Turbo Selection Options: B16/Spoon Cross-mission Trans for Flat Torqueband
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Turbo Selection Options: B16/Spoon Cross-mission Trans for Flat Torqueband
I see some dyno graphs out there that show the torque cure coming in earlier and remaining falter through out the rmp range.
I assume this makes the car more predictable but has is it achieved?
Mine seems to just go up
I assume this makes the car more predictable but has is it achieved?
Mine seems to just go up
#2
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re: Turbo Selection Options: B16/Spoon Cross-mission Trans for Flat Torqueband
B16 (low displacement), turbos to large for the application, stock b16 cams and your altitude probably all playing a roll here.
#4
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re: Turbo Selection Options: B16/Spoon Cross-mission Trans for Flat Torqueband
Im curious why you stopped at what looks like 7500 rpm? That motor should do 8200-8600 no problem.
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re: Turbo Selection Options: B16/Spoon Cross-mission Trans for Flat Torqueband
i didn't... the tuner did and its not very helpful as you can see... some excuse of not waintitng to take the engine that high. I would kind of like to know how the engine behaves up there! I go to 9k all the time!
I am not having much luck finding a tuner. I need some one who can actually tune... not just create as much power as possible.
I am not having much luck finding a tuner. I need some one who can actually tune... not just create as much power as possible.
#6
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re: Turbo Selection Options: B16/Spoon Cross-mission Trans for Flat Torqueband
I wasn't aware of it till lightning brought it up, but you should hit up Drob and have him etune it.
Imw has by far some of the highest quality tunes and builds out there, and I've seen a ton.
Imw has by far some of the highest quality tunes and builds out there, and I've seen a ton.
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re: Turbo Selection Options: B16/Spoon Cross-mission Trans for Flat Torqueband
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#8
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re: Turbo Selection Options: B16/Spoon Cross-mission Trans for Flat Torqueband
He's the (owner?) of Innovative motorworks, and is on the forums time to time usually showing off crazy builds. The shop's located in PA, but apparently he does etunes as well (not sure what limitations etc)
E tunes are pretty much done through sending datalogs, build components etc to the tuner who works with you over time to get the tune just right, without you having to actually bring it to their dyno. They modify the ignition/fuel maps etc and revise them with the data you gather for them, sent online.
Worst case scenario learn how to tune yourself :D
I haven't dabbled too much with maps yet, but I can tell you from the research and reading I've done that it isn't too difficult to get a grasp on. Lightning teg actually was the one who inspired me to learn myself, and recommended a great book that's helped me a lot. There's also plenty of info online .
E tunes are pretty much done through sending datalogs, build components etc to the tuner who works with you over time to get the tune just right, without you having to actually bring it to their dyno. They modify the ignition/fuel maps etc and revise them with the data you gather for them, sent online.
Worst case scenario learn how to tune yourself :D
I haven't dabbled too much with maps yet, but I can tell you from the research and reading I've done that it isn't too difficult to get a grasp on. Lightning teg actually was the one who inspired me to learn myself, and recommended a great book that's helped me a lot. There's also plenty of info online .
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re: Turbo Selection Options: B16/Spoon Cross-mission Trans for Flat Torqueband
i am going to head up to the tuning shop tomorrow and do a baseline pull to 9k to see what the car is actually doing.
#10
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#11
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re: Turbo Selection Options: B16/Spoon Cross-mission Trans for Flat Torqueband
for your subject I think you need more displacement/stroke for earlier/flatter torque. Glad LSjoker posted his dyno up, check it against mine (similar HP levels and similar size turbo).....
Not bashing anyone or even bashing b16's but they do have different characteristics, b16s seem to love to rev high due to the shorter stroke and thats where they make their power
@LSTURBO ever decide what motor you will use for your next build? an overbored b16 sounds pretty sweet
B18c, Ramhorn setup @17 PSI
Not bashing anyone or even bashing b16's but they do have different characteristics, b16s seem to love to rev high due to the shorter stroke and thats where they make their power
@LSTURBO ever decide what motor you will use for your next build? an overbored b16 sounds pretty sweet
B18c, Ramhorn setup @17 PSI
Last edited by 2kdrift; 05-27-2016 at 04:29 PM.
#12
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re: Turbo Selection Options: B16/Spoon Cross-mission Trans for Flat Torqueband
Yeah an 84mm b16 or a b20vtec build is up in the air. Cams, a bigger exhaust, even boring it out is only gona do so much. A 84mm b16 will have the midrange of a gsr, give or take a few RPMs.
If its built good. Dont be afraid to rev them
If its built good. Dont be afraid to rev them
#13
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re: Turbo Selection Options: B16/Spoon Cross-mission Trans for Flat Torqueband
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re: Turbo Selection Options: B16/Spoon Cross-mission Trans for Flat Torqueband
Just throw a piston & rod ls block in there. Simple, cheap, and you'll get the torque your after.
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re: Turbo Selection Options: B16/Spoon Cross-mission Trans for Flat Torqueband
Off topic but shodan I'll be talking to you about a turbo for my next build in the near future. Something with good mid range for a GSR or ls/vtec for a fun street car, but we can keep that to pms and not clutter this thread. Just a heads up.
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re: Turbo Selection Options: B16/Spoon Cross-mission Trans for Flat Torqueband
for your subject I think you need more displacement/stroke for earlier/flatter torque. Glad LSjoker posted his dyno up, check it against mine (similar HP levels and similar size turbo).....
Not bashing anyone or even bashing b16's but they do have different characteristics, b16s seem to love to rev high due to the shorter stroke and thats where they make their power
@LSTURBO ever decide what motor you will use for your next build? an overbored b16 sounds pretty sweet
Not bashing anyone or even bashing b16's but they do have different characteristics, b16s seem to love to rev high due to the shorter stroke and thats where they make their power
@LSTURBO ever decide what motor you will use for your next build? an overbored b16 sounds pretty sweet
Turbo? Block? Build?
#19
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re: Turbo Selection Options: B16/Spoon Cross-mission Trans for Flat Torqueband
If you still have b16 cams. Thats your best and prolly cheapest start. Some ITRs or ITR "like" cams will help alot.
B16s have their purpose. And for a light chassis like what you have, i have no doubts.
#20
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re: Turbo Selection Options: B16/Spoon Cross-mission Trans for Flat Torqueband
81.5mm b18c1, typr head, type r cams
skunk2 ultra IM
go autoworks ram horn turbo kit
Bullseye batmowheel b252 turbo @17 psi (52mm compressor - supposed to be between a gt3071 and gt3076)
ITR LSD trans 98+ with exedy lightened flywheel and stage 2 clutch
honestly its alot of torque to deal with...really had to play with my BBG to get traction in 1st-3rd. As it sits I have good traction in all gears using federal RSR tires and a 5.5LB spring
agreed, if the road allows for it (IE dragstrip) theres no reason to ever be below 7k after first gear
Last edited by 2kdrift; 05-27-2016 at 04:33 PM.
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re: Turbo Selection Options: B16/Spoon Cross-mission Trans for Flat Torqueband
i didn't... the tuner did and its not very helpful as you can see... some excuse of not waintitng to take the engine that high. I would kind of like to know how the engine behaves up there! I go to 9k all the time!
I am not having much luck finding a tuner. I need some one who can actually tune... not just create as much power as possible.
I am not having much luck finding a tuner. I need some one who can actually tune... not just create as much power as possible.
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re: Turbo Selection Options: B16/Spoon Cross-mission Trans for Flat Torqueband
I have gsr cams. Not sure if the ls tranny is also causing low torque. Seems that I have to force my self to use 5th gear in this thing.
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re: Turbo Selection Options: B16/Spoon Cross-mission Trans for Flat Torqueband
B16 9.4 compression
Spoolin log mani (only thing that fits)
I have a stock flywheel and intake with an ls tranny. Not sure if those make a huge difference. I am also not sure how different our turbos are.
I generally won't suffer the same traction issues with my set up (suspension, etc) as a civic would but I am sure it would be a lot for sure.
I was able to tweek some things and put the air filter right outside the chassis so that may help.
#24
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Torque curve that is earlier flatter
No wonder your car feels slow. You have an LS transmission. That is one of the worst Transmissions that you could ever have to have any type of reasonable acceleration rates.
There's an easy remedy for that without having to change to a different transmission if you don't want to, and that is to change the final drive of the LS transmission to a 4.785 from M factory.
That will change almost everything when it comes to having reliable amount of torque.
I never knew all this time and you had an LS transmission. If you got rid of that, and either use what I suggested, or get a GSR transmission, the entire car will feel completely different due to the torque multiplier of the gearing of a GSR transmission.
The turbocharger that you have is much more responsive than the BW 252. Both on the turbine wheel and compressor wheel side.
There's an easy remedy for that without having to change to a different transmission if you don't want to, and that is to change the final drive of the LS transmission to a 4.785 from M factory.
That will change almost everything when it comes to having reliable amount of torque.
I never knew all this time and you had an LS transmission. If you got rid of that, and either use what I suggested, or get a GSR transmission, the entire car will feel completely different due to the torque multiplier of the gearing of a GSR transmission.
The turbocharger that you have is much more responsive than the BW 252. Both on the turbine wheel and compressor wheel side.
Last edited by TheShodan; 05-27-2016 at 10:48 PM.
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re: Turbo Selection Options: B16/Spoon Cross-mission Trans for Flat Torqueband
Yep, the state trooper took my gsr tranny when I went to go get my vin because it was missing the serial #. The ls was the only one I could get in a short time.