Integra4lyfe069

okay soi bought a 96 civic si, it has 341 ks on it, body is in mint shape and interior is mint, its a SOHC vtec engine, everything is fine, but sometimes randomly while driving its like the car almost dies and loses acceleration/power and sputters but doesnt shut off?

during idle its fine, but sometimes also randomly itt'l start to shake and have one real rough idle. as if the rpms drop so low its almost stalling it seems.

i havnt tried a tune up yet and or battery rep[lace? maybe needs an oil change or bad gas from sitting?


anyboody can relate to this problem ?


https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=1053450

he seems to explain it also in better terms

mikehawk

check all your grounds make sure they are good the other day I was going to walmart and my hatch kept acting like it was gonna shut off and when i pulled in it shut off .. the batt wasnt bolted down ripped the ground out

Integra4lyfe069

hm ill check my grounds tmw and im gonna replace the battery and do plugs/wires/cap/rotor tune up and oil/fluids and see if that will work?

maybe cat is cloggeD?

now im missing a flex pipe theres some sort of tubings clampoed or something heh.


any other ideas on what might be causing the bogging/powerloss


but it only seems to be randomly or after its been runnin for abit

Integra4lyfe069

nobody ?

honda.lioness

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Integra4lyfe069 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">hm ill check my grounds tmw and im gonna replace the battery and do plugs/wires/cap/rotor tune up and oil/fluids and see if that will work?</TD></TR></TABLE>

I would do the plugs/wires/cap/rotor first and see what happens. Use only OEM for these ignition parts. They cost more but they last longer and so pay for themselves. Besides, you would be doing a tuneup sometime or another, anyway. Check the timing, too. See the manual linked below.

I would not bet on the battery being the problem, nor the oil. It is possible the coolant is low or there is air in the cooling system. Certain engine control sensors need to be fully immersed. Top off the cooling system and purge thoroughly of air, per the manual's instructions. This will cost little. Note that, where the manual says to wait until the radiator fan comes on twice, you may have to wait some 40 minutes or more. These engines are tiny and take a long time to reach the temp that starts the fan.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">maybe cat is cloggeD?</TD></TR></TABLE>

Does the stalling etc. occur when climbing hills? If so, then I would start pointing a finger at the cat.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">it only seems to be randomly or after its been runnin for abit</TD></TR></TABLE>

I would test the ignition coil, especially if the stalling/drop in RPM only occurs after running a bit. For the test, see the 95-97 Civic manual linked at http://ww1.honda.co.uk/car/owner/workshop.html .

If none of this fixes it, post back.

Integra4lyfe069

hey so far ive replaced the plugs and filled all fluids with fluid even the coolant., didint do plugs yet or the dizzy cap and rotor but the problem is still there, and the stallling well it isnt stalling to the point it shuts off but its like its losing gas or stops sending fuel or something

like the cylynders stop working or something iunno its weird, but i can still neutral it and rev it up....

Now I checked the oil and it looks dirty

Just so you know though... -&gt; There is NO Y PIPE.. maybe thats it ? theres suposed to be the y flex pipe or something ? coming from header to cat?

It isn't there, theres just a bunch of clamps holding some bullshit pipes together
maybe thats causing back pressure or something ?

my ground from tranny to car is good, i couldnt find one coming from the soh hc vtec engine to the car tho ?

the battery terminals look fine

car starts immediatly.

sometimes after being ran for a while though the engine starts shaking.. sorta acting like a generator about to shut off when running low on gas heh


im stumped

STILL only cell code thrown is the o2 sensor.



Modified by Integra4lyfe069 at 2:52 PM 11/7/2008

94EG8

You wanna run that by me again? A picture would be even better really. it should have a manifold, which bolts to a 2 into 1 downpipe whice has a flange on the end, this bolts to the cat using two spring bolts.

honda.lioness

A bad O2 sensor may very well be causing the problems here(!). This is what I would fix first. Google for more info on what the O2 sensor does and why it is very likely thee problem here.

drg007

iTrader: (2)

igniter is probably bad

Integra4lyfe069

you know how the headers are 4-2-1


well after they go into 4-2 there is a pipe that takes them from 2-1 into the cat.

The dude has some bullshit pipes stuck together because it was cut - so he put a sleeve over it and used clamps on each end to try and close the pipe instead of leaking.

I think its moving as well as the pipe by the resonator cause the weld broke. Causing vaccume leak ?.


I'm gonna change the o2 sensor today and fuel filter, ill let u guys know what happens then.

Ill try and get a picture too of the pipe.


Modified by Integra4lyfe069 at 7:55 AM 11/8/2008

honda.lioness

Buy an OEM sensor, or all bets are off. No need to go to the dealer: A universal wire Denso Oxygen sensor is fine and will save you bucks, as long as you are okay with doing some wire splicing. Try Amazon or Ebay or http://www.automedicsupply.com for a Denso sensor, either direct plug in or universal wire. (Denso is the OEM manufacturer and sells its parts to many companies. Hence Denso sensors are abundantly for sale on the net.)

The fuel filter is unlikely to be the problem, but it is part of routine maintenance and is not expensive, so why not.

Integra4lyfe069

tru, so what i did today was put the car up on the hoist after changing my fuel filter .

What ive noticed was the resonator weld has broken therefor the pipes come apart when i hit the gas, I'm loosing all my exhaust and pressure.

I also noticed that b4 the cat the pipe was hacked so a sleeve was put over it with clamps and not welds, so im leaking it there as well due to the pipes are not one or closed, their two and open. jus inside a bullshit sleeve.

*so at 12:00 eastern time today i have an appointment to get it re welded and a pipe welded in replace of the sleeve, i will let you know what turns out on this and how the car runs. I'm hoping this fixes my problem

now in terms of the o2 sensor i will buy it threw what youv'e told me, but which one am i looking for? the one behind the manifold or the cat?


also the only other problem i have is the battery seems to be draining.. i left the car runnin on battery with the heat on and lights , wen i went to get a burger I came back tried to start it and it wuldnt. i had to ge ta boost, but the car starts up right away and fine and it did the same with the boost so i doubt its my altonator, shuld i jus replace the battery?


Modified by Integra4lyfe069 at 7:56 AM 11/8/2008

honda.lioness

I have been wondering, and it might be relevant here: Can you please clarify whether your 96 Civic engine is stock? Or is it a swap? It will affect your oxygen sensor choice (maybe you know this; just trying to be clear for the archives yada).

What is the code number your car is throwing? This will identify which O2 sensor it is. I am betting it is the upstream one (= the one behind, really built into, the exhaust manifold and upstream of the cat), based on the symptoms.

I defer to others on the exhaust system mods and their effect here, except to say I think these may very well be messing up your car's performance. I threw a new aftermarket cat in my 91 Civic a couple of months ago, and it sure helped the mileage (along with helping correct a high NOx problem?).

On the battery: What manufacturer's name is written on it? I see you are in Canada. My OEM batteries lasted around 4-5 years in the northern United States. Non-OEM will not generally last as long. Granted you bought the car used and so may have no idea how old the battery is. I would do the five basic battery/charging system checks listed about one-third of the way down at site http://honda.lioness.googlepag...rtips and report back.

Sounds like you are staying patient, which is a good path to take with a second-hand car, since you may have overlapping problems which make diagnoses more difficult. Start with eliminating the CEL code.

Integra4lyfe069

well i did buy it used and the engine i dont think was swapped in but it does have mods.

looks like a new fuel rail and it has aem intake, im not sure if the headers r new, there are no heat shields, but looks after market .


i priced o2 sensors, and they ranged from 180-300 $ depending on which ones, but this was at autozone, so im thinking on going ur route, ill plug the reader back n later and report back for the code, then u can identify which one it is for me i guess. but im on my way to the place now to get the exhaust welded and piped up, ill let u know how things turn out and give an update.


Modified by Integra4lyfe069 at 11:47 AM 11/8/2008

honda.lioness

The engine code is stamped on the front of the block, just below and inboard of where the distributor attaches to the block. The letters and numbers are about an inch high and often covered with grease and dirt. You have to make sure you get an O2 sensor that is applicable to this engine.

For a stock engine, you should be able to get a Denso O2 sensor for under $70. If memory serves, maybe as low as $50 from a check of Amazon this morning. But if it is not stock, the price may be more.

94EG8

I'd fix up that exhaust. Replace the bad O2 sensor, as honda.lioness stated its probably the primary/upstream O2 sensor, the seconday sensor really just tells you if the cat is working or not. Either get a Denso O2 sensor or as a close second an NTK, Bosch are junk. Not that it really means anything but my original battery lasted 12 years here in new brunswick, i've seen others go as long. But battery life is pretty varied. And finally, we have autozones in canada? I've certainly never seen one in new brunswick before.

Integra4lyfe069

napa autozone any NAPA is canadian autozones.


and for an update:

I have my exhaust done " i rewelded the entire resonator where it broke free and it holds up perfectly now, no rattleing or pressure loss there.

I also cut the clamps off pipes behind the cat and rewelded a new one so my exhaust sounds clean and clear now and holdsa up fine, no leaks or loss of pressure from there now.


** Also I picked up a new cap and rotor and i went to replace it i took the screws off the see threw cap i have in there but theres a wire going into it from the bottom, i cant get the cap off because of it, anybody know what the wire is? also the screw on the rotor wheel is stripped, any ideas on how i get that out ?

i also have the fuel filter incase its clogged or old ima replace that tomorrow as well.

ill post pics tmw of the car///enginebay///dizzy//etc

also i changed all fluids but the small resevoir on the far driver side, that fluid looks black as hell, how do i drain that and replace? also my oil looks BLACK shuld i change the oils/filter ?

but as for the o2 sensor ima hook up the reader again tmw too and pop u guys the code and we'lll go about ordering one .

honda.lioness

Were there threw screws holding the cap in place? Does the wire look like baling wire? Or is it electrical wire connecting electrical parts? What I have seen is that some folks accidentally (overtighten and?) strip a dizzy cap screw. Then they drill a hole in the dizzy housing where the screw was and hold the cap on with baling wire. If so, just snip the baling wire and remove the cap. I remember stripping the bottom dizzy cap screw some years ago but did not know enough to take the dizzy housing off and fix it. The whole dizzy housing comes off easily to properly repair any old, partly drilled out screw that was left in it.

If the above does not sound like your situation, then can you post a photo of the dizzy showing the cap etc.?

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">also the screw on the rotor wheel is stripped, any ideas on how i get that out ?</TD></TR></TABLE>

Unfortunatley this is pretty common. You can try drilling a hole smaller than the screw diameter, then using what is called an "EZ Out." An "EZ Out" is a screw extractor for stripped etc. screws that have to be removed by hook or crook. One can buy an EZ Out set at Napa, Autozone, etc. Very popular tool. Try very hard not to damage the threads in the dizzy shaft. It is highly likely they are already damaged. Then the proper fix is to replace the dizzy housing. This gets you a new dizzy shaft.

A temporary fix that will work is to drill a hole all the way through the dizzy shaft (it may already be drilled fully through); drill another hole through the rotor; then attach all with a cotter pin. This worked fine for me for four months on my 91 Civic several years ago, whence I bought a new OEM housing. The temporary fix might have been fine for many years; I just did not like the half-baked solution I was using. The good news is I have had no problems with the dizzy since then, now going on almost six years. I do replace the cap and rotor about every five years, but this is routine maintenance that Honda prescribes.

I personally think replacing the dizzy housing every 10 years/150k miles, whichever comes first, is a good idea. It has several sensors and wiring in it that degrade over time. So many starting and running problems trace to old dizzies, plus the screw problem you are having.

I would only focus on the dizzy and O2 sensor for now. Ditto what 94EG8 said about not buying Bosch O2 sensors. Denso or maybe his other suggestion. I guess if you are waiting for parts, maybe change the engine oil. My general rule for all cars purchased second-hand: Change tranny fluid, engine oil, and coolant, and do a tuenup. One just does not know the age of the fluids and parts in there, and these items are done pretty frequently in the normal course of properly owning a car, anyway.

Also, do not buy a new O2 sensor until you confirm which engine this is. Get the engine code off the front of the block, as discussed earlier, and post.

94EG8

Whats stripped, the head of the screw or the threads?

Integra4lyfe069

the head of the screw on the rotor is stripped where the star top screw driver fits in its rounded now, so i figure making it flat now to try and get it out, but ill worry about that screw after i fix the cap problem.


Theres a red can attatched to my engine bay with a pink wire wire coming from it going into the dizzy cap wired into something inside., the 3 screws on the dizzy cap r fine, inma post ics soon of the dizzy and its problems and my engine bay.


ALSO my vtec blue light inside is always on, shuld that only come on when i vtec or always be on ?


im still trying to find my obd2 reader to get the code #'s and ima post all other info about the engine code in abit too. ill do an update post

Integra4lyfe069

Alright folks so for an update as of sunday 11/9/2008 The 1996 Honda Civic SI ? or DX ENGINE CODE: D16 Y8
sits as following:

what is an msd can first off: &

ALL GROUNDS R GOOD (battry to car, tranny to car, engine to car, is there more?)

I have the new fuel filter for it but it isnt in yet. (im thinking clogged fuel filter could be a factor.

I changed the plugs from old to ngk g powers. when i took them out the threads were black and the plugs looked sorta white/brown but not worn much.

I didint change the wires yet because i need to pick them up from napa/autozone im figuring going with NGK blues? ( i figure this culd be a facxtor due to its part of the tuneup and or losing spark somewhere.)

I bought a cap/rotor but the cap isnt the same it doesnt have 5 plugs . the one on my civic now has 5 plugs, cause one in the middle is going to a MSD can. pictures are below of the can and 5 plug dizzy setup.... also i have a wire coming from the MSD can into the dizzy cap as well hooked up into something inside, i dunno how to get the cap off, so maybe ill take it to the garage and get them to change the cap/rotor cause if they break it they pay for it , if i do im [freak]ed. ( i figure this culd be a factor due to the fact its see threw and they only last 20k's anyway and who knows how old it is right ? + they might be losing spark when the rotor hits.)

MY engine light came on and the o2 sensor code was thrown, but which one iam not sure yet , i see a o2 sensor behind my cat and one up on my headers. i culdnt locate the one behind my manifold?

My vtec blue light is on on the dash cluster. ( shuldnt it only come on in vtect only? and be off when not? or is it always on? ) im not sure cause this is the first vtec car ive had, i have a 95 iontegra ls do hc non vtec, for years.

Also ive noticed the other day when it was idling it randomly jumped to 1500 then back to normal and didint do it again? sometimes it will idle rough and steady out start to shake and steady out.... but will never shut off. the problem im having is when im out in the car, its like im driving fine then all of a sudden the car starts stuttering and lose all power but when i shift to neutral and rev it throw it in gear i can go for a second or two b4 it boggs again then sometimes ittl pick up and work normally, its weird. i dont understand.


This is the 5 plug dizzy


this is the 5 plugs and small wire from dizzy to msd can

94EG8

That "can" is an external coil, the stock civic distributor uses an internal coil.

Integra4lyfe069

can u educate me more on the external coil and why its wired into the dizzy by the positive cable and how i replace the dizzy cap with this hooked up?

Also shuld i be getting a new msd external can then ?
Because This one looks rusty and old. also is there a special cap and rotor to order cause the one i ordered for this doesnt look anything like the one i got on now and i ordered it specificly for this car/year.


also i noticed after resetting my cpu today and ran the car hard it doesnt bog anymore, but im still going to fix the o2 sensor and fuel filter/ do the rest of the tuneup but this dizzy problem is confusing me. ill post back in a day opr two when ifix all this stuff and post how its runnin and see if this comes back.

any input in the meantime let me know please cause ill be checking back and ill post if something comes up

94EG8

The wiring that goes into the distributor cap goes to the wiring for the original internal coil. Honestly if it were me i'd get rid of the MSD coil and get a new OEM coil and distributor cap. I don't ever recall hearing anything great about an MSD setup, and the stock coil is good for well over stock applications. If you do keep it though you'll need a distributor cap meant for an external coil, I assume MSD sells one.

Integra4lyfe069

so whats easier for me here?


get rid of the can, then how do i get rid of the wire? and how do i replace the ignition coil any diagram or step by step? i wuld it be easier to jus goto a shop and pay them to do it

also the engine is D18 Y8

is this a civic si engine?


Modified by Integra4lyfe069 at 5:39 AM 11/10/2008