Honda-Tech Balla

I am planning on doing one of the two swaps in an eg hatchback by February. I've talked to a couple swap shops, and one of the guys mentioned that the ls vtec swap would actually be better than the b16 swap because it has a bigger crank. I was wondering what you guys all think? I know most of my ****, being a honda enthusiasts, but I was just wondering what you tech's have to say about this dilema. Thanks for your input.

lazy bum shaughn

If you are a Honda "enthusiast" then you should know an LS/VTEC motor is way better than a 1.6 B16 motor.

Milano_EH3

The jury is still out on how great LSVTEC and B20VTECs are compared to their non-Frankenstein B-series brothers. I can go into more specifics, but either way I would take an LSVTEC over any B16 variant anyday.


[Modified by Red_eg_si, 6:30 PM 9/27/2002]

ZiggyStardust

B16 is faster thats why the Si has it - Also the Si can waste LS Teggys further proof that the B16 is faster.

ShortbusEK

if you knew anything ziggy... you would have read that he was talkin about LS Vtec... not just the LS motor... he was refering to the frankenstein setup of takin the LS bottom and mating it with a vtec head.. like a b16 head or a b18c or other dohc vtec heads... and then no.. the b16 will not be anywhere near as fast... and as for the Si's... ive watched stock ls's STOMP Si's because the LS just has more torque..

sesk

well it would be kinda hard to decide which one u would want to get..i mean u got the low end torque and the vtec head with the ls/v which may seem perfectly set to some people, but ive seen alot of ppl with ls/v that have soo many problems with their motor, and ive seen ppl that are still running their b16's in their crx and hatchs..IMO, ls/v kinda gives out towards the longer run..

but for more power, i would stick with the ls/v, unless u got some more money and get the b16, and just mod the **** out of it..


[Modified by EG6 SiR, 4:09 PM 9/27/2002]

vtecvoodoo

the ls/vtec needs to be built RIGHT. You can`t cut corners.

Ryan

customx_

why do these idiots/newB's keep asking which swap is better???????????????????/

dont they f*ckin know you cant compare a stock motor to a built/hybrid motor!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

"which is better? b16 or turbo ls or ls vtec or 350 small block?"

Kamin

do you know what an lsvtec is?
please if you have no idea what your talking about
DONT SPEAK.

vtecvoodoo

b16=god

lol

ShortbusEK

ive seen a few lsvtec setups... ive seen bad ones and good ones.. if built properly they are just as good as anything else.. but if they are just thrown together.. then they last a while then blow up... here are some dyno charts.. the first one is of an LS/Vtec... with stockLS bottom end with a GSR head... the GSR head is all stock except for JUN cams.. the LS/Vtec is hittin 206.6 whp and 144.5 ft-lbs of torque as where the B16 from the 99 Si with DC 4-2-1 header and intake is only at 139 whp and 100.9 ft-lbs... but do what you think is best

LS/Vtec Dyno


B16 Dyno


these charts I got from ImportReview.com

Ski2001

That seems a little fishy, snif snif, ya thats fish 206 at the wheels?? With jsut a cam on a frank??? I think you may be beaning misled.

Kamin

theres no way that put down 206 with just cams
and the SI should be putting down above 140 STOCK.

Milano_EH3

Okay, I'm lazy and don't feel like typing all this out again. Check my replies in this thread about somebody asking about hybrid motors, I'm "CourtLukens".
http://www.forumco.com/importatlanta...le=2%29++HONDA

A couple things I didn't touch on in this thread, is the reliabilty issue of hybrid motors. This also ties in to the R/S ratio on the LSVTEC and B20VTEC. The low R/S ratio of these setups means the rod will be closer to a horizontal angle on its upstroke. This means that more of its force will be pushing the piston horizontally, rather than vertically. Which means when you start revving these motors like the normal B-series without building up the bottom end, you have that possibilty of either snapping a rod, or blowing out the cylinder wall. Now obviously this would happen over time, but it is still a risk. Ideally you shouldn't rev a hybrid past 7.5K, without building the bottom end, even then.....you should be careful. Again, also read my replies in the thread above.


[Modified by Red_eg_si, 8:03 PM 9/27/2002]

95redcivicex

LS/VTEC is by far superior. Low end torque makes them good. The problem is you cant run a high compression ratio or rev too high. Forged rods are a must. At first they appear to be cheaper than a regular b-series but after i did the research im just gonna aim for b18c1. Thats my $.02

ShortbusEK

this is just what i read.. i was lookin for dyno charts and thats what i found.... my friend had one.. stock bottom.. stock gsr head... 192 whp.. so its not entirely crazy... just needs to be built right.. i got the dyno charts from importreview.com...
go check em out for yourself.. im not sayin they are right and your wrong.. but go check em out

Dr. EKology

I dont know if you mentioned this in your other post, but the drawback of running a b20/v is the fact that oem pistons cannot be used. Aftermarket pistons are your only choice, which means the reliability of oem pistons will be lost. It's all about how they are built. MAny ls/v's that i have seen usually begin to burn and leak oil. IMO, they just arent made to be pushed like a normal b series motors.

civicHBphatride

All I have to say is a LS VTEC is faster but you have to build it up for it to last. The B16 would be good because it would have less problems and last longer. if you build the LS VTEC the right way which cost money it will last just as long.

speedy-crx

your goin to own a si with lsvtec because of the tourqe and we all know tourqe is what gets **** moving

blackANESE

iTrader: (2)

Why can't you run a high compression ratio? I know quite a few people with CR's in the high 11's. I also knew a guy that ran 13:1 in his b20/vtec. Now, why can't they run high compression......? I'll agree revving them past 8500 is really asking for it. But if built right it can handle the ocassional high rev. My friend revved his ls/vtec (slightly built) to 10K on 2 instances on accident and it is fine. 2 years 35,000 miles later it's still running like a champ.

Also, all the horror stories all you guys hear about are half-assed motors that were built cheap. Stock rods (not even shot-peened), probably used old PR3 pistons, and they didn't replace the bearings, balance crank, etc....

In closing. An ls/vtec can be just as reliable as any other other vtec motor when built right and taken care of.

vtecvoodoo

good thread re: this topic in the itr forum.

Btw, EVERYBODY runs high compression on them, at least 11.5:1.

Ryan

gamby

kamin--very rarely will a stock Si put down 140 stock. That would be a strong motor from the factory. Mine's at 148 with a bunch of stuff done to it. I/H/E was 144.

Nutshell--properly built frankenstein motor= Big bucks and will still not have complete Honda factory reliability.

B16A--very reliable, long life, but not big on power. It'll run 14's in a EG, which is quick, but not ls/vtec quick.

polymath

I run 12:1 compression on mine (B20vtec), and a friend of mine runs 13:1 on his.

Revs?


Of course you won't want to beat on any motor like that on a daily basis, but on race day the sky's the limit.

Copy Cat

Ls vtecs are tight as **** from what i have heard from other people. I have never felt the power of one before, but i would definitly build one if you can afford it. If you don't make that much loot than i would stick to b16, because you don't wanna be looking for change to fix the lsvtec motor if it isn't built right. But thats just my opinion. Just go with your gut feeling.

Sohc-Vtec

Enough si bashing, with a few dollars they are fast. They have potenial; however, a WELL built ls/Vtec is better. Not lightyears faster, but yes faster. Yes they do require more mantanice, but the extra upkeep is worth it.