The effects of drivetrain mods on acceleration, review.
05-24-2006, 10:10 AM
#1
The effects of drivetrain mods on acceleration, review.
1996 Civic DX hatchback
current mods
removed spare tire and tools
full interior
still have A/C
5-lug (weight adder)
Y8 exhaust manifold, no exhaust
Action Clutch 1MD clutch (6-puck)
Fidanza 7.5 pound flywheel
Omni Power Clutch Master Cylinder, prototype revised version, thanks Omniman
stock 1,2,5 gears
ZC 3rd
stock 3rd 1.172 for 4th gear
SRR 4.71 final drive
2,340 pounds with me in it and a 1/4 tank
All runs made at Bristol Motor Dragway on 205/50/15 Azenis.
Stock car with 5-lug, 34'ish psi, averaged 17.7
17.584 @ 76.53
2.478 60'
1/8 - 11.178 @ 62.49
no back seats or 1/4 panels, averaged 17.4 (best was 17.1 but I can't find the slip)
no muffler (still had piping, still on Y7 manifold)
34'ish psi
clutch and flywheel
17.339 @ 76.63
2.511 60'
1/8 - 11.035 @ 63.18
with mods first listed, averaged 16.55
16.412 @ 80.90
2.316 60'
1/8 - 10.407 @ 66.29
I was going to do some comparison runs of ZC 3rd vs stock 3rd, but the track got busy and I didn't have time. As it is right now I top 4th out at 82mph, so with a better 60' I would need a higher rev limit to keep me from having to go to 5th. I'm sure with more track time I can get it down to a 16.1 or so.
Launches were at 5,500-6,000. Spinning then hopping. Tires were at 39psi after a couple minutes of cooling (never checked them before running). The CMC allows me very quick shifts so I don't think skipping 3rd and going straight to 4th would make me any faster, slower if anything.
I don't know the power of the engine but I've had it for over 2 years now. Every day I've driven it it has seen the red line a couple of times. I'd be surprised if it made 70whp on a dynojet, which I plan on getting it dyno'd next month for a before/after comparison with the Y8 manifold open and custom SMSP header open. I will also do a comparison at the strip for the 2 manifolds.
As for now I am putting in a 1.066 VX 3rd gear for 4th gear so hopefully that won't make me too much slower. I'm going to play around with the gearing before I do anything else to the engine. I'll either go 4.928 final drive and .878 5th gear or keep the 4.71 and see what it does with the Infinitude close gear set. I'll probably get an SAFC once I get the header so I can have the A/F adjusted on the dyno, I'll use that to raise the rev limit to 7,200. I might throw the 1.172 back in for 4th just for a comparison if I can get my 60' down. I will also be changing over to an EX case and use the EX 2nd gear as Quaife no longer makes a diff for the small bearing cases.
For now that is all.
The monster in all its stock D16Y7 glory.
current mods
removed spare tire and tools
full interior
still have A/C
5-lug (weight adder)
Y8 exhaust manifold, no exhaust
Action Clutch 1MD clutch (6-puck)
Fidanza 7.5 pound flywheel
Omni Power Clutch Master Cylinder, prototype revised version, thanks Omniman
stock 1,2,5 gears
ZC 3rd
stock 3rd 1.172 for 4th gear
SRR 4.71 final drive
2,340 pounds with me in it and a 1/4 tank
All runs made at Bristol Motor Dragway on 205/50/15 Azenis.
Stock car with 5-lug, 34'ish psi, averaged 17.7
17.584 @ 76.53
2.478 60'
1/8 - 11.178 @ 62.49
no back seats or 1/4 panels, averaged 17.4 (best was 17.1 but I can't find the slip)
no muffler (still had piping, still on Y7 manifold)
34'ish psi
clutch and flywheel
17.339 @ 76.63
2.511 60'
1/8 - 11.035 @ 63.18
with mods first listed, averaged 16.55
16.412 @ 80.90
2.316 60'
1/8 - 10.407 @ 66.29
I was going to do some comparison runs of ZC 3rd vs stock 3rd, but the track got busy and I didn't have time. As it is right now I top 4th out at 82mph, so with a better 60' I would need a higher rev limit to keep me from having to go to 5th. I'm sure with more track time I can get it down to a 16.1 or so.
Launches were at 5,500-6,000. Spinning then hopping. Tires were at 39psi after a couple minutes of cooling (never checked them before running). The CMC allows me very quick shifts so I don't think skipping 3rd and going straight to 4th would make me any faster, slower if anything.
I don't know the power of the engine but I've had it for over 2 years now. Every day I've driven it it has seen the red line a couple of times. I'd be surprised if it made 70whp on a dynojet, which I plan on getting it dyno'd next month for a before/after comparison with the Y8 manifold open and custom SMSP header open. I will also do a comparison at the strip for the 2 manifolds.
As for now I am putting in a 1.066 VX 3rd gear for 4th gear so hopefully that won't make me too much slower. I'm going to play around with the gearing before I do anything else to the engine. I'll either go 4.928 final drive and .878 5th gear or keep the 4.71 and see what it does with the Infinitude close gear set. I'll probably get an SAFC once I get the header so I can have the A/F adjusted on the dyno, I'll use that to raise the rev limit to 7,200. I might throw the 1.172 back in for 4th just for a comparison if I can get my 60' down. I will also be changing over to an EX case and use the EX 2nd gear as Quaife no longer makes a diff for the small bearing cases.
For now that is all.
The monster in all its stock D16Y7 glory.
05-24-2006, 11:05 AM
#3
Junior Member
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: 714, CA, USA
Posts: 968
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
D16Y7 performs like that after drivetrain upg? nice... i've seen more people taking stock and plugging on a turbo kit... wonder if you threw that into your equation?
05-24-2006, 12:42 PM
#5
Banned
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Murfreesboro, Tennessee, United States
Posts: 195
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
hey i dont wanna sound supid but wat does smsp stand for. i heard it a couple times when ppl are discussing headers. soo obviously they make headers. sorry for whoring up your thread. that's cool how your messin with the gears like that. you must be really knowledgable.
07-02-2006, 11:06 AM
#7
Re: (Aquafina)
Ran it at Bristol again this past Thursday.
Tires were at 28 psi, changes were a 1MD clutch versus a 1MS (same pads, but disc is lighter due to no springs, 1MS disc had lots of life left in it but I destroyed the pressure plate, pics later). Put an EX trans it it since I destroyed the Y7 trans (crossthreaded interlock guide bolt and it came out). Also put the Y7 exhaust manifold back on, still no exhaust. Low end power feels a lot better with it, more sluggish in the top end. But definitely quieter. No more turning up the radio all the way to hear it. Also, the EX 2nd gear feels nice. Overall the EX trans is pretty nice, but the gears are still way too long as you can see by my new times. Never hit 4th with it. Only got 3 runs in.
Best was:
1/4 - 16.822 @ 78.91
2.418 60'
1/8 - 10.651 @ 64.22
Was launching and half slipping the clutch, no pre-load. Would drop to 5,000 and spin through 1st, no wheel hop.
Tires were at 28 psi, changes were a 1MD clutch versus a 1MS (same pads, but disc is lighter due to no springs, 1MS disc had lots of life left in it but I destroyed the pressure plate, pics later). Put an EX trans it it since I destroyed the Y7 trans (crossthreaded interlock guide bolt and it came out). Also put the Y7 exhaust manifold back on, still no exhaust. Low end power feels a lot better with it, more sluggish in the top end. But definitely quieter. No more turning up the radio all the way to hear it. Also, the EX 2nd gear feels nice. Overall the EX trans is pretty nice, but the gears are still way too long as you can see by my new times. Never hit 4th with it. Only got 3 runs in.
Best was:
1/4 - 16.822 @ 78.91
2.418 60'
1/8 - 10.651 @ 64.22
Was launching and half slipping the clutch, no pre-load. Would drop to 5,000 and spin through 1st, no wheel hop.
Trending Topics
07-02-2006, 04:04 PM
#9
Member
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Biking and Beer, CT
Posts: 3,764
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: The effects of drivetrain mods on acceleration, review. (Bense)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Bense »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">awesome 
</TD></TR></TABLE>
I knew Id see you in this thread.
good research
</TD></TR></TABLE>I knew Id see you in this thread.
good research
07-02-2006, 05:08 PM
#10
* B A N N E D *
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Chicago, Il
Posts: 2,084
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: The effects of drivetrain mods on acceleration, review. (BEERownsHONDA)
Aquafina - you among the few who are a great inspiration to us d-series ers - keep up the good work
07-02-2006, 06:33 PM
#12
Junior Member
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Toronto, ON, Canada
Posts: 292
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: The effects of drivetrain mods on acceleration, review. (dxcoupe.)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by dxcoupe. »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">You should invest in an intake manifold swap if you haven't already.</TD></TR></TABLE>
A few posts up he says he has a Skunk2 intake manifold.
Nice build, I knew someone that had a y7 that could take b16s until it blew. Can't remember the 1/4 mile times though.
A few posts up he says he has a Skunk2 intake manifold.
Nice build, I knew someone that had a y7 that could take b16s until it blew. Can't remember the 1/4 mile times though.
07-02-2006, 08:50 PM
#13
Re: The effects of drivetrain mods on acceleration, review. (mugenpowered)
They are 205/50/15's. I can't fit anything smaller than 15's on it.
My engine is stock. I said I plan on getting a Skunk2 IM. Although my SMSP header will be here in about 2 weeks.
My engine is stock. I said I plan on getting a Skunk2 IM. Although my SMSP header will be here in about 2 weeks.
03-03-2007, 04:47 PM
#15
Re: The effects of drivetrain mods on acceleration, review. (Aquafina)
Ran it today at the season opener. Got 3 runs in. Left my Azenis out over winter so I don't know if thats where my traction problems were coming from or if it was just the weather or track (was mid-upper 50's).
Changes:
Azenis in front on Slips
CRV's in back on Ziex (45psi)
kept spare Slip/Azenis in hatch
Adjusted valve lash tighter than OEM spec on IN, tighest OEM spec on EX (do a valve lash day before each event I do)
removed AC belt
SMSP big tube header
SMSP race exhaust
Best run
2.719 60'
1/4 - 16.043 @ ??? (mph was sporadic most of the day)
1/8 - 10.942 @ 66.53
2nd
2.522 60'
1/4 - 16.386 @ 184.47
1/8 - 10.491 @ 67.36
(couldn't figure out why this run was slower being I had a better launch and 8th)
3rd (last)
2.500 60'
1/4 - 16.298 @ 83.52
1/8 - 10.450 @ 67.78
Gearing setup was stock EX with SRR 4.71 FD.
With a better launch and 1.066 4th I think it would do mid-15's.
Changes:
Azenis in front on Slips
CRV's in back on Ziex (45psi)
kept spare Slip/Azenis in hatch
Adjusted valve lash tighter than OEM spec on IN, tighest OEM spec on EX (do a valve lash day before each event I do)
removed AC belt
SMSP big tube header
SMSP race exhaust
Best run
2.719 60'
1/4 - 16.043 @ ??? (mph was sporadic most of the day)
1/8 - 10.942 @ 66.53
2nd
2.522 60'
1/4 - 16.386 @ 184.47
1/8 - 10.491 @ 67.36
(couldn't figure out why this run was slower being I had a better launch and 8th)
3rd (last)
2.500 60'
1/4 - 16.298 @ 83.52
1/8 - 10.450 @ 67.78
Gearing setup was stock EX with SRR 4.71 FD.
With a better launch and 1.066 4th I think it would do mid-15's.
10-02-2007, 08:37 AM
#16
Re: The effects of drivetrain mods on acceleration, review. (Aquafina)
Running it tonight. A lot of changes.
Z6 longblock, didn't do a valve adjustment since I put it in. I don't know how long its been since its had one. Has about 140k on it. Threw a rod in the Y7 LX/VTEC (Z6 head) so this was a quick replacement. Stock P28. Generic short ram (Z6 IM/TB). SMSP big tube/race exhaust.
For the trans...
Back to the OEM CMC.
New OEM slave cylinder.
Stock EX FD.
MFactory close gear set with 1.259 4th.
Won't have a spare in the back this time. The Azenis I'll be running up front are bald and old so I don't know how good they'll grip. I'll post results tonight when I get home from the strip.
Z6 longblock, didn't do a valve adjustment since I put it in. I don't know how long its been since its had one. Has about 140k on it. Threw a rod in the Y7 LX/VTEC (Z6 head) so this was a quick replacement. Stock P28. Generic short ram (Z6 IM/TB). SMSP big tube/race exhaust.
For the trans...
Back to the OEM CMC.
New OEM slave cylinder.
Stock EX FD.
MFactory close gear set with 1.259 4th.
Won't have a spare in the back this time. The Azenis I'll be running up front are bald and old so I don't know how good they'll grip. I'll post results tonight when I get home from the strip.
10-02-2007, 08:52 AM
#17
Honda-Tech Member
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Baltimore, MD, USA
Posts: 805
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: The effects of drivetrain mods on acceleration, review. (Aquafina)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Aquafina »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">2nd
2.522 60'
1/4 - 16.386 @ 184.47
1/8 - 10.491 @ 67.36</TD></TR></TABLE>
Thats a pretty nice trap ha. Love your work, you are one of the reasons some of us choose to stay N/A.
2.522 60'
1/4 - 16.386 @ 184.47
1/8 - 10.491 @ 67.36</TD></TR></TABLE>
Thats a pretty nice trap ha. Love your work, you are one of the reasons some of us choose to stay N/A.
10-02-2007, 06:10 PM
#20
Re: (Ron454321)
Not happy at all.
Had a CEL come on on the way to the strip. No VTEC.
Lost the exhaust donut so I almost debated even putting the header on. I went ahead and put it on, no exhaust.
bald and cracked Azenis in front so I'm sure they didn't do any good.
No exhaust hurt the midrange pretty bad, which is where I was after shifting.
Full size spare in the back.
60' - 2.418
1/8 - 10.240 @ 68.05
1/4 - 16.029 @ 84.88
On this run I felt like the power was dropping off in 4th so I put it into 5th and missed.
60' - 2.611
1/8 - 10.541 @ 67.91
1/4 - 16.483 @ 79.71
60' - 2.505
1/8 - 10.417 @ 68.33
1/4 - 16.194 @ 84.87
All in all not too bad I guess. The LX/VTEC felt a lot better before it blew. The new engine just doesn't feel like it has as much *****. Not sure what the Z6 primary specs are, but I think powerwise (with VTEC not working) it was actually a little less than the stock Y7 was with the header and exhaust.
Thats the last time I can run it this year. So that brings my gearing comparison on a stock'ish engine to an end. Next year I'll have a fresh build and will focus on the driver and suspension. Hopefully this has helped some of you decide what to do with your transmission setup.
Had a CEL come on on the way to the strip. No VTEC.
Lost the exhaust donut so I almost debated even putting the header on. I went ahead and put it on, no exhaust.
bald and cracked Azenis in front so I'm sure they didn't do any good.
No exhaust hurt the midrange pretty bad, which is where I was after shifting.
Full size spare in the back.
60' - 2.418
1/8 - 10.240 @ 68.05
1/4 - 16.029 @ 84.88
On this run I felt like the power was dropping off in 4th so I put it into 5th and missed.
60' - 2.611
1/8 - 10.541 @ 67.91
1/4 - 16.483 @ 79.71
60' - 2.505
1/8 - 10.417 @ 68.33
1/4 - 16.194 @ 84.87
All in all not too bad I guess. The LX/VTEC felt a lot better before it blew. The new engine just doesn't feel like it has as much *****. Not sure what the Z6 primary specs are, but I think powerwise (with VTEC not working) it was actually a little less than the stock Y7 was with the header and exhaust.
Thats the last time I can run it this year. So that brings my gearing comparison on a stock'ish engine to an end. Next year I'll have a fresh build and will focus on the driver and suspension. Hopefully this has helped some of you decide what to do with your transmission setup.
10-02-2007, 07:03 PM
#23
Re: (drtysohc)
I decided to give up the Y7 head before I even started. Too much reshaping of the ports to get it to flow good.
I might talk Rocket into doing it for me one day though. Until then, I don't want to tie him up with a long *** job. A Z6 head will be much quicker for him to work his magic on, and will transition the power better than a nonVTEC (which I need since I track my car. Drag isn't a very big concern to me).
I might talk Rocket into doing it for me one day though. Until then, I don't want to tie him up with a long *** job. A Z6 head will be much quicker for him to work his magic on, and will transition the power better than a nonVTEC (which I need since I track my car. Drag isn't a very big concern to me).
10-02-2007, 11:15 PM
#25
Honda-Tech Member
Re: (ridin98civic)
holler for na d series! I have a stock y7 in a 94 cx...z7 tb/im, header, test pipe, bc specIII, z6 trans and an exedy stage 1 put me at 15.6 and barely hit 4th at the end of the 1/4. Out of curiousity...how hard was the trans work?