Monotremata

A little confused here so figured better post here.. Have an 02 Accord SE (VIN# says its an SE although it also matches the 'Special Edition' too), good old engine code 0420 thats been plaguing me on and off for 2 years now and smog check time was due this past April. My engine # is the 3FK6 family (the CA SULEV VTEC 4cyl), yet NOBODY seems to have cats for that particular one. Ive found lots of them for the 3PNP, 3RDA, 3MTJ engines but none for mine. Found the Walker 81767 on Amazon (its for the PNP/RDA) and one of the questions on it asks specifically about my engine, and it says it works fine. Am I good to buy this or am I stuck having to go get an OEM one or something?? Replaced the front oxygen sensor at the beginning of the month, and that was a pain too because go figure the California SULEV Accords have to buy the expensive ones, just like the cats..

schreps

Eastern Catalytic has CARB compliant converters. CARB Compliant California Applications - Eastern Manufacturing
But even they don't have a direct fit converter. The part they recommend is 630008, but will require welding.
You might want to give them a call.

Monotremata

Thats one of the other ones I ran across. Its a direct fit, no welding at all. That one is also for the same engine families, 3PNP/3RDA. Not a single mention about the 3FK6 at all. That ones pretty much the same as the Walker, only a little cheaper, and it actually comes with the gaskets for it. Still not sure what to do. Cant afford to go to a dealer or shop to fix it, and damn thats an expensive gamble if I buy one and it doesn't pass smog. Probably have to find someone that will just pass it for me for now so I have until the next one to get it fixed properly haha.

schreps

If you buy a CARB compliant cat that is specific to your car and it doesn't pass its because the engine has issues (oil consumption, o2 sensor, MAP, leaky injectors, really bad plugs/ignition, etc), not the cats fault... Call Eastern.

Monotremata

Yeah I'm gonna have to call somebody. Looking at the CARB cat database yesterday, my engine isn't even listed!! But I did notice the PNP/RDA motors are LEV, and the MJT is ULEV. Makes me wonder if I should get the MJT one since my 3FK6 is an SULEV engine... Gonna call Walker Monday.

Monotremata

Well, that solves that. Called the muffler place up the street for a quote today. After he looked up the engine group, he goes "Oooooh yeah sorry thats a dealer only part. If you wait a couple months they might release an aftermarket one".. Yeah its uh a 2002 dude.. I think it would've come out by now.. Gotta call one of the Honda shops tomorrow and see if they can get it, of course the two here in town are closed on Mondays.. Before he actually looked up the engine number, he quoted about $300 out the door installed heh. Im assuming thats the PNP/RDA ones, you lucky bastards..

schreps

A new honda cat will be north of $700, however if you have the original honda cat on the car and if it still contains most of the catalyst then the core exchange can be a couple hundred bucks. Dont let them sell you a new cat and give you nothing for the old one. Honda apparently put a lot of platinum in their cats...

Monotremata

Holy crap, more like $1950 JUST for the cat!!! I called the Norm Reeves Honda place thats near me and the guy in the parts department was even shocked when he looked it up. Everything about this stupid engine costs at least twice what the other three models do what the hell were they thinking? No way this things getting smogged any time soon. Gotta try a couple other places tomorrow just for giggles but this isn't looking good so far. I bought an entire engine for my 2000 Civic LX for half the price of this catalytic converter heh.

hondaslave1342

Have you tried a online honda dealer..i checked magsauto and its 900 for you car

Monotremata

I would if I could find one! All the google searching Ive done for this engine, this is the first Ive even heard of Magsauto hah. Even searching for 3FK6 just brings up tons of info about every engine but mine. $900 is still way too much but its better than $2000 I guess.

EDIT: Ive found a few Honda dealers online and am still out of luck.. My car needs Honda OEM part 18160-PAA-L40 (I think). Its been discontinued and no one has it in stock now. Honda basically stranded everyone in California that bought these or what? The one I found at Mag Auto was the 18160-PAA-305. It was $700 something but while Mag said its CA legal, the replacement Bosal makes for that model says its not.

hondaslave1342

are you putting your vin number in the search box..i use hondapartsnow.com to search because its more user friendly and magsauto to purchase..it will show you exactly what part your car needs by vin..even though it might say discontinued i have a number to search what dealer still stocks it

Monotremata

Mag Auto told me it couldn't find the VIN haha. I just went to hondapartsnow.com, apparently I used it before because it already had my info in it.. That one shows me the 18160-PAA-L21 now as the converter I need. Its $1208 heh. I found a indie Honda place in town today that said they could do it for like $450. I asked the guy 'Youre sure thats for the 2002 SULEV Accord??', he said it was an aftermarket one but it would work. Maybe they have some magical source for aftermarket parts the rest of us don't have I don't know. Might as well give it a shot. Ordered a new secondary O2 sensor today too for it. Should've replaced it when I replaced the front one anyways. Who knows, maybe that will get rid of the P0420 code on its own. The front one went bad after 16 years, who's to say the one in the cat didnt too.. My brake lights go out the same way, first one then the other follows a week or so later haha.

MAD_MIKE

Is P0420 your only code?
How many miles?
When was the last time you had a tuneup? Replaced plugs, wires, cap, rotor, is the O2 sensor lazy?
Valve adjustment?
Cleaned out the EGR ports?

P0420 does not mean the cat is faulty, it just means 'below catalyst threshold efficiency' and if the car is out of tune, has a slight misfire or in need of something else the catalyst can only do so much in keeping emissions in check. A lazy primary O2 can also cause the engine to run out of tune, yet not set a proper code.
Honda Speed Density systems are a bit on the slow/lazy side of self diagnostics.

redgtxdi

Hi all......I'm waking this thread from the dead. I too have a CA 2002 SE. It's throwing P0420. Now....I've deal with this in cars before where it was literally just a fault primary O2 sensor.

Mine's got 166,000 miles on it and is extremely clean, was VERY well maintained. (Literally bought this from single owner at 140,000 miles who had meticulous records from mostly stealership and it's literally like sitting in a 5 year old car, not a 20 year old car)

Anyway........codes are P0420 for both banks (1 of 2, 2 of 2 if that matters) And as this thread reveals.....these cats are $$$$$ so I'd really rather not go this route, especially if it's an O2 sensor.

Anything learned from this OP??? And/or any other/new suggestions???

TIA!!!

MAD_MIKE

Verify the basics first
Fully charged, and holding voltage, battery.
Verify battery connections and cables are clean and tight.
Verify main ground, harness ground, and bonding jumpers are clean and tight.
Verify condition of ignition(plugs/wires/cap/rotor) system. Weak spark will cause an incomplete burn.
Verify the EGR port isn't restricted, remove upper plenum from runners and note if the EGR port is carbon fouled. This will cause a lean burn condition at part throttle cruise.
Verify the valves are adjusted correctly not tight. Loss of compression will cause a misfire.
Verify correct fuel pressure. Low pressure will reduce the effective fuel flow/spray from the injectors. You can artificially raise it by clamping the return hose, then the FPR may be dying. If the fuel pressure doesn't change then the pump may be dying/clogged. Before replacing the fuel pump, verify correct battery voltage is getting to the pump. Corroded connections, damaged wiring, bad grounds can cause slow pump operation which in turn would cause low pressure. Including bad contacts in the Main Relay.
Verify there are no exhaust air leaks. False air will cause incorrect A/F readings or allow excess air into the catalyst which will cause incorrect function.
If you are handy with a volt meter, I would suggest going over the common sensors (MAP/TPS/Thermo/IAT) and verify they are working in correct(expected) range.

SE's used a proper A/F sensor(wide band) which may be a bit harder to diagnose with a volt meter.
If you have a scanner look at your fuel trims. STFT will move about quite a bit, but if your LTFT are at 10% something is goofy with the air or fuel system, not the catalyst. Watch your O2 sensor readings, it should be fairly active, if it is lazy that will cause incorrect fueling issues which in itself will not trip a code for O2, usually kicks the P0420 code first. And that is often misinterpreted as a 'bad catalyst'. Holding the engine at 2500rpm, then rev it quickly to 4000rpm and then let off the pedal, watch the O2 output. It should change dramatically. If not or very slow to change, then your O2 may be lazy and is in need of replacement.

Calif SEs were F23A4 with the 'smarter' PCM. Still a speed density system and still capable of just chucking a code that will point you in the direction of the problem and not the actual issue.
Be smarter than your tools. Diagnose and diagnose thoroughly. Verify before throwing parts at the problem(s).

redgtxdi

Wow.....very thorough!!

Thank you Mike! I don't have a scanner so can't do everything you mentioned but I've already done all the rest and changed plugs out to be sure as they were looking pretty tired (just did regular V-power coppers exactly like what was in before).

I did also remove and thoroughly clean throttle body (it was carboned up pretty bad) which also took care of "sticky throttle" problem. (nice)

After TB and plugs she certainly runs much smoother (idles beautifully now) and that alone is a great reward.

I didn't check EGR port so will have to look that one up.

So just having family members drive around (2020 covid, nobody drives much these days) just to get enough miles in since I reset the codes.

Thanks again very much!!