93eg2james

i just got back from a friends house with some recently aquired parts. i got them for a very good deal, and i know they're good parts, but I'm not sure what i should expect from them performance wise.

I got a built LS head with all skunk 2 valvetrain, crower 404 cams, and skunk 2 cam gears. one valve is bent, but is being fixed. head was ported, and shaved by "import builders".

i also got a safc2, arp head studs, and a new head gasket. this entire setup will be going on a b18b1 in a Del sol. i got the parts for next to nothing, but have no idea how they will affect my car performance wise. will this setup be reliable? is it worth my time to install the head? i will be having the head remachined, and all the valves re-seated.

knowledgeable input is always appreciated

93eg2james

ttt

InvaderTrax

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 93eg2james &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">...is it worth my time to install the head?</TD></TR></TABLE>

Reread your post and that'll answer your question

I Shot 50 Cent

definitely worth your time to install. Do not reuse the gasket thats on your motor now, spring for a new one.

You'll need some tuning above the SAFC to get the correct power gains from that cam but personally I think the lift on 404's are too aggressive for a mild LS build. Most importantly, what other modifications do you have to your B18B1 right now?

Dont quote me, but you may LOSE power with those cams if it isnt tuned correctly, and/or you dont have the proper additional modifications for them.

Cams are a big jump man...but good luck. Do some research over @ team-integra.net on those cams and you'll get EVERY answer you'll need.

schardbody

you will see gains in the upper range, but lose a bit down low, point blank. worth it, yes, if you race alot, or just bored with your stock setup and wanna say you have a built head with 404s.

i would do it personally, but dont expect it to feel like a stock car when you arent getting on the gas.

93eg2james

ok cool. so the cam profile is a little aggressive? i dont really know much about cam profiles or how they work, but i was told they were a nice setup and sounded nice.

i font have much done to my car. it a stock b18b1 with dc4-1 headers, password intake, and a skunk 2 exhaust

I Shot 50 Cent

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 93eg2james &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">ok cool. so the cam profile is a little aggressive? i dont really know much about cam profiles or how they work, but i was told they were a nice setup and sounded nice.

i font have much done to my car. it a stock b18b1 with dc4-1 headers, password intake, and a skunk 2 exhaust</TD></TR></TABLE>

It may not be much man, but with sayyyy a properly port matched intake manifold, and the parts you have in your room you're well on your way to a pretty nasty setup.

Definitely install everything you have, swing by a dyno and let them play with the SAFC and you may be pretty satisfied in the end. You'll definitely see power when its all said and done.

Good luck!


And to Schardbody....is it true that its not exactly a quiet idle with a high profile cam? Is it something you can smooth out with tuning, or is it going to be lopey either way?

93eg2james

port matched IM? would it be a good idea to buy an aftermarket one? or would it be better to have it portmatched?

schardbody

well, usually you can smooth the idle with lumpy cams just by tuning and raising the idle rpm, of coarse this requires a little dyno time and knowledge under the hood, because base timing, TPS voltage, and iacv duty cycle will all change.


OP: i should have posted more info, but didnt know if you really cared. heres a little more. with the bump in compression your power will be up no matter what, so you have a good start, basically, the key to making power with cams is letting the engine breathe, while doing it efficiently. this requires tuning the cam timing (via cam gears on a dyno), and playing with the fuel to get a good stoich mixture while keeping detonation under check (especially with raised compression). if you have to wait a little longer to get it tuned wait to install the parts just before you go to the dyno, give yourself time to work out any bugs before wasting a trip to the dyno, and before driving an untuned setup for months.

BTW: i have seen similar setups make more power to the wheels than the LS made stock to the flywheel. i would seriously consider swapping the intake manifold to something that flows a little better though. most descent aftermarket pieces will suffice.

I Shot 50 Cent

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by schardbody &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">well, usually you can smooth the idle with lumpy cams just by tuning and raising the idle rpm, of coarse this requires a little dyno time and knowledge under the hood, because base timing, TPS voltage, and iacv duty cycle will all change.


OP: i should have posted more info, but didnt know if you really cared. heres a little more. with the bump in compression your power will be up no matter what, so you have a good start, basically, the key to making power with cams is letting the engine breathe, while doing it efficiently. this requires tuning the cam timing (via cam gears on a dyno), and playing with the fuel to get a good stoich mixture while keeping detonation under check (especially with raised compression). if you have to wait a little longer to get it tuned wait to install the parts just before you go to the dyno, give yourself time to work out any bugs before wasting a trip to the dyno, and before driving an untuned setup for months.

BTW: i have seen similar setups make more power to the wheels than the LS made stock to the flywheel. i would seriously consider swapping the intake manifold to something that flows a little better though. most descent aftermarket pieces will suffice.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Thanks for the info!

And to the OP....what I meant by port matched IM is this...

These numbers are JUST in theory, so dont take them to heart But say your intake tube itself is 68mm. Get a throttle body that is also 68mm, and an intake manifold that is 68mm as well. That way, everything is "port matched" and you will not have any restriction whatsoever in your intake system. Basically all aftermarket intake manifold companies make a throttle body that goes "along" with thier IM. With a properly matched package for your power goals, and the parts you already have...you should be in good shape. You also have the option of slightly boring out your stock throttle body/IM to the desired diameter, but after you weigh the costs and whatnot of having this done versus just buying an aftermarket unit...that decision is up to you.

JUST as schardbody said, install it all and make sure everything is stable and running. Get to a tuner and have him play around with your air/fuel ratio and perhaps do a few dyno runs. He'll hook the car up to a wideband o2 and smooth out all of your torque/power curves and HOPEFULLY you'll be very happy with the performance, especially given the "great deal" you got most of the parts for.

As far as Compression Ratios go, that will be determined by your pistons/rods combo, and the head gasket you choose. I am not very knowledgeable on this so I'll leave this in the hands of someone that knows what they're talking about, before I go along spreading incorrect information. Do some research on the 404 cams and see what kind of compression ratio the cams thrive on and go from there before purchasing a head gasket.

Any other questions....this is the place to ask. There's alot of smart asses on this board, but there's twice as many knowledge filled people that would be glad to help you. You sound like an intelligent person so I'd say you'll end up in pretty good shape. Good luck man!

Oh yeah..and don't forget. If you still arent satisfied with the gains from what you have...you're still working with a stock bottom end. There's many modifications you can do to the crank, pistons,rods, etc.

schardbody

well, milling the head is going to bump compression, ALL cams like compression.

I Shot 50 Cent

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by schardbody &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">well, milling the head is going to bump compression, ALL cams like compression.</TD></TR></TABLE>

He said the head was ported and "shaved" when he got it. For all we know, this could have already been done.

OP...do you have any more information on the head your purchased? How about any pictures? I'd assume the head came from a B18B1 also right? Do you know what kind of power he was putting down, or what type of head gasket he used? Tuned? I'd give him a call and see what kind of helpful information you can get out of him!

schardbody

yeah, he said it was already, and he also said he was getting it redone (most likely just checked for flatness and milled if needed), either way, compression will be higher than a stock LS head.