jeffk182

Well, I have never gone road racing, but am going to start going very soon. Rite now, I am at a fork in the road. My question is, has anyone ran a turbo civic while road racing? I can get a greddy turbo kit for extremely cheap, but some of my friends say that i'll end up blowing my engine if I road race with it. If I do end up going turbo, what would be some things I would want to invest in so I dont destroy my motor? My motor is a B16a2. Any insight would be very helpful. Thanks.

BoOstedEM1

Road racing..umm highway runs or circuit track road racing.???

Sinkos

i'd like to know that myself im plannin on going turbo with my 2000 si but i want speed like circuit braking turning fast stop slow speed slow speed maybe i should just go n/a

HiProfile

The reason they say you'll blow your motor is because you very well might. If you're too overzelous, you'll be baking your pistons with constant boost & high rpm's. I can't recall the guy (was recent, yellow eg coupe), he ran with boost and came out on top (beat a sti or evo), but that was a built/sleeved d-series. Power is what wins on ovals & large, straight tracks, otherwise its driving ability.

The thing you'll want is excellent cooling. You'll also want the smaller turbo and not much boost on a stock motor.

Full-Race Geoff

we are releasing a road-race specific turbo kit for the B series motors. If the kit is properly tuned you will NOT blow your motor.

if you have any questions just pm me

Andrea

Here is a link to a thread from last year about a turbo Civic that was taken to the track for road racing: https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=1011304.

As Geoff said, if tuned properly you will not blow the motor. You need to be certain, though, that your cooling system is efficient enough as underhood temps become extremely high when road racing.

turbosi03

also don't forget about keeping oil where it should be. a moroso oil pan or something with the proper baffles so oil doesnt slush to one side starving components of oil...

that and cooling I would think is top priority

jeffk182

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Andrea &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Here is a link to a thread from last year about a turbo Civic that was taken to the track for road racing: https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=1011304.

As Geoff said, if tuned properly you will not blow the motor. You need to be certain, though, that your cooling system is efficient enough as underhood temps become extremely high when road racing. </TD></TR></TABLE>

What would you consider to be an efficient cooling system? Intercooler, Oil cooler, upgraded radiator?

Nautical_Star

I think an all-motor setup would be best for road racing...

jeffk182

gahhhh, so many different opinions. Very tough decision.

AbitAvenger

if you keep cooling, oil, and a good tune in mind, then you shouldnt have any problems

rmcdaniels

I road-raced my turbo B16A2 in my '99 Civic Si just fine. Non-linear throttle response sucks on a tight course, but that's just the nature of a turbo, and it's not as bad as autocrossing it. The biggest thing for me was a better radiator, the stock dual-core half-width wouldn't even keep it cool for one lap, but I was also making 408 WHP. A Fluidyne half-width completely corrected the problem, with it I could run it as hard as I felt like and the temp stayed rock steady. I also had a water-cooled turbo, not sure how critical that was, but you will absolutely be giving your motor and turbo a serious workout, so I don't think it can hurt. A brake upgrade is important too, as you will be attaining some serious speeds (I hit 150+ at Roebling Road) and hauling yourself down from 100+ can destroy the stock brakes quickly if you late brake at all (and you <U>will</U> want to brake late). You may also want to invest in an oil cooler.

Just make sure it is well-tuned and keep it cool and you should be fine. If you notice any problems with it or of it starts heating up, then slow down and pit it, because you don't want to be running it on a road course unless everything is just right. So put some fresh oil in it, fresh coolant, and new (preferably track-oriented) brake pads, and go tear it up. Nothing's quite as fun as coming around the last turn with a Viper coming up behind you and then leaving him in the straight in your Civic

Full-Race Geoff

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by rmcdaniels &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Just make sure it is well-tuned and keep it cool
</TD></TR></TABLE>

full agreement

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by rmcdaniels &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Non-linear throttle response sucks </TD></TR></TABLE>

i agree with this too

our kit is not a 400 whp kit buyt will max out around 360whp.

http://www.full-race.com/catal...d=844

full width radiator is the way to go for a road race app

jeffk182

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by rmcdaniels &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I road-raced my turbo B16A2 in my '99 Civic Si just fine. Non-linear throttle response sucks on a tight course, but that's just the nature of a turbo, and it's not as bad as autocrossing it. The biggest thing for me was a better radiator, the stock dual-core half-width wouldn't even keep it cool for one lap, but I was also making 408 WHP. A Fluidyne half-width completely corrected the problem, with it I could run it as hard as I felt like and the temp stayed rock steady. I also had a water-cooled turbo, not sure how critical that was, but you will absolutely be giving your motor and turbo a serious workout, so I don't think it can hurt. A brake upgrade is important too, as you will be attaining some serious speeds (I hit 150+ at Roebling Road) and hauling yourself down from 100+ can destroy the stock brakes quickly if you late brake at all (and you <U>will</U> want to brake late). You may also want to invest in an oil cooler.

Just make sure it is well-tuned and keep it cool and you should be fine. If you notice any problems with it or of it starts heating up, then slow down and pit it, because you don't want to be running it on a road course unless everything is just right. So put some fresh oil in it, fresh coolant, and new (preferably track-oriented) brake pads, and go tear it up. Nothing's quite as fun as coming around the last turn with a Viper coming up behind you and then leaving him in the straight in your Civic
</TD></TR></TABLE>

Thank you very much for all ur info, I shall keep all this in mind

rmcdaniels

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Full-Race Geoff &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

full agreement

i agree with this too

our kit is not a 400 whp kit buyt will max out around 360whp.

http://www.full-race.com/catal...d=844

full width radiator is the way to go for a road race app</TD></TR></TABLE>

Nice kit, that GT28RS is my favorite street turbo by far, it spools up so fast it's ridiculous, great throttle response for a turbo too. I used to have one and made 380 with it by some miracle (and a lot of JDogg tuning), the 408 was made with a GT3071R. Eventually I built a dual-sequential SC/turbo setup and that worked pretty well, plus it had very linear torque delivery, great for autox and tight road courses.

Full-Race Geoff

which blower and turbo setup did you use? im not really a fan of compound charging, although i know it definately works

rmcdaniels

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Full-Race Geoff &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">which blower and turbo setup did you use? im not really a fan of compound charging, although i know it definately works</TD></TR></TABLE>

It's actually a true sequential setup, we ran it at some autocrosses and it won street-mod every time with a good driver, at one event it beat every other car on the field (in all classes), pretty amazing when you can come out of an element faster than a modified STI! Currently it's been transferred from my DD to a dedicated track car for further development and testing. It went to the Tire Rack nationals, but the tires delaminated, so it placed mid-field, tough to do well when your contact patch is sliding around. Here's a thread I made about the initial setup:

https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=1293497

Chunty Butt Kevin

haha get a anti lag kit

rmcdaniels

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Chunty Butt Kevin &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">haha get a anti lag kit</TD></TR></TABLE>

Typically that dumps unburnt fuel into the exhaust manifold to spool the turbo with no load, and I already have one. It's marginally useful for drag racing, but not applicable to road course racing.

jeffk182

Hrmm, im looking into the fluidyne radiator and either the greddy or jackson racing oil cooler..prices arent too bad..can get the radiator and oil cooler for around 600$, but that should be a very good upgrade.

redzcstandardhatch

i have done about 300 on-track HARD miles on my stock d16a6 engine in my 90 civic. this year...i did about 65 last year (one track day). its a T3 based turbo kit i put together, basically with the intent to HPDE/track day the crap out of it.

i am using a water cooler .42/.48 turbo, a simple DRAG manifold/deltagate setup, running 6 psi (creeps to 8) at gingerman raceway.

stock, good shape full length radiator for the EF cooled it well. running a speaco intercooler and a homemade large-capacity oil cooler setup.

its a LOT of fun at gingerman (decently long straights, mostly faster turns.)

it would benifit GREATLY from an LSD, as in most turns, i'm staying at or near full boost as soon as i come out of the turn. it become ONE WHEEL PEEL TIME really quick.

tune very conservatively if you plan to run a turbo honda at a roadcourse...and turn down the boost a bit from your highest amount, its just sound advice i think.

jeffk182

hrmmm, ok. Cuz the greddy kit runs at like 5.7 PSI stock w/o intercooler, but with the intercooler, it runs higher, but im probably gonna set peak boost to like 5psi or soemthing.

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by jeffk182 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">hrmmm, ok. Cuz the greddy kit runs at like 5.7 PSI stock w/o intercooler, but with the intercooler, it runs higher, but im probably gonna set peak boost to like 5psi or soemthing.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Not needed. Remember that an intercooler creates a pressure drop in the system so that it allows for a bit more boost. Using the right components to cool the engine, lubricants, and parts is essential in road racing.

I currently road race my Turbo integra B18C, and made sure that I used the right tuning for it. High hp is not the key by any means to road race effectively. It is with the tuning, response of the turbo used in its power band, and the use of the right equipment, such as brakes, pads, etc. Using stock or "street" pads even aftermarket could spell disaster after only a few hard laps. I currently use an Oil cooler, Mugen baffled pan, and redline water wetter to make sure things are cool to their maximum. Check the oil levels after each run, and BRING EXTRA OIL and Fluids. Make sure that the brake fluid is of a high enough boiling temperature to ensure good braking, and change the brake lines to stainless. Again, it's not the power, but the supplemental items that are important.

I'm currently running an GE HD sleeved B18C1 block w/ 9.0:1 Pistons, and Type R Cams, but changed compression w/ a new head to 9.8:1 for more initial response and less dependency on the turbo. The turbo is an HKS GT3037 using Cobalt Spec VR race brakes, Motul Brake fluid and Kumho R compounds for race conditions only. The suspension will be changed from Tein SS to either the buddy Club or Omni Power suspension due to the higher spring rates that are required with the additional front distributed weight. (10K front, 8K rear) I also used a KAAZ Clutch-type LSD as opposed to a Quaife, because I need to use 100% locking for road course use. I also upgraded the axles, because unlike the quaife, the KAAZ LSD is very hard on the axle hubs. I'm also using 850cc injectors w/ Power FC, and I think it is heaven on the track.....

Maintainence, Maintainence, Maintainence.. And don't fall for that "BIG" turbo crap, either.. You want response and usability, not peak power.

Full-Race Geoff

i am building a stock motor d series hatch with a 28rs to road race with, no need for b series