my bad

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by fjt &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">they come in 40 over which means going up to 76 mm..On the stock sleeves i wouldnt bore that much unless i keep it low boost...Or re sleeve</TD></TR></TABLE>

Why are people such weiners? .040" over aint ****. Thats half a millimeter of bore. A good hone could take that much material off.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by fjt &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">lol if they were 74.5 they could dance in the sleeve..and they WOULD NOT hold compression for ****...</TD></TR></TABLE>

I think your 100% wrong on this. Look at JE or SRP setups, you can see the rings when you look down in the cylinder from the top. I mean, we're talking about 1/4, ONE FREAKING QUARTER of a millimeter all the way around of a difference in bore. For example, look at the thickness of your fingernail, thats pretty close to a millimeter. Now, imagine it was a quarter the thickness. Thats how much of a difference in gap you would see with a 74.5mm piston in a 75mm bore; and I'm pretty sure you couldnt tell the difference with your naked eye.

[/rant]

I think the clearance for my Endyn's was something like .030", thats pretty close to a millimeter. And I do believe Endyn's are on the tighter end of the clearances spectrum.

Vitara's need the extra clearance because they expand more under extreme conditions because they are not a true forged piston.

 

Well, it looks like I'm dealing with this now too. It runs super strong and theres no metal whatsoever in the oil. I just gotta live with the noise....

 

I thought it was already mentioned that they are not a true 75mm, but are instead 74.5. Wouldn't that account some for the clearances?

 

Does it matter the pistons sit considerably lower in the block than the stock pistons? My friend was tellin me that some people were saying they had nics at the top where the pistons stop...anyone else hear of this?

 

The noise is NOT piston slap...If it was piston slap my motor would have blown a long time ago and the skirts of the sleeves would be toasted...Piston slap on a motor wont make it last for ****..
The noise is simply due to the full floating..

"Ohh but i dont hear that noise with aftermarket floating pistons." Reason is they use a different bushing(i think is copper) so the sound is different and its is tighter.

Have you ever hear a Suzuki vitara? They make the same noise in the same car/motor theyre for...SO its not piston slap.

2. Measure the Honda OEM pistons and see if theyre a True 75mm...the answer most likelly will be no.. 75mm is the diameter of the INNER face of the sleeve..so the piston cant be exactly 75mm..otherwise it wouldnt slide in there..It has to be slightly smaller(like a 74.98 as example)..If OEMs were a true 75mm then your piston to sleeve wall clearance would be 0...and its never 0

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by fjt &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">The noise is NOT piston slap...If it was piston slap my motor would have blown a long time ago and the skirts of the sleeves would be toasted...Piston slap on a motor wont make it last for ****..
The noise is simply due to the full floating..

"Ohh but i dont hear that noise with aftermarket floating pistons." Reason is they use a different bushing(i think is copper) so the sound is different and its is tighter.

Have you ever hear a Suzuki vitara? They make the same noise in the same car/motor theyre for...SO its not piston slap.

2. Measure the Honda OEM pistons and see if theyre a True 75mm...the answer most likelly will be no.. 75mm is the diameter of the INNER face of the sleeve..so the piston cant be exactly 75mm..otherwise it wouldnt slide in there..It has to be slightly smaller(like a 74.98 as example)..If OEMs were a true 75mm then your piston to sleeve wall clearance would be 0...and its never 0</TD></TR></TABLE>

Good info...that clears up the part about the noise these put out. But how about the fact they sit lower in the block? Does that have any effect on wear at the top of the sleeves?

I'm basically sold on these pistons...I just wanna put this last rumor to rest.

 

^^^ agreed. Good post and that should clear up all the questions.

 

i heard a suzuki vitara lil weird lookin car...sorta like toyota rav4 but thats not the point the they do sound like disel engine is really noisy... H23 eg hybrid just hurry and get them piston foo....lets boost the crap out of the 14b

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by GunMETAL_TEgRa &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i heard a suzuki vitara lil weird lookin car...sorta like toyota rav4 but thats not the point the they do sound like disel engine is really noisy... H23 eg hybrid just hurry and get them piston foo....lets boost the crap out of the 14b</TD></TR></TABLE>

Gotta find out if that block is still salvagable first. If it's not...might look around for another block or do the same thing you did with the block installed in my car right now.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by EJ1 wilcox &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Oh, okay...

I'll just look for a block that has low miles or is in really good condition, that way I won't have to take much off the cylinder walls when I hone.

What about getting the side skirts coated? I would think that woud tighten the clearances up a bit. Has anyone tried that?</TD></TR></TABLE>

I coated mine. http://www.techlinecoatings.com/Engine.htm

I used dfl1 on the skirts and cbc1 on the tops, valves, chambers, and exhaust ports. I dingle berry honed my block. I still got a little noise upon start up. I have not yet installed the turbo, I have only run it n/a. I'll let you kids know when I boost it.

Also, Techline stated on their site,"Requires no clearance changes to compensate for the coating" I'm kind of curious how much room the coating actually took up.

H23, I milled .075 off my a6 block to get some compression out of these slugs. I also took some off the head too. What's funny is I simply jumped a tooth on the cam gear and it all lined up.



Modified by Foowee at 10:02 PM 11/27/2005

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by EJ1 wilcox &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

WTF?

You need to hone the walls man... honing doesn't take much off the walls at all..

You will need a fresh hone to make sure the rings seat properly. I don't think steel wool will do the job. </TD></TR></TABLE>

and i think honing is to equal out the distance from cylinder wall to wall. most wear and tear is near the top, the bottom of the cylinder isnt really worn. btw, my cylinder walls still have the hone marks from factory.

 

only if i knew this before i bought my pos block... cranks got polished spots.. ridge is all burnt...
i read that honda doesnt recommend a new hone... sounds stuipid, but i guess you dont have to hone, unless those walls are like a mirror.
does a hone really take THAT much off that i should worry about when putting those pistons in?

if so, anyone gotta bare z6 block with the cross hatch still on the walls and the crank still in round???

 

of course there is gonna be noise!!! your putting a NEW piston in an OLD hole. that is just stupid

 

do they quiet down when the motor warms up? they might be fitted loose do to the expantion rate of the material used. High sylicone pistons will slap when they are cool. I know my arais talk when its cold out when it first starts up.

 

Yes, the vitaras slap, but yes they quiet down, and also theyve been slapping for 14K on my car and it still runs great... so.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by nonvtecD &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Yes, the vitaras slap, but yes they quiet down, and also theyve been slapping for 14K on my car and it still runs great... so.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Now go back in and put some rods into that motor

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by H23 EG Hybrid &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Does it matter the pistons sit considerably lower in the block than the stock pistons? My friend was tellin me that some people were saying they had nics at the top where the pistons stop...anyone else hear of this?</TD></TR></TABLE>

called a ring ridge. that lip at the top of the cylinder was made by the rings. you would need a ridge reemer to cut that out. but i have never seen a honda engine with a ridge big enough to take a seperate tool to smooth them out. my 77 accord has 475,000 miles on it. and the motor has been rebuilt 70,000 miles ago. and there wasnt a ridge in it at all. and my first accord motor i built for my 88, it was the same.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Importordomestic &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">called a ring ridge. that lip at the top of the cylinder was made by the rings. you would need a ridge reemer to cut that out. but i have never seen a honda engine with a ridge big enough to take a seperate tool to smooth them out. my 77 accord has 475,000 miles on it. and the motor has been rebuilt 70,000 miles ago. and there wasnt a ridge in it at all. and my first accord motor i built for my 88, it was the same.</TD></TR></TABLE>

The z6 motor I rebuilt for my Vitaras required the ridge removed, it was quite large.

 

I hearing the same thing! i have a d16z6 with the vitara pistons and fjd custom lenght i beam rods and acl race bearings, i have a goautoworks turbo kit on it and the motor makes kinda a knock sound when u let off the throttle..is this ture should i be consurend also?

 

there are .20 over vitaras also, only need to bore to 75.5mm i think NPR (nippon) makes them

 

head n 808... look at the dates on these posts. This is old info. It was thought that wall clearance was the reason for the noise. It's not. It's the offset of the wristpins. The vitara spins clockwise. D's spin counter clockwise. If you point the arrows on your vitaras at the timing belt in a d they will make noise. If you point them at the flywheel there will be less noise.

They work both ways though. Mine are installed incorrectly the car runs good, it just makes noise.

also ycp makes a 75.5 fjt sells them on his page...

 

he is correct.. i just put together a 75.5mm vitara engine with arrows facing the flywheel and piston to wall at around 3 and it sounds just like a stock z6 would.

 

lol, i just saw the date on the post before mine

 

Mine are the same in my Z6, Every morning i start the car it sounds like its going to rattle its self to death, but nothing i havent heard from vitaras before, after they warm up there is still a tick enough to hear and i think its funny when i pull up to work the other day and my co-worker said to me,, "Man you need to fix your car, its ticking pretty bad." then i had to try and explain the build on the motor... That was fun..
Anyway, its normal and my motor is very strong and i dont care if it has some noise if im kickin a**, motor built with acl bearings, eagle rods, vitara pistons and rings, fererra valves and springs, apr head studs... Build can withhold up to 400 horse.. Cant wait to get turbo ;-) Going just with a t28 garret turbo w/internal wastegate, already have custom headers and downpipe and intercooler kit ready to go, Greddy blow off ect... car will be run daily 8-10 psi and track 16-19 psi...