johnsoj0266

I am very close to making a purchase of a JDM OBDII H22A with 5-speed LSD tranny. My original set-up is an F23A VTEC with 5-speed. So I don't have to worry about a Manual conversion. The main questions I have are about the Engine wiring harness connections and the axles.

I am hoping someone has done pretty much the same swap and can give me some help.

Specifically I need to know if should use the wiring harness that comes with the H22A and simply swap out my current ECU for the ECU with the H22A. Granted I realize that with the RHD wiring harness I would need to change the harness routing from the last engine clamp to the LHD ECU location. Or do I need to take my old harness off and put it on the H22A and then adjust for any pin-out differences for the ECU connection? One area that I may have an advantage over most people here is that I work for the company that made all the wiring harness (including engine) for the 98 - 02 Accord. So, I have access to the connectors, wires, clamps, etc. to make extension, pig-tails etc.

For the axles, will I need to buy axels from the H22A Prelude or will my current axels and half-shaft work with the LSD tranny?

Thanks for your input!!

Cannon Man

Youre making this swap way more difficult than need be, and I personally wouldnt do an obd 2 swap. The only way to really make it work is to find a 96 prelude ecu or convert to obd 1 like most everyone else including myself. As far as the axles you can use prelude or accord ones, they just all have to be the same set IE all accord or all lude.

tpot90

Would we lose any power or tq doing this swap? If we were to swap an H22a tranny, would we need to replace the OBD2 with an OBD1 ECU, thus being an automatic p13 (since im planning the auto swap, not 5spd)? If I shouldn't use the p13 ecu, which one do I use to convert it to OBD1, and how hard is it?

Also, would the H22 tranny drop and fit perfectly into the 6th gen accord (mounting wise)?

I'm interested in this because I'm starting to save for an auto tranny swap.



Modified by tpot90 at 1:20 AM 4/12/2008

johnsoj0266

So let me get this straight. Even if the swap I buy comes with original ECU out of the JDM vehicle, I should not use that ECU? I guess I was thinking that if I used the ECU that originally controlled the H22A engine, then it should also control it (as originally designed) in my car since the ECU only controls the engine functions.

Then the only thing I would have to worry about was adjusting the engine harness routing (splicing, etc) to the LHD ECU location and make the connections from the inside Dash harness to the Engine harness for the Air Conditioning and other accessories.

Granted, I am new and don't have the experience doing this, but this seemed logical.

Thanks!

TheMuffinMan

iTrader: (1)

Lol wut?

You can use JDM ecu's I ran a JDM P13 in my car for QUITE awhile (I just swapped it the other day)

Convert the car to OBDI using a conversion harness, add the extra wires for the sensors you need (knock,etc) and BAM done.

You wouldn't be losing power at all.

johnsoj0266

Also, on the axels. The spline is the same with the F23A tranny and the H22A LSD?

One of swap shops I spoke with told I had to buy aftermarket axels for the swap. But I realize they may just be trying to make a sale.

As you said, either stay with my axels or the ones from the Lude. But, I will need to swap the half shaft if I stay with my axels, correct?

TheMuffinMan

iTrader: (1)

You know, based on reading the swap FAQ's since there's like 4 listed there (which I'm sure you read) you must have just looked over the part where it says that if you want F series axles, you use an F intermediate shaft, and if you use H axles, you use an H intermediate shaft.

Please read the damn FAQ's every answer is in them.

*edit*

And yes I realize there's not one that says "6th gen" but everything is practically the exact same as an OBDII 5th gen.

johnsoj0266

OK, OK. I got the axels down. Jeez. Yes, I did read some of the FAQ's, but maybe not all of them.

Anyway. Why is it that the way to go is with the OBDI swap? Is it simply cost? The OBDI swaps are definately cheaper than OBDII. Is there any other benefit?

But, from a CARB standpoint you not are supposed use an engine from a car that is older than yours. But, where I live we do not have emissions checks. So, I guess that is a mute point. But I had naturally assumed I needed buy an OBDII engine.

Why is it considered that an OBDII swap in to an OBDII vehicle is more difficult?

I apologize if my questions seem lame. But, unfortunately I don't have any friends that are into tuning, so my experience is not up to par.

Thanks!

TheMuffinMan

iTrader: (1)

1) Don't have to worry about immobilizers with OBDII (have to source out specific ECU's)
2) Tuning is 2000000000x more abundant (in fact non existent for OBDII
3) Unless you're in Cali you don't really have to worry about carb/emissions stuff


In reality, Tuning is the biggest one, if you ever want to go All motor or Turbo? Done, just get a chipped OBDI ecu and you're good. Not to mention upfront cost.

No problem on that, the FAQ's are INCREDIBLY useful and have tons of info. The OBDII vs OBDI isn't really in them to my knowledge however so I don't mind answering that at all.


*edit*

And so you know, I did a OBDI H22A in my 96 (OBDII) Accord. So what I'm saying does come with experience I also just tossed in a chipped P28 ECU.

johnsoj0266

Cool Man, I can save some money in the whole deal also. Well, not save, just spend less.

So I should use a chipped P28 ECU or the one that comes with the engine. Any real difference in performance? Where have you had the best luck finding one? What is a reasonable cost? I'll check Ebay and other places later today, I gotta go mow.

tpot90

So if I were to buy an H22a tranny, I would have to buy a p13 with it? And from there, i'd have to learn how to change out the ECU's. I'm with johnsoj0266 on this, I dont have any tuner friends that can help me with the ECU swap, so i'm full of questions.

TheMuffinMan

iTrader: (1)

Well your motor SHOULD come with a JDM P13 which is the stock H22 ecu. That one will do you perfectly fine (like 7700 rpm redline, etc) unless you start modding the thing.

Chipped P28's are roughly $150 or so and if you just have it running a stock map you WONT notice a difference as it'll just mimic the P13. But when you add like I/H/E you can free up some extra HP with a chipped ECU vs non.

As to finding them:

1) Junkyard 93 Honda Civic EX if you can get the ECU you're golden, send it to get chipped by someone

2) Buy it prechipped online (~$150 or so with base maps)

3) Steal it

I'm in the process currently of rechipping mine since it was directly soldered in (bad) so I'm adding a socket so the chip can be easily removed in the future.

johnsoj0266

I/H/E? You mean CAI, Header, Exhaust, right?

If so, I already have the CAI and Exhaust with Hi flow CAT/resonator. I plan to purchase a header with the engine, so I should have all that.

In that case, it might be worth my while to go with chipped P28. How much HP do you suppose it will be worth using the Mapped P28?

The reason I am asking is because I think I will have a little more cash left for something to include in the swap. So I am trying to decide what is going to get me more HP, an after market throttle body or chipped ECU.

If you have other thoughts on most bang for my buck besides the swap and I/H/E, I would really like to know.

Thanks Dude!!

johnsoj0266

Dude,

Are you only planning on swapping the tranny? If so, I can't answer your question about whether or not you need to swap the ECU. I can't imagine why you would, but I don't have the experience.

I suggest you make a new post.

Good Luck!!

TheMuffinMan

iTrader: (1)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by johnsoj0266 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I/H/E? You mean CAI, Header, Exhaust, right?

If so, I already have the CAI and Exhaust with Hi flow CAT/resonator. I plan to purchase a header with the engine, so I should have all that.

In that case, it might be worth my while to go with chipped P28. How much HP do you suppose it will be worth using the Mapped P28?

The reason I am asking is because I think I will have a little more cash left for something to include in the swap. So I am trying to decide what is going to get me more HP, an after market throttle body or chipped ECU.

If you have other thoughts on most bang for my buck besides the swap and I/H/E, I would really like to know.

Thanks Dude!!</TD></TR></TABLE>

Well here's the thing

1) The TB on the H22 is larger, so the intake from the F series will fit, but is smaller in diameter
2) I don't think the header will swap from F to H (dont quote me on this one though)

In regards to Exhaust you're good there. If you want to go all out right at once go for it, but keep in mind you'll want to tune it .

Personally I'd hold off, make sure the swap is 100% functional and good THEN spend money elsewhere.

I had to spend $400 on injectors and $100 on a knock sensor as well as some other stuff. But it adds up.

johnsoj0266

OK, I was sitting here thinking, bad idea!!

We were talking about the chipped P28. Can't I chip the P13? Once you chip it, what difference does it make?

I might have some time to send the P13 out before I swap.

TheMuffinMan

iTrader: (1)

You *can* but for whatever reason the support isn't there for them.

johnsoj0266

I haven't bought the header yet. so it is not an F23 header. I saw on another post where the F exhaust is 0 00 0 but the H22 is 0 0 0 0. Won't swap!! But I will be good since I will buy an H22A header. One question I have is what to do with the O2 sensor on the manifold but I have not started researching that.

I thought the larger throttle body is better for HP. So, why swap the F for the H? I thought an aftermarket TB would be larger and more free flowing. Agree? But which will provide more HP, chipped ECU or Aftermarket TB?

Even though you say you would not go for the gusto on the original swap, I am a risk taker. If it don't work right, I can put the P13 back in and be good until I figure it out.

johnsoj0266

who can chip it for me, the right way? No soldering as you said.

TheMuffinMan

iTrader: (1)

Ah nah, I'm saying the H22 has a larger TB, your intake is smaller but will fit on it.

As to chipping, off the top of my head I know phearable.net does it.

I'm going to be trying to chip my own with a socket haha. We'll see how it goes.

johnsoj0266

OK, but if it were you, with limited cash go for the chipped ECU or aftermarket TB?

TheMuffinMan

iTrader: (1)

Between just those two? Assuming everything else had been taken care of?

Chipped P28

johnsoj0266

Assuming everything else was taken care of. So far what that means to me is:

1. Engine is swapped
2. Wiring is complete
3. P13 ECU is in.
4. Engine is running as it should with a stock ECU.
5. I/H/E is installed.

Anything else to complete for a base set-up?

From there I would assume you would start going with other engine bolt-ons. i.e. TB, fuel rail, new injectors, chipped ECU etc.

What I am hoping is that I'll have about $300 to $400 left in my budget to get one or two of the additional bolt-ons.

When I asked which would you choose, chipped P28 or TB, I made an assumption that either of those would be the next logical steps. Thinking that larger injectors and high flow fuel rail won't do any good without more air.

If you think money would be wisely spent somewhere beside the P28 and/or TB, I sure would like to know from someone that obviously has the experience.

Thanks!!

FunnyVictor86

not to thread jack or anything but i have a rookie question, its emissions related ... ok so i have a 01 accord ex f23a4 obdII ... if i do a h22a4 swap with obdII ... ... will i be able to pass emissions? thanks ... ive always thought once you do a swap u wont pass ... can anyone point me in the right direction, thanks

FunnyVictor86

anyone?