes straight to your rings
No to a Vented catch can that way you wont be building up ur crankcase pressure and that pressure goes straight to your rings
07-05-2006, 12:30 PM
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^ yup in boos tthe pcv valve closes trapping crankcase pressure giving it nowhere to go except thru your ringlands, out your oil pan gasket, or out your dipstick tube.
More often then not it goes thru the ringlands [cracking them]
More often then not it goes thru the ringlands [cracking them]
07-05-2006, 01:54 PM
#16
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Re: (turbotime)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by turbotime »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
More often then not it goes thru the ringlands [cracking them]</TD></TR></TABLE>
LOL I hope your not serious. Detonation doesn't have anything to do with it? Why wouldn't the pressure go out the vale cover vent? How much pressure are we talking about?
More often then not it goes thru the ringlands [cracking them]</TD></TR></TABLE>
LOL I hope your not serious. Detonation doesn't have anything to do with it? Why wouldn't the pressure go out the vale cover vent? How much pressure are we talking about?
07-05-2006, 02:34 PM
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Re: (Chiovnidca)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Chiovnidca »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
LOL I hope your not serious. Detonation doesn't have anything to do with it? Why wouldn't the pressure go out the vale cover vent? How much pressure are we talking about?</TD></TR></TABLE>
?? are YOU serious. Blowby gasses can lower octane leading to detonation but that is not why the ringlands crack, they crack becuase of pressure from the crankcase (bottom of the piston) not detonation (top of the piston), cracked cylinder walls are more of a detonation result.
We are talking about a good deal of pressure, that tiny hole on your valve cover wont save u for ****. Most people run 2 large lines off the back of the block and that hole of the valve cover. Prefereably the 2 block lines and 2 more -10an lines or larger coming off fittings welded to the front of the valve cover.
...
LOL I hope your not serious. Detonation doesn't have anything to do with it? Why wouldn't the pressure go out the vale cover vent? How much pressure are we talking about?</TD></TR></TABLE>
?? are YOU serious. Blowby gasses can lower octane leading to detonation but that is not why the ringlands crack, they crack becuase of pressure from the crankcase (bottom of the piston) not detonation (top of the piston), cracked cylinder walls are more of a detonation result.
We are talking about a good deal of pressure, that tiny hole on your valve cover wont save u for ****. Most people run 2 large lines off the back of the block and that hole of the valve cover. Prefereably the 2 block lines and 2 more -10an lines or larger coming off fittings welded to the front of the valve cover.
...
07-05-2006, 03:06 PM
#18
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Re: (turbotime)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by turbotime »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">?? are YOU serious. Blowby gasses can lower octane leading to detonation but that is not why the ringlands crack, they crack becuase of pressure from the crankcase (bottom of the piston) not detonation (top of the piston),</TD></TR></TABLE>
You are seriuos!!! Tell me more.
You are seriuos!!! Tell me more.
07-06-2006, 11:26 AM
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i was just running a breather filter on the valve cover, ive seen the big lines coming off the valve cover be4 but i never new what they were for and didnt know y i would want them, but i guess i learned the hard way.
07-06-2006, 01:44 PM
#23
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Re: (turbotime)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by turbotime »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">theres no more to tell lol, thats it</TD></TR></TABLE>
it's kind of incomplete. it most take alot of pressure to break the ringlands. you say it comes from the underside of the pistons? The pressure in the crancase is cthe cause? How much pressure you talking about? is it more than what's in the combustion chambers? Why do the pistons break before rubber seals blow out and leak oil?
it's kind of incomplete. it most take alot of pressure to break the ringlands. you say it comes from the underside of the pistons? The pressure in the crancase is cthe cause? How much pressure you talking about? is it more than what's in the combustion chambers? Why do the pistons break before rubber seals blow out and leak oil?
07-06-2006, 05:34 PM
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Re: (Chiovnidca)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Chiovnidca »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
it's kind of incomplete. it most take alot of pressure to break the ringlands. you say it comes from the underside of the pistons? The pressure in the crancase is cthe cause? How much pressure you talking about? is it more than what's in the combustion chambers? Why do the pistons break before rubber seals blow out and leak oil? </TD></TR></TABLE>
Im not really sure why the pistons break before say the oil pan gasket or oil dipstick shoot out. I guess ringlands arent that strong? I just know that on boosted applications there is a lot of pressure in the crankcase at high rpms/boost, enough so to easily crack ringlands... I know when I was on the dyno there was enough air coming out of my catchcan breather and valve cover breather to be seen visibly at high rpms- like a little jetstream...
Dunno the science behind why this pressure breaks the ringlands; just know it does and unless you properly vent it you can kiss them g'bye, especialy if you keep the stock pcv system which traps this pressure under boost....
it's kind of incomplete. it most take alot of pressure to break the ringlands. you say it comes from the underside of the pistons? The pressure in the crancase is cthe cause? How much pressure you talking about? is it more than what's in the combustion chambers? Why do the pistons break before rubber seals blow out and leak oil? </TD></TR></TABLE>
Im not really sure why the pistons break before say the oil pan gasket or oil dipstick shoot out. I guess ringlands arent that strong? I just know that on boosted applications there is a lot of pressure in the crankcase at high rpms/boost, enough so to easily crack ringlands... I know when I was on the dyno there was enough air coming out of my catchcan breather and valve cover breather to be seen visibly at high rpms- like a little jetstream...
Dunno the science behind why this pressure breaks the ringlands; just know it does and unless you properly vent it you can kiss them g'bye, especialy if you keep the stock pcv system which traps this pressure under boost....
07-06-2006, 06:00 PM
#25
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Re: (turbotime)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by turbotime »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Dunno the science behind why this pressure breaks the ringlands; </TD></TR></TABLE>
That's because it isn't the cause. The only pressure breaking the ring lands is from detonation in the combustion chamber.
Think about it: The rings and ringlands hold the pressure from the combustion chamber. You cant tell me there would be more pressure than that damaging them from underneath? Or can you?
Dunno the science behind why this pressure breaks the ringlands; </TD></TR></TABLE>
That's because it isn't the cause. The only pressure breaking the ring lands is from detonation in the combustion chamber.
Think about it: The rings and ringlands hold the pressure from the combustion chamber. You cant tell me there would be more pressure than that damaging them from underneath? Or can you?