gremlin82

hello

i bought my car, a 1998 Honda Civic LX, back in Jan 2006. I am the second owner, and the car was 95,000 miles at that time and the owner just changed the timing belt right before he sold the car to me

fastforward to now, 2014, i believe it may be time for a timing belt + water pump etc change. my car is only at 140,000 miles right now, so i didnt drive much, compared to an average person. but i do intend to keep the car for the foreseeable future.

question:

i was quoted $830 plus tax = $910 since WA tax is almost 10% by a independent car fixing shop (not Honda dealer). this shop is based in Bellevue, a suburb outside of Seattle.

the quote includes replacing the following, and labor
- timing belt
- water pump
- tension bearing
- valve adjustment
- drying belt (??)
- oil seal

The above quote also include replacing the oil gasket [side problem i had for the car as there's been minor leakage]. just thought to do everything in one go to save labor.

can someone pls comment whether this price is reasonable? daylight robbery? i know this shop does good work, but i just want to make sure i am not overpaying

B serious

iTrader: (1)

It's pricey for a single cam civic. You might end up paying the same ar a Honda dealer....but they'll use honda genuine parts, which are probably worlds better than what the shop intends to use (if they're going with aftermarket parts).

Independent shops in this area charge maybe 500-700 for this job on a single cam civic depending on what brand parts they use. I believe the dealer charges close to $900....which shouldn't vary much regionally

Check pricing at Honda first. Take it there if the quote is close. Genuine parts and fluids are where it's at.

Did you mean oil pan gasket needs to be replaced? Or are we talking about the front cam and crank seals?

Your other option is to buy genuine honda partes and coolant from www.bernardiparts.com and take it with you to the shop.

Also....FYI, genuine Honda T belts and water pumps are rated for 105k miles.

egsleepercivic

To me that's a lot of money since its only about $125 in parts. I would think you should be able to find someone to do for about $400 with parts. Or do it yourself if that's something you are interested in learning how to do.

B serious

iTrader: (1)

Timing belts are very involved and doing the job properly involves a lot more expertise and mechanical inclination (or supervision) than the internet implies.

I wouldn't recommend this as a DIY if the OP isn't significantly mechanically inclined....or he/she has done this before.....or he/she is going to be supervised or helped by someone who meets the criteria.

Look at all the threads about people being totally lost and frustrated about timing their single cam civics. One guy pried the belt on/off with a screw driver instead of loosening the tensioner because he admitted that he didn't know what he was doing.

HondaPartsHero

Drying belts I think you mean drive belts (power steering, ac, alternator).

tony_2018

Don't make such a critique job sound so easy. In this area everything has to be exact or you will end up taking everything back off just to fix the timing again. Not to mention in order to take the crank bolt off you will need to muscle or an impact gun, preferrably an air impact gun.

eHMxhACk

iTrader: (17)

If you're looking for a second opinion try The H Shop. Long story, never had any work done there, but the quoted my just over $500 for a TB/WP on a 92 Civic VX. Very nice customer service over the phone and would have gone out of his way to work with me on scheduling and picking up my car.

They are located in/near Bellevue.

http://www.hshopautorepair.com





eH.

gremlin82

Did you mean oil pan gasket needs to be replaced? Or are we talking about the front cam and crank seals?
>> hi, yes, my understanding is that the oil pan gasket needs to be replaced bc it's minor leak. 2 different ppl told me this (including this car shop) when they change oil for me. i cannot remember the full details. but i think the current car shop says change the front first before the back or something like that... so i need to call them up and ask again what this front cam and crank seals are - or can you pls clarify?

no, i dont have the tools or proper garage or means to change it. so really need to send to car shop to get it done in one go.

yes, i think drying belts = drive belts. i knew i misheard.

eHMxhACk : when were you quoted $500 for this change? was it recently, this year?

gremlin82

i just spoke to the car shop again

they say they use OEM parts, but it's not from Honda manufacturer, but from some other companies (e.g., coiled bearing??, HENO driving belts, etc)

and sorry, i got it wrong, upon double-checking in the phone call again, the $830+tax does not include replacing oil pan gasket. apparently, what happens to my car now is that there's a minor leak in front oil seal and rear main seal. replacing front oil seal is part of the timing belt change. but the rear main seal replacement is not covered under the quote.

so i guess.. pretty expensive still all-in-all

eHMxhACk

iTrader: (17)

If you keep the car for 5-7 years it's really not that expensive. Cheaper then two or three months worth of a new car payment.

I talked to The H Shop around July of last year (2013). I was interested in buying a 92 VX and driving it home, but the seller hadn't done any real maintenance to the car. Getting TB/WP done before driving long distance was going to be necessary. I didn't end up buying the car, it was in rough condition, so I didn't get any work done. But The H Shop was very helpful and they seemed honest.





eH.

B serious

iTrader: (1)

"oem" parts are not the same quality as genuine honda.

For $900, you can get that done at honda with honda parts. Why not go there?

import-tooner

I would say that's pretty high. I usually charge quite a bit less than that but I'm an independent. Basically, I do work for people on the side. I would find someone who really knows Hondas but does side work. You should be able to have everything done for under $400.

gremlin82

so i just called up H shot and got a quote from someone named Todd. Todd said yes, it's $500 to replace timing belt, water pump and anti-freeze. this quote does not include other items (e.g., drive belt, tensioner/tension bearing, valve adjustment, oil seal or gasket change)

question here: is it necessary to get all these additional parts changed? beyond the TB/WP/AF? if no, then why do places usually quote all these additional items during timing belt change? according to Todd, the tensioner thing comes as a kit usually (this matches what i know too), and this kit is expensive

eHMxhACk

iTrader: (17)

It's not "necessary", but highly recommended. The water pump is behind the timing belt. So replacing one makes the other "parts cost" only. No real labor charge.

The valve gasket is done with a timing belt. The valve adjustment isn't alway necessary. But since the valve cover is off, why not?

Anyway, you drop ~$900 for this maintenance and you're set for another 100k miles. Everything else is cheap routine maintenance. (Except for a clutch, if it's a manual.)

Take your car over to the shop and have them take an actual look at it. Sometimes they tell you what you NEED and what can wait without causing damage. Plus you'll get a more accurate idea of costs. Also, ask them if they have any specials e.g. 10% off service over $500 kinda thing.

Edit: http://www.hshopautorepair.com/specials/

The H Shop specials: $12 off every $100 spent up to $500. That's a $60 savings. Roughly equals a free valve adjustment.




eH.

ej1b18c1

That's way too much money!!!! No way. Better be with all OEM parts like stated above.

B_Swapped93

450-550$ is the going rate around here using OEM Honda parts if the car has no AC/PS then it's ALOT faster the A/C is the biggest pain in the *** to work around.

tony_2018

I would just have them work on the timing belt job, seals, tensioner and water pump. You do the rest.

When they say oem they probably mean OEM STYLE. Almost every shop says that crap.

ej1b18c1

^^ That's about the same over here as well with same parts, dohc about $50-120 more. I love my power steering though lol and love how it never came with AC and its an ex model!! Canada model I guess.

import-tooner

Not sure how AC would cause it to be any harder???? Power steering pump has to be removed but it takes about 30 seconds to unbolt it and move it out of the way. You do have to take the belts off but that is also really quick and easy.

B serious

iTrader: (1)

PS and AC make it more difficult. For some reason, moving that stuff/removing belts is time consuming. I'd say PS is way more annoying. Taking off those dumbass 12mm extra long bolts. Ffffffffuuuuuuuuu......

I can do it in under 1hr if there's no AC/PS.

B serious

iTrader: (1)

Things I do when I do T belfs:
-belt
-water want pump
-tensioner and spring
-front cam and crank seals (prevente future oil leaks)
-rear cam seal when applicable
-drive belts
-coolant (DuHHHhHhHHHHhHHhhhh)

angrysmileyface

Granted I know you are not doing this for yourself, but I think the entire kit was something like 150$ online from DCH honda (one of the online dealers) when I did it about a year ago. This included the tensioner, spring, belt, and wp (all honda branded) and I think a couple of the seals, but I could be wrong.

Axatax

I think $800 is reasonable for that work.

Everyone on the internet can find all the parts in a dumpster behind a Honda dealer and change the belt in 20 minutes with a Leatherman. If that's not you by all means shop around, but buyer beware.

ej1b18c1

I don't think it's reasonable with aftermarket parts and a local shop. Oem honda parts at the dealer will be close to that.

Fishbone Fan

Buy a good quality kit online with as many OEM parts as possible in it.

Kit should include:
Timing Belt
Water Pump
Tensioner
Accessory belts (A/C and Power steering)
Cam Seals
Valve cover and spark plug hole seals

If a shop orders it they will beat you up on mark up cost for those parts.
Call around different shops and ask them what they charge per hour for labor only. I live in Florida and usually will go to a Hispanic owned shop since they seem to be much more reasonable than others. I am a white guy, so others here please don't make any more out of my suggestion than what it is.