Does Uberdata simply read the values off of the wideband controller?

Can't you connect the wideband straight to the laptop (through USB cable might have to use a similar technique to data logging where you use the mobile phone data cable to convert analog to digital signal) and make Uberdata read the values from the USB port? The only use the controller has is to prevent a CEL as far as I see it.

I'd like to hear from those experienced with wideband setups as well as electronics/programming skills.

What do you think? Can it be done with only a wideband sensor and a simple electronics hook up?

 

check pgmfi.org to see if there is already a program out there that does it. I've heard of a program called ECUcontrol and one or two others, but I cant remember the name. Maybe these can do what you are talking about.

 

Basically, I'd like to be able to datalog with Uberdata using a wideband sensor without buying the extra accessories ( a/f display, controller, etc.)

Thanks for the link! I'll check it out

 

While reading through some of the links on there this caught my eye:
"AND if the MM meter falls thru, one can always use the bare LSM-11 sensor
by measuring it's voltage and also the temp and using the Bosch data to
manually calculate the a/f ratio."

That's kind of what I was thinking. Plug the sensor signals in the laptop and then workout the A/F in software (preferably Uberdata could do it) for datalogging purposes. I think right now Uberdata just reads the data off the controller which basically does those calculations in hardware (electronics) instead of the cheaper option (software).

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by civic_driver &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Basically, I'd like to be able to datalog with Uberdata using a wideband sensor without buying the extra accessories ( a/f display, controller, etc.)

Thanks for the link! I'll check it out</TD></TR></TABLE>

So pretty much turning your laptop into what used to be the WB controller? If that's what you're thinking about doing, then I dont know how you would do it. You would have to figure out how to interface your WBO2S into the laptop, but I'm almost certain that wont work. You could also have the WBO2S feed into the ECU, and use UD to read the info off of the ECU and send it to the laptop where a custom program can convert the voltage numbers, but in that case I think UD would loose some of it's functionality with datalogging and autotuning.

I'm just brainstorming, but IMO it woud just be easier to get a WB setup. They're only $300-$330, but if you cant afford that you could always use somebody elses WB setup or use the one at your local dyno facility.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by civic_driver &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Plug the sensor signals in the laptop and then workout the A/F in software </TD></TR></TABLE>

AFAIK O2 sensors send out voltage signals to the ECU. I dont even know if it's possible for your laptop to differentiate the different voltages being put out by your O2 sensor. You would have to make some sort of special convertor for that, or better yet buy a WB controller, which is made specifically for that task.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by civic_driver &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Basically, I'd like to be able to datalog with Uberdata using a wideband sensor without buying the extra accessories ( a/f display, controller, etc.)

Thanks for the link! I'll check it out</TD></TR></TABLE>

You need a controller. Uberdata will do the rest if you feed the wideband info to your cars ecu. Have you been here:? http://uberdata.pgmfi.org/forum/

 

Both Uberdata and ECUControl require the wideband signal be fed into the ECU on the O2 sensor wire. Then you read the values from the ECU through the CN2 pins and a TTL to serial or TTL to USB cable is used to get the info into the COM port on your PC and displaying in Uberdata and ECUControl. They use the CN2 pins because they can send commands through the cable to the ECU to get almost any parameter the ECU sees. Now some widebands come with their own separate datalogging software that logs the A/F and other sensors if you tap those wires. That info can't be fed into Uberdata or ECUControl in any way so you gotta decide which way you want to go. The cheapest way would be to datalong in Uberdata with a cheap wideband controller that doesn't come with a display or datalogging on its own such as a techedge or PLX-250.

 

Well, the O2 sensor feeds the voltages/signal to the USB port where Uberdata takes over and translates those unto the chart directly... wouldn't that work?

So say an O2 sensor has a voltage between 0-5... 0 being 10afr and 5 being 18afr or whatever the case might be for that specific O2 sensor. Then you just use a formula... 10+voltage/(18-10) and there you have your number for plotting... wouldnt that work? And the way to feed the signal to the USB port is either directly (i'm not sure if it will work) or convert the signal to TTL so that the laptop can read it from the USB.

 

Oh I see. So you feed the signal to the ECU and then you read it from PC. I see. Well, in that case, why do you need the controller in the first place?

 

The O2 sensor doesn't send **** to Uberdata. The ECU sends the info to Uberdata because Uberdata asks the ECU for the information. All the wideband does is send out a voltage that can be sent to a display or into the O2 sensor wire on the ECU. As far as hooking up a wideband output straight to a PC you would need some hardware that reads in the voltage and can communicate that through some protocol to the computer. The common solution would be RS232 through the com port just like Uberdata uses. That is provided with the widebands that can datalog like the LM-1, Zeitronix, and upper PLX models.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by civic_driver &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Oh I see. So you feed the signal to the ECU and then you read it from PC. I see. Well, in that case, why do you need the controller in the first place?</TD></TR></TABLE>

You need a controller because the actual ouput of a wideband sensor is not linear. Like if you went out and just bought a 4 wire wideband NGK sensor, you couldn't make heads or tails of the voltages it gives you. The actual controller box interprets those voltages and makes it into a linear output (for most) so that it can then be fed to the ECU or a gauge.

 

its obvious you have no idea what a wideband controller does...

get a lc-1...$199 w/ a sensor....wire the wblin output from the wbo2 controller to pin d14....then datalog in uber...end of story

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by King Tut33 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">You need a controller because the actual ouput of a wideband sensor is not linear. Like if you went out and just bought a 4 wire wideband NGK sensor, you couldn't make heads or tails of the voltages it gives you. The actual controller box interprets those voltages and makes it into a linear output (for most) so that it can then be fed to the ECU or a gauge.</TD></TR></TABLE>

What he said.

-The O2 puts out its whack-*** voltage that only the controller understands
-The controller interprets the whack-*** stuff and converts it to something the ECU understands
-ECU takes in the data from the Controller
-ECU sends the data via TX line in the USB cable to your laptop and UD converts it to a visual that you can understand.

I see what you're saying w/ just getting a sensor and making a converter so you can datalog directly into your PC, but after all the time going into figuring out WTF the O2 is sending and being able to make a converter that could change it to something your PC could read your better off just getting a Sensor/Controller package.

Contact Ben@Importparts.com
PLX M-300 WB w/ digital readout controller for 310 shipped. If you don't want the digital readout you could probably go with a M-100/200 setup.

 

Which parameters will I be able to datalog if I buy the LC-1 with Uberdata?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by civic_driver &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Which parameters will I be able to datalog if I buy the LC-1 with Uberdata?</TD></TR></TABLE>

You will be able to get every parameter that Uberdata can datalog once you connect a laptop to your ecu and run Uberdata. Go download 1.7, open up a .bin, and go to the datalogging tab to see which parameters it does.

 

So what is the deal with the RPM converter that Innovative sells?

Also, if LC-1 works why are people buying PXL, LM-1 and the other wideband kits?

 

LM-1 has problems if you want to have it output an analog voltage to crome/uberdata etc...because the heater ground and analoug output ground are the same...this causes a cycling effect as the heater turns on and off...the lc-1 was designed after the fact and has two seperate grounds...one for each....

Plx is alright...def not the best out there....LM-1 is nice as a standalone...but if I were even considering those id purchase a techedge diy kit...if you handy...or even a built one...the lm-1 is a lil nice and has some cool features...but it terms on what i need...i need it to work right w/ my tuning software....the cheaper plx doesnt have dataloggin...so thats crap

if you plan on using any honda rom editor...plain and simple the lc-1 is the answer...if you plan on doing any tuning not using a rom editor...for ex...a vafc...youd need a wbo2 that can take inputs so you can use their software to tune...hence the lm-1 and techedge

 

I'll be tunning for larger injectors without having turbo as a start but I'm putting turbo eventually (as soon as I get my turbo setup read). I'm waiting for my burner and chippable ECU parts so I can get that out of the way. While I'm doing this I wanna get a wideband so I can get ready for tunning/datalogging.

Are you saying that the pxl m-300, lc-1, lm1 can only datalog AFR in uberdata? No rpms, or other stuff without ordering their more advanced kits?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by civic_driver &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I'll be tunning for larger injectors without having turbo as a start but I'm putting turbo eventually (as soon as I get my turbo setup read). I'm waiting for my burner and chippable ECU parts so I can get that out of the way. While I'm doing this I wanna get a wideband so I can get ready for tunning/datalogging.

Are you saying that the pxl m-300, lc-1, lm1 can only datalog AFR in uberdata? No rpms, or other stuff without ordering their more advanced kits?</TD></TR></TABLE>

What you just said is pretty much what I had planned on doing. Installing the injectors and tuning NA. That way you figure out how to tune and get a good understanding of what your rom editor/widband system is capable of.

If you datalog with uberdata it should get all the RPM/VAC information from the ECU, so you really don't need a wideband that gives you RPM/VAC information.

I have a PLX and I love it for what it does. But then again I'm sure there are cheaper systems that do the same thing.

 

all you use the wideband for when using UD is to datalog lambda...etc which is a/f

you use the ecu via a usb cable to get the rpms/ect/etc.... directly from the ecu

you could also use each wideband's companies seperate sofwtare to datalog...techedge has tewblog....lm-1 has logworks...and plx i havent used their software....so basically if you didnt have uberdata youd need a way to get those signals....you do this buy wiring them up to the wideband and then using the software to show you what the cars doing...then buy your tuning prog you make changes...etc

btw
LM-1 can datalog
&
Techedge....

LC-1 does not datalog...it just outputs a voltage that the ecu can understand in turn which you view in uberdata...

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by drumking15 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">all you use the wideband for when using UD is to datalog lambda...etc which is a/f

you use the ecu via a usb cable to get the rpms/ect/etc.... directly from the ecu

you could also use each wideband's companies seperate sofwtare to datalog...techedge has tewblog....lm-1 has logworks...and plx i havent used their software....so basically if you didnt have uberdata youd need a way to get those signals....you do this buy wiring them up to the wideband and then using the software to show you what the cars doing...then buy your tuning prog you make changes...etc

btw
LM-1 can datalog
&
Techedge....

LC-1 does not datalog...it just outputs a voltage that the ecu can understand in turn which you view in uberdata...</TD></TR></TABLE>

Oh, I didn't know you could datalog directly from the wideband. As for the PLX systems, I haven't seen any datalogging software (I haven't looked).

I just figured you would have to use your ROM editor to do any type of datalogging.

Learn something everyday

 

on mine, i datalogged thru uberdata using the plx narrowband out wire in place of the original o2 sensor wire and disabling the o2 sensor and closed loop on my .bin file. i tried using wideband out for a while, and it seemed to work fine, although it would randomly throw an o2 sensor code every once in a while. using the narrowband output (which is just as accurate as the wideband out btw, only the voltage is scaled), it hasnt given me any trouble at all.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by civic_driver &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Also, if LC-1 works why are people buying PXL, LM-1 and the other wideband kits?</TD></TR></TABLE>

I'm buying the PLX-M300 because quite frankly I want a display to verify the numbers I am getting in Uberdata are correct. With the LC-1 you have to assume that what it is feeding the ECU is what Uberdata is looking for. Now if you hook up a guage to the LC-1 then you can verify that what you see on the gauge is what you see in Uberdata.

 

Your last post answers my question.

If anyone has more review/info to add, they're much appreciated.

Thanks!