tegedrex

Well looking into buying some rods and pistons. I know that a few friends have had good luchk with all-motor weisco pistons(not sure about boost), and read all the rave about CP's. Just wanted to know if anyone had any input on this, thnx?

A.RODD

ARIAS PISTONS...

Garcia-Racing

CP

turbotypeR@SPEC

wiseco

94gsr4dr

CP

tegedrex

any ryme or reason for preference?

Garcia-Racing

Price, availability, and a great rep.

Blind-Fashion

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by turbotypeR &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">wiseco </TD></TR></TABLE>

The Destroyer

Both are great peices, but im prob getting wiseco's just because they are a little cheaper and im on a budget.

Wiseco & CP.

Blueprint

both CP and Weisco are great pistons. CP are more expensive but you can get them cheaper than Wiseco from Camp1320.com

I chose to use CP cus Camp takes care of me and will handle any problems that i have struggled thru.When you get great service 24/7 and i mean 24/7 and have no worries why choose anything else.

According to Camp CP have the highest tolorance and said he(Camp1320) is willing to test all the stock shelf pistons from each company.

I remember something about Arias and CP going at it a few months back did anyone do the test for those 2?

GT61 this 1.8t

well coming from a different base of enthusiests (VW), im a wiseco fan....
wiseco has the most up todate facility incomparison to names like JE and CP.
the price is right, and the wiseco name is represented pretty well on all sides of the motorsports spectrum...
from bikes(ama road racing, suprcross, motocross etc etc), to drag cars(your typical weekend worrier or your profesional series contenders) , to road racing, to nascar(rolls eyes), etc etc...
im a fan of my $425 wiseco piston set, which includes all rings, pins, and clips. with tool steel wristpin upgrade...
all for 425 bucks...
just gotta find the right dealer

GEN2TEG

I had a set of Weisco's in my turbo setup and now have CP's. Nothing wrong with the Weisco's really, just that I've jumped on the CP ban wagon and they are raved about and proven. Many of the high HP guys use them on here and I can say there great.

You can't go wrong with either set. The Weisco's will probably save you a bit of cash.


Modified by GEN2TEG at 6:58 PM 6/21/2004

Flamenco-T

HKS or GReddy ? You can't go wrong with either of them.

I sell them both as well and this is the logical thing that always works for me when customer asks me which is better. It usually comes down the CR that needed. All Honda B-Series and D series for shelf sizes only have a selection of 8.8 or 9.8:1 CR for the flat top ( turbo motors ) while CP offer a little bit more variety in CR selection.

Stan

turbotypeR@SPEC

i think they all make great pistons.i have used almost all brands and prefer wiseco.i just my first set of cp and had a bad ring.it was sticking in the ring groove. je's seem "wimpy" to me(not to mention i have melted a few of my own).the wiseco's are cheaper by about $100,they have been around for a long time,and the last set i did had a perfect ring gap right out of teh box.i mean they were all exactly the same and were dead on perfect gaped right out of the box.i was not expecting that,but was very impressed

earl

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by turbotypeR &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">.i just my first set of cp and had a bad ring.it was sticking in the ring groove. je's seem "wimpy" to me(not to mention i have melted a few of my own)</TD></TR></TABLE>I will guarantee that no ring has ever stuck in a CP. You would have had to messed up while gapping the ring or bent it when installing it. The rings must be deburred after gapping.
To say JE seems wimpy, you really don't have a clue what you are dealing with. You cannot judge a piston by how it looks.
It's not JE's fault if you melt pistons, it's the tuner.

earl

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by GT61 this 1.8t &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">wiseco has the most up todate facility incomparison to names like JE and CP.
</TD></TR></TABLE>That is an ignorant statement. You have never been to CP or JE to say that. CP is a brand new facility with state of the art million dollar measuring devices that no other piston manufacturer has. Guys walking around in white masks in clean rooms taking measurements on ProStock, Nascar pistons or Harley prostock bike pistons. JE has just moved into a new building also.

ekb18c

I like Arias Pistons also. If you are reading this Tom, you owe me $1.

yellowturbo

IMO all those brands are good...you should look for the avaibility of each brand and the service that the seller deserve you... I choose to buy CP from Earl and they worked great for me !

PM-Performance

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by earl &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">That is an ignorant statement. You have never been to CP or JE to say that. CP is a brand new facility with state of the art million dollar measuring devices that no other piston manufacturer has. Guys walking around in white masks in clean rooms taking measurements on ProStock, Nascar pistons or Harley prostock bike pistons. JE has just moved into a new building also. </TD></TR></TABLE>


Did you know that Weisco actually makes the pistons for JE? I know someone who actually cuts the pistons down there on the fording press So i get some inside info.
Weisco actually makes their own , JE, SRP, Endyne and i think another companies pistons for them. Then send em out and they modify them slightly. I also was told that Weisco has this sick new technology of forging process. So if you notices the newer styles of their pistons should look a little diff.

W C L

i like cp!!!! all i ever used in all the motors i built

GT61 this 1.8t

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by itr206 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">


Did you know that Weisco actually makes the pistons for JE? I know someone who actually cuts the pistons down there on the fording press So i get some inside info.
Weisco actually makes their own , JE, SRP, Endyne and i think another companies pistons for them. Then send em out and they modify them slightly. I also was told that Weisco has this sick new technology of forging process. So if you notices the newer styles of their pistons should look a little diff. </TD></TR></TABLE>
this is the same info i heard...
so earl... im sorry i make ignorant statments...
didnt mean to ruffle your feathers...
im sorry wiseco has one of the most technologicly advanced facilities...
and from what i have seen it stands true...

h22 civic

CP

Rob Dizzle

looks like most peoples replys are meaningless or not very helpful.

like if all you have ever used is one brand, isnt it subjective to your own limited experience of what piston you like?

I wrote this article a couple months ago to help out people find whats best for them.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
When I first started learning about pistons I was confused. All pistons
looked the same, I couldn’t tell what qualities in a piston made it good or better than the next guy. Here are some things to look out for when you are piston shopping.

Weight
The lighter the better is the rule when it comes to pistons. The less that the piston weighs, the more power it will make with all things being equal. The problem is, all things are not made equal in this industry. And weight is not the all end answer. Skirt design is very, very important. Coatings make a big difference too. You could have a piston weighing 20 grams more that is coated make more horsepower just because of the lesser friction. This costs money though… Designing a lightweight piston is a difficult task for the piston manufacturer. The engineers and designers of the piston want to make it as light as possible, but not too light to the point where it sacrifices piston strength and durability.

Optimal Compression
Most piston companies have what they call “shelf pistons” those are pistons that they make a lot of and hence keep a lot on the shelf or in stock. Before the piston company makes a huge batch of piston part # XYZ, they try to decide what would most people want to buy. The down side to this is they only have about 3 through 4 compressions to choose from. What do you do when you want a 10:1 piston, and they only offer 10.5:1? The best thing to do here is use the market to your advantage to save time, and money. Use a slightly thicker head gasket to solve this problem, or have a machine ship mill some thousands off the dome, which is perfectly safe and will solve your problem. If there is only 11.5:1, and you want 12:1, the answer is simple, use a slightly thinner head gasket, or have your head resurfaced to the proper amount, which is very minor. If your replacing pistons, your resurfacing the head every time anyway! And also people, do not get caught up in “exact” compression numbers. If it says 9:1 on the box, that means, by the manufacturers calculations, using “THEIR” formula, its 9:1. But in reality, your motor is different than the calculations they used, so you are going to be anywhere from 8.8-9.2:1. You won’t even know the difference…

Valve Relief Depth
As discussed in the cam gear article, more power can be made from using your cam gears to advance or retard the cams. It’s a common misconception in the industry that larger domes on the piston give you LESS valve clearance. This could not be farther from the truth. The height of the dome has nothing to do with the valve clearance at all. The height of the dome only matters with the spark plug clearance in most cases. Valve clearance is measured from the end of the valve, to the base of the valve relief on the piston. You can have your valve relief 20 thousands deeper than type-r pistons, and yet still have a full maximum dome piston. A perfect example of this is the IB Spec Super Duper piston. Maximum compression, with maximum tuning in mind. Also, in terms of valve pocket diameter, most all aftermarket pistons have 1 MM oversize valve pockets to allow for oversize valves. Going 1 MM oversize valves will require checking for side clearance. In all Honestly, even Type-R pistons offer acceptable piston valve relief depth with most cams on the market. Its only with the full race motors, and motors where maximum potential is needed would you want valve relief depths farther than type-R Honda spec, which is about 200 thousands deep on the intake side. Most aftermarket pistons are this depth. They don’t need to be deeper in 99% of all cases. Only with very milled heads, and the very, very large cams do you need more.

Results
The sales person at the shop made those shiny pistons he had in his show case sound really good. He had a convincing pitch to you, and all of your friends seem to have heard that those pistons were good. All of that doesn’t matter unless the piston makes good power. Ask the shop to see some dynos of those pistons used in another customer’s car. Or even better talk to the owner of the car who is running the pistons that someone is trying to sell you. But do not talk to the Pro racers who get paid, or receive free pistons to run in their car. That is a biased opinion, and you probably won’t get any dyno plots to back it up. You want to go with the proven enthusiast on the street, which does not get paid, but rather spends their own money to get pistons. If they are making the power with a certain brand, and you get that brand, then you have the same potential as him.

Coatings
If a piston is coated it can increase power because of reduced friction
against the sidewalls. No manufacturer can tell you how long the coating will last, because that is all up to the user of the engine and the way they were installed. Not all coatings are created equal. Just because XYZ manufacture offers a coating it doesn’t mean that it’s the best. In the future more articles will be released on the differences of the available coatings. As the consumer who is looking for the most reliable power I would recommend researching on your own about coating any all the other points that are brought up in this article. For 2004, Wiseco is currently the only manufacturer that offers coatings on all their stock shelf items. Other manufacturers will offer it from $40-$100 per set, other big piston companies offer them if ordered on a custom basis. Any piston can be brought to a private coating company to have a custom coating based upon the specifications and requirements of the newly built engine.

Price
Price has nothing to do with how well a piston performs. The pistons are stupid! They don’t know how much they cost, they only know their role in the motor. Real life results speak for themselves and ignore the price and look at the results. If the middle ground price piston makes a lot of horsepower buy it. Some of the piston companies charge different rates trying to achieve this “status”. That might fool some people, but when all the pistons are made from the same aluminum, with similar machines it comes down to design.

Marketing Ploys
A lot of the big piston companies sponsor a lot of cars. They want to give off the impression that since all the big name racers use them, then they make the best piston that makes the most amount of power. Don’t let that fool you into choosing your next piston. Usually the only reason why some teams are sponsored by different brand pistons is because of money. Racing teams always cost a lot, and a team will always want to reduce cost and have more money to use for the race effort. That is why race teams are usually always open arms to a big piston company coming in and giving them free pistons and money if they say that the piston company is best and run big stickers on the side of the car. On the other hand, if the race team is having a lot of wins and the engine is reliable and makes big power. The choice of piston does have a determinate on that equation.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

turbotypeR@SPEC

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by earl &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I will guarantee that no ring has ever stuck in a CP. You would have had to messed up while gapping the ring or bent it when installing it. The rings must be deburred after gapping.
To say JE seems wimpy, you really don't have a clue what you are dealing with. You cannot judge a piston by how it looks.
It's not JE's fault if you melt pistons, it's the tuner.</TD></TR></TABLE>
sorry dude,but they did stick.they were de-burred after gapping.and they were not "bent".they were simply to thick in one spot.i don't remember the thickness,but i promise it was to thick in one spot.everybody makes a mistake every now and then.they understood and sent me a new one right away.i am not saying they are junk,in fact,i think they are very nice.
and i am sorry,but i do have a clue in what i am dealing with.on je's stock bore b18c pistons,the valve reliefs are cut so far off that there is no material around the edge,therefore creating the "wimpy" spot i am reffering to.they don't have to be made that way,the stock ones do not go over the edge.now i am not saying that other brands would not be the same way,because i have not used other brands in stock bore yet.not to mention that i have used three sets of je's and the valve reliefs were cut in a different spot each time.
i was merely giving the guy my opinion based on my experience.i think just about all aftermarket forged pistons are very good,i was just stating the one i prefer.however you want to look at it,wiseco will get the job done and cost you about $100 less.

BodyKits NW

Both companies make a great pistons. Like some have said, it's all about the compression you wanna run. Some manuf. have more of a selection of compression ratios for there shelf stock.

If your block is bored and honed to spec then you should have no problem with either piston. I do prefer CP because of the customer service and quality product they give me.